More Islamic attempts to hamper your freedom

[Ummon]

Islamic States Press for Limits on Free Expression
By Patrick Goodenough

Apr 23, 2006

(CNSNews.com) - Islamic groups and governments are pressing ahead with a campaign to have international organizations take steps, including legal ones, to provide protection for their religion in the wake of the Mohammed cartoon controversy.

In a drive pursued largely away from the headlines, the Organization for the Islamic Conference (OIC) is promoting the issue at the United Nations and European Union, and having some success.

The executive council of the U.N. Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organization (UNESCO) this month approved an agenda item entitled "respect for freedom of expression, sacred beliefs, values and religious and cultural symbols."

Introduced by more than 30 Islamic states and the subject of considerable debate, the motion explicitly tied freedom of expression to " respect for cultural diversity, religious beliefs and religious symbols."

It also directed UNESCO's director-general to carry out a "comprehensive study of all existing relevant international instruments."

The motion did not refer directly to the furor over the publication of cartoons satirizing Mohammed, although an "explanatory note" offered by the OIC members did.

The publication of caricatures of the Prophet of Islam has caused deep and widespread
offense and indignation within the Muslim community around the world," the note said, adding that respect for religious symbols and beliefs and freedom of expression were "indissociable."

"Given the importance of religion to peoples and to dignity and the way of life in different cultures, respect for different religious beliefs is essential to international peace and security and to the progress of human civilizations," it said.

The Saudi-based OIC secretariat is spearheading the international campaign of response to what it has called "wanton provocation and reckless, blasphemous libertarianism cowering behind so-called freedom of the press."

European newspapers that reproduced 12 cartoons first published in a Danish daily last fall said they were doing so in defense of free expression. Muslims around the world protested, some violently, calling the depictions of their prophet blasphemous.

The UNESCO move is just the latest illustration of the way the OIC and its 56 member states are using the cartoon episode to apply pressure on the West to comply with Islamic norms.

"OIC efforts at the international level to tackle the repercussions of the caricature crisis and to meet the expectations of the Muslim world continue," it said in a recent statement.

The matter was being taken up in exchanges with the E.U., " as well as with various international and regional intergovernmental organizations and NGOs."

The OIC said it was pursuing a "strategy to take initiatives at various international organs to contribute to the formation of an international legal framework" aimed at preventing a recurrence of the cartoon crisis. The action at UNESCO was a component of this strategy.

At an OIC meeting in Istanbul this month, OIC secretary-general Ekmeleddin Ihsanoglu
urged representatives of Islamic states to approach their counterparts in the West "with the aim of defending the interests of the Muslim world, presenting the true image of Islam and combating the stereotype perceptions about Islam and Muslims."

In an earlier accomplishment, OIC members last February succeeded in pushing through a last-minute amendment to the preamble of a U.N. resolution establishing a new U.N. Human Rights Council

The OIC addition to the text referred to the important role of states, NGOs, religious groups and the media "in promoting tolerance, respect for and freedom of religion and belief" - but made no balancing reference to freedom of speech.

'Support mosque construction'

The Islamic campaign has won sympathetic responses from some senior U.N. and E.U. figures.

"Your anguish over the publication of insulting cartoons of the Prophet Mohammed is clear and understandable," Secretary-General Kofi Annan said in a message read on his behalf at an OIC gathering in Istanbul this month.

While he said all should speak up for freedom of worship and freedom of speech, he added: "We must exercise great sensitivity when dealing with symbols and traditions that are sacred to other people."

(...)

Continues here: http://www.townhall.com/news/ext_wire.html?rowid=46963

[Tom Paine]

So what, we're meant to be disrespectful to other cultures? Given that certain rights are much guaranteed under the UN Declaration... and given that in the UK we have already got such laws in place.... further given that we are expected to respect the beliefs of others.... it seems logical.

[CommanderSela]

your freedom start where the others freedom end

[Carach]

Given that certain rights are much guaranteed under the UN Declaration... and given that in the UK we have already got such laws in place....

lmao.

and look what happens over here in the uk, we have extremists walking down london preaching for the destruction of our country, our way of life, and half the world. We dont arrest them though, we give them a police escort to do so.

Where we cant express anything without being called a racist.

the list goes on...its pathetic.

I dont like places like france, but at least they stick up for their way of life.

[removeduser_426582376423734]

and look what happens over here in the uk, we have extremists walking down london preaching for the destruction of our country, our way of life, and half the world. We dont arrest them though, we give them a police escort to do so.

Please please please please please please no. Come on, so much libel right there, its absurd.

• Which extremists?
• When have these Londoners preached destruction?
• Which of these Londoners want the destruction of half the world?
• Who are these "they" that aren't arrested?

[Tacticalwithdrawal]

Please please please please please please no. Come on, so much libel right there, its absurd.

• Which extremists?
• When have these Londoners preached destruction?
• Which of these Londoners want the destruction of half the world?
• Who are these "they" that aren't arrested?

no, actually he is correct in most of what he said. It was the anti-cartoons march and it was very extreme.

The bit where he is wrong is that the police did arrest people, just a few days after the march. I don't know whether they were prosecuted though.

Though to be balanced, they were really no better or worse than any extremist march (BNP, Anarchist etc), they all kinda blur into each other when they get to that stage.

[Ummon]

Think about how disrespectful we were to poor Hitler and Nazism, which were an expression of German culture, albeit surely not shared by all Germans...

[Tom Paine]

Think about how disrespectful we were to poor Hitler and Nazism, which were an expression of German culture, albeit surely not shared by all Germans...

Ahem. They weren't an expression of German culture, and at that time the UN Declaration wasn't penned or signed. Hm?

[Ummon]

Ahem. They weren't an expression of German culture, and at that time the UN Declaration wasn't penned or signed. Hm?

I suppose that Nazism appeared out of nothingness, that is...

The truth, is that nobody should be able to interfere with your ability to criticize ideas. If this happens, you are already a slave.

[Tom Paine]

I suppose that Nazism appeared out of nothingness, that is...

No, it appeared out of the Depression.

back on topic, if you wnt them to not be insulted you'd better be prepared to let them blast (verbally) and insult our way of life in the West as much as they please, because... well, that's the reciprocal.

[Ummon]

No, it appeared out of the Depression.

back on topic, if you wnt them to not be insulted you'd better be prepared to let them blast (verbally) and insult our way of life in the West as much as they please, because... well, that's the reciprocal.

Please be serious.

I am prepared to let them say whatever they wish. My ideas, are not so weak as to fall to a cartoon (if I don't make death threats to the cartoonist)...

Well, except their freedom to kill you.

There is, obviously, no such thing as freedom to kill.

[Logue]

*shakes head*

Society is circling the pan.

[Ummon]

Exactly, this means that they have absolutely no reason to try to reduce mine, since I don't reduce theirs.

[Ahiga]

Exactly, this means that they have absolutely no reason to try to reduce mine, since I don't reduce theirs.

Well, except their freedom to kill you.

These silly Muslims (Though their limiting of freedom of speech is similiar to our limiting of freedom of marriage for all!). The region seems to be trying to come to grasp with their own sense of modern moralities and concepts, but is missing some of the fundementals.

Respect which comes from forced discipline is not respect. It's a sort of training you would expect of a dog which knows not to go in the trash. It will just hide the feelings and opinions beneath the carpet and leave them to fester and grow in negative ways. Tolerance that is forced seems very Toltalitarian. I think there was an ancient empire that practiced this, but I can't recall which, if there was one. I'm tempted to say Assyria for some reason.

[Sétanta]

I suppose its still fine for people to bash Christians but watch out. You make a threat against Islam (like drawing a picture of Mohammed) you will get death threats and people will try to kill you.

Thats two sided if I don't say so myself

[David Deas]

This is what happens when you use certain freedoms irresponsibly and against their establishment intent like a bunch of disrespectful, bratty children. Those freedoms get taken away, or threatened.

[Ummon]

It shouldn't be allowed to make death threats. It shouldn't be allowed to give freedom to those who deny freedom to others, as well. Infact, here the parallel with Nazism comes in place.

This is what happens when you use certain freedoms irresponsibly and against their establishment intent. They get taken away.

A completely totalitarian statement. I might suggest that since we are speaking of adults, nobody has the right to take away freedoms, nor judge actions which aren't criminal? Besides, the cartoons on Islam were rather mild, and extremely underreporting towards the risks of that religion.

[Tom Paine]

It shouldn't be allowed to make death threats. It shouldn't be allowed to give freedom to those who deny freedom to others, as well. Infact, here the parallel with Nazism comes in place.

So in fact... we should limit freedom of speech in some areas? All freedoms impinge on others, Ummon, its a matter of balancing them.

[Ummon]

So in fact... we should limit freedom of speech in some areas? All freedoms impinge on others, Ummon, its a matter of balancing them.

Again you fail to see the difference between crime (which breaks the freedom of others) and opinion (which doesn't). To repeat an argument which doesn't hold, is a waste, don't you think?

[Tom Paine]

Again you fail to see the difference between crime (which breaks the freedom of others) and opinion (which doesn't). To repeat an argument which doesn't hold, is a waste, don't you think?

All are equal before the law and are entitled without any discrimination to equal protection of the law. All are entitled to equal protection against any discrimination in violation of this Declaration and against any incitement to such discrimination.

No one shall be subjected to arbitrary interference with his privacy, family, home or correspondence, nor to attacks upon his honour and reputation. Everyone has the right to the protection of the law against such interference or attacks.

Everyone has the right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion; this right includes freedom to change his religion or belief, and freedom, either alone or in community with others and in public or private, to manifest his religion or belief in teaching, practice, worship and observance.

Everyone has the right to freedom of opinion and expression; this right includes freedom to hold opinions without interference and to seek, receive and impart information and ideas through any media and regardless of frontiers.

Improssible to uphold them all, I'm afraid, to their full extent.