Historical Rome Total War 1.0 (HRTW) [WIP]

[Gandalfus]

sacred band of Baal - hoplites
Sacred band of Astarte- cavalry
They used phalangites but not sacred band . They used African pikemen for phalangites.

[Asgaroth]

They used phalangites but not sacred band

Correct.

Astarte

What is this god ?

They used African pikemen for phalangites.

Yes, Liby-Phoenician phalangites.

[Gandalfus]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astarte

[tianzong]

I don't think you should believe wikipedia (even not the english version) if i were you.

[Gandalfus]

Why does everyone doubt Wikipedia just because someone finds a few tiny errors? It's a bit ridiculous.

[hameleona]

If i have to be honest, there is no "Sacred band" in that time. But there is no real way to remove the tradition, so there was some sort of elite troops. Probably didn't inherited the name, couse of "bad luck" or something (the same way, the romans didn't really replaced a destroyed legion).

They are phalangites, couse Asgaroth does not like the overhead animation

There is no real reason to conclude, that there wore even a hoplite-like unit in carthages army at the time. As far as we are concerned, the "Poeni Swordsmen" could be the "Sacred Band" analog in the roster. So... well, i don't really care that much. I like the game-play options, that such an unit opens, and that is enough for me

[Gandalfus]

The sacred band hadn't been destroyed yet, they were destroyed in the first Punic war. They were restored in the second Punic war by hannibal.

[ahowl11]

I thought the Sacred Band was destroyed when Carthage was at war with Syracuse in the 4th century BC?

[Gandalfus]

Im pretty sure it was restored after that... But it has been destroyed and reformed quite a few times...
They were destroyed, but infantry levied straight from Carthaginian citizens and with similar equipment were used in the first Punic war, mercenary war and third Punic war, with Hannibal restoring them in the second Punic war.

[debux]

The new units look really good! I'd just make a few name changes, such as the "Poeni Swordsmen" to "African Infantry/Swordsmen", while I'd change the "Carthaginian Peltasts" units... maybe even separate it into two units. A cheaper unit that's more accustomed to the African terrain like "Lybian Skirmishers" (with traits suchs as heat fatigue resistance, good stamina and fast moving) and having a unit called "Poeni Marines", which would be a hybrid between peltasts and light infantry, almost like a slightly more heavily armored skirmisher unit that can even do an average job as light infantry (albeit being more expensive, slower moving, and harder to train, requiring maybe a high tier port to build). That way Carthage would have to either choose between cheap, light and easily replaceable skirmishers, or professional, heavier but more expensive and harder to get in high numbers light infantry (that can skirmish).

Oh, and I'd also go for making phalangites a later evolution of the carthaginian army... maybe they could get those "Poeni Phalangites" with the roman Marian Reforms, whereas the Sacred Band could use the underhand spear animation. Oh, and also give a more original and non-vanilla names to the Round- and Longshield cavalry units .

Aside of those few fusseries I have with the Carthaginian army, I can't wait to see them bring down those Romans, like wheat before a scythe!

EDIT: oh, and in topic, I believe the Sacred Band was officially dissolved (if there were any survivors at all) after Himera, but it's quite possible that it might have been unoficially restored (under a different name, but I believe that there are no sources at all that can confirm this. But due to the Carthagianan lifestyle, it's hard to believe that it would not have an elite citizen component in the army composed of the richer families (like the Epilektoi in greek cities)

[Gandalfus]

Yes. As I said before soldiers with similar equipment comprised of natives to Carthage fought after the dissolution, and Hannibal officially restoring them widened there numbers before they were dissolved again.

[Spike]

They are phalangites, couse Asgaroth does not like the overhead animation

lol at this then this mod is barely historical afterall

[hameleona]

lol at this then this mod is barely historical afterall

Prove me that the overhead thrust is historical for that time. Or that it looks realistic in an animation pack
And then i may agree with you.

[Gandalfus]

It actually does. Play EB or Rs2 woth hoplites and look.

[Asgaroth]

lol at this then this mod is barely historical afterall

Before commenting anything please do read the previous posts.

Ahowl started it as historical,but I said I was thinking of changing the name,but that is last what we will do.


So-this mod is a balance between gameplay and historical accuracy,so there will be an option to choose whatever you like : Overhead and underhead.

The hoplites fought overhead and underhead depending on the situation they were in but since the engine of the game can't make both animations the mods prefere the overhead animations to better express the historical accuracy. And I am aware that they used both,but I prefer the underhand and that is all.

There will be an option to choose.

[Edorix]

I have started work on a few British units. Here are some slingers!

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

They are intended for a new version of my old Britons minimod-pack, but it was always agreed under ahowl that it would be the main source of the Britons in HRTW as well. You may use them if you wish.

[Spike]

alien slingers they are blue-skinned.... :o

[Primo]

with green ears.

[Primo]

... with green ears.

Edit: Sorry for double post.

[Edorix]

It's body-paint. Like my avatar.

Caesar (Commentaries on the Gallic War V:14):
"Indeed, all the Britons stain themselves with glass, which produces a greeny-blue colour."

Pliny (Natural History XXII:2):
"Among the Dacians and Sarmatians, even the men tattoo their bodies. There is a plant similar to the plantain, which is called "glastum" in Gaul, which the wives and daughters of the Britons proceed naked during certain sacred festivals their entire bodies smeared withal, resembling the colour of Ethiopians."

Gerald of Wales (Description of Wales I:11)
"Julius also adds, that the Britons, previous to an engagement, anointed their faces with a nitrous ointment, which gave them so ghastly and shining an appearance, that the enemy could scarcely bear to look at them, particularly if the rays of the sun were reflected on them."

It's only the Britons of the Far North for whom we have evidence of tattooing in patterns (Herodian, History III:14:7).