knights templar

[jackwei]

Do you think the Knights Templar event will be an important event in Medieval total war II and be a temporary nation for a certain time?

[The True Roman]

it would if I new what you were talkikng about

[jackwei]

it would if I new what you were talkikng about

Don't you know about the knights of the templar in the holyland at the times of the crusaders?

[The True Roman]

Don't you know about the knights of the templar in the holyland at the times of the crusaders?

I dont no much about European history after Rome and Befor The American Revolution. Middel ages never intreast me as much as Rome and they dont teach much of the middle ages in NY public schools.

[jackwei]

Just say they played a massive part in the crusades and were very vital indeed too have u heard about the da vinci code? anywayi am quite sure this event will play a major part and they contributed into prehaps the battle that lost the holy for good against saladin.

[John I Tzimisces]

Just say they played a massive part in the crusades and were very vital indeed too have u heard about the da vinci code? anywayi am quite sure this event will play a major part and they contributed into prehaps the battle that lost the holy for good against saladin.

Ah Da Vinci Code Do not use the Da Vinci Code as a historical source, lol.

The Templars were not independent like a kingdom was, in that sense. By the time of their destruction they weren't as major a player, kicked out of the middle east and everything.
Perhaps, though, if a crusade to the holy land succeeds, it can trigger an event for banking or somesuch, since that is a pretty major thing the templars did.

[drak10687]

well, I dont think there will be any temporary nations since there are no eras so there would be no point wasting a faction slot for a faction that will only be around for a short period of time. Though maybe they will somhowe impelement this 'event' , though I dont realy know what this 'event' exactly is either

[MasterAdnin]

They're probably going to be like the reforms in RTW, except they're going to be under the popes command, and be very expensive. I think.

Adnan

[{nF}remix]

I personally can't wait to see Templar Knights riding down Eagle Warriors in the Jungles of Mexico...that should be a sight to see lol..

[mark0701]

I do not think they should play a major part in MTW2 as they were limited both in time and geographic location (not to mention numbers).

The only way i can see them and the other military orders playing a major role is if CA release an expansion pack based on the holy lands (a bit like MTW:VI with a small focused map).

If any of the Military orders are to be included in vanilla MTW2, then it should be the Order of St John as at least they existed for most of the time period which the game covers.

[Swe_gamer]

They might include them the same way they did in MTW as a unit that was recuited only during crusades although I hope they are better this time around as they more or less sucked in MTW.

[mark0701]

They might include them the same way they did in MTW as a unit that was recuited only during crusades although I hope they are better this time around as they more or less sucked in MTW.

They were slightly better than the knights which could be recruited in the early period and had better morale which historically is about right.

I'm yet to read anything (which can be supported) that suggests they were anything other than better than average knights who benefitted from slightly better arms, armour and mounts. To hear some people talk, you'd think they were demi-gods!

[Ringeck]

They certainly were not demi-gods, but unlike many of their secular colleagues the Templars left behind a Rule and some other documentation on disciplinary matters (which was adapted by the Teutonic Knights) and a solid image as "Warriors of Christ" that would echo down the ages (in positive and, recently, negative connotations). There exist plenty of documentation of accounts of the training and methods of imposing discipline used by secular milites, but the Rule (which was, in its different variations, an evolving document) is one of the few documents from as early as the 12th century that minutely deals with issues of organization and discipline.This, alongside a (largerly false) image of the milites of the entire middle ages as undisciplined rabble, has cemented their reputation as something special in medieval history. The fighting strength of the different orders, and the geographical focus they eventually found (excluding the Templars, who found dissolution and persecution after the expulsion of christian states from the Levant, which was their focus until their destruction) varies from period to period and order to order. The military orders were definitely, in their active periods, feared by their opponents; the Teutonic Order kept a fearsome and deserved military reputation well into the 15th century, as did the Knights of St. John into the 16th and beyond - their defense of Malta in 1565 was, to put it mildly, regarded as a martial feat of grandiose proportions by contemporaries.

[mark0701]

The fighting strength of the different orders, and the geographical focus they eventually found (excluding the Templars, who found dissolution and persecution after the expulsion of christian states from the Levant, which was their focus until their destruction) varies from period to period and order to order. The military orders were definitely, in their active periods, feared by their opponents; the Teutonic Order kept a fearsome and deserved military reputation well into the 15th century, as did the Knights of St. John into the 16th and beyond - their defense of Malta in 1565 was, to put it mildly, regarded as a martial feat of grandiose proportions by contemporaries.

I have read a number of accounts of the Siege of Malta and it still surprises me to this day that they held out (though some credit belongs to the soliders who stood beside them). Just as the Templar's last stand at Acre (though unsuccessful) shows what they were made of.

The problem both orders had is that there were never more than a handful of them at anyone time. How do you model that into something like MTW2? I think they nearly got it right in MTW, but that the order units should have developed just as the knights produced by the factions did. That way they would have still been useful in the high and late periods, where as you rightly point out the Orders were still going strong.

Make them better than the other units available to the player at any given point, and available only in very limited numbers and I'll be happy. Having them as a faction so fanboys can churn out whole armies of (tank) knights and i'm sure i won't be alone in not buying the game.

[Space Voyager]

I hope the crusades/jihads won't be simply a cheap source of large ammounts of units but will drain your people if used in excess.

[Slaxx Hatmen]

I hope the crusades/jihads won't be simply a cheap source of large ammounts of units but will drain your people if used in excess.

I agree, they should also cause major unrest if your King has been away on crusade to long which thus leads to a rebellion or even civil war! This happend many times during the middle ages when a king went on a crusade, examples are Richard the Lionheart and Louis(III?) of France.

[Ringeck]

(though some credit belongs to the soliders who stood beside them).

This, of course, also applies to the men-at-arms, turcopoles, native auxiliaries in the baltic, visiting crusaders fighting with the orders (as on the many Teutonic order Reysen) and so on and so forth.

[Eric]

Personally I think that Templars, Hospitallers and so on and so forth should be units recruitable by the Catholic factions if the First Crusade is successful in the game. The Templars will be available until the year they were destroyed by the King of France. Unless you are the King of France, in which case you get the choice to destroy them or not. I think that'd be a cool feature. And if you're the King of another country, you get the chance to either vouch for the Templar's innocence or support the French King in his persecutions. I think that'd be an interesting feature that would tie the game into real history quite nicely.

[mark0701]

Personally I think that Templars, Hospitallers and so on and so forth should be units recruitable by the Catholic factions if the First Crusade is successful in the game. The Templars will be available until the year they were destroyed by the King of France. Unless you are the King of France, in which case you get the choice to destroy them or not. I think that'd be a cool feature. And if you're the King of another country, you get the chance to either vouch for the Templar's innocence or support the French King in his persecutions. I think that'd be an interesting feature that would tie the game into real history quite nicely.

That does sound interesting. How would you keep the balance (presuming they will be quite powerful units?). Long build time? High cost?

I'd like to see an extension of the population idea from RTW so that it is split into different social classes. That way you'd be limited in the number of knights, men at arms etc you could recruit which would help with balance. Maybe there could be a seperate pool for the Military orders which would depend on the number of religious buildings you owned.

[Darkragnar]

After looking how thoese French Swordsmen looked , i cant wait to see the Knight's Templars, and another thing i cant wait is for some one to release a mod makeing them playable if every they are included.