Was Jesus a communist?

[hunter260859]

ok ive been thinking about this since my ibc class is jesus a communist if you think of it many of his ideas and belifes ad very similar to communist ones so what do you guys think

[Marcus Scaurus]

Jesus a communist? No. The Jewish rabbi didn't had so much blood on his hands. True communists support the oppressive regimes from the present and past: Soviet-Union, Cuba, China, etc.

[Tom Paine]

Um, no, we don't, RB. If I say I'm a Christian does that make me so without me following the ideals of Christianity?

I'd personally say yes, actually. He advocated a lot of communist/socialist ideals.

[Marcus Scaurus]

Um, no, we don't, RB. If I say I'm a Christian does that make me so without me following the ideals of Christianity?

If you're Christian, you want to follow the ideals of Jesus Christ. Ideals like 'love your neighbour' and 'don't lie' are noble, just like the communist ideal. What seperates Christianity and Communism is that a perfect communist/marxist country is an utopia and that most Christian ideals are not. What I'm trying to say is that its possible to live like a follower of Jesus (no premarital sex, no drunkness, etc) but that it is impossible to build up a succesfull communist country.

[Fenris]

What seperates Christianity and Communism is that a perfect communist/marxist country is an utopia and that most Christian ideals are not.

*COUGH*COUGH*

Jesus a communist? No. The Jewish rabbi didn't had so much blood on his hands. True communists support the oppressive regimes from the present and past: Soviet-Union, Cuba, China, etc.

Ha ha ha... like if christianity had not spilled it's share of blood. Of course Jesus has not spilled blood, but did Marx spilled any either? A true communist does not support oppressive regimes, but will follow Marx's idea that a communism should be done democratically.

[removeduser_426582376423734]

Take some cough medicine, mate, you got something there.

If you're Christian, you want to follow the ideals of Jesus Christ. Ideals like 'love your neighbour' and 'don't lie' are noble, just like the communist ideal. What seperates Christianity and Communism is that a perfect communist/marxist country is an utopia and that most Christian ideals are not. What I'm trying to say is that its possible to live like a follower of Jesus (no premarital sex, no drunkness, etc) but that it is impossible to build up a succesfull communist country.

Wouldn't the ideals of "love thy neighbour" and "do not lie" create an utopia? If everyone did this, there would be no problem, nothing wrong, resulting in .... well, an utopia

Ha ha ha... like if christianity had not spilled it's share of blood. Of course Jesus has not spilled blood, but did Marx spilled any either? A true communist does not support oppressive regimes, but will follow Marx's idea that a communism should be done democratically.

Didn't Karl Marx expect a degree of violence? The rising of the Proletariat, the unstable period between the uprising and Communism where many died?

[Fenris]

Didn't Karl Marx expect a degree of violence? The rising of the Proletariat, the unstable period between the uprising and Communism where many died?

He did expect a degree of violence in the case of absolutist powers. But in democracies, there was no violence to be done.

[Freddie]

*COUGH*COUGH*



Ha ha ha... like if christianity had not spilled it's share of blood. Of course Jesus has not spilled blood, but did Marx spilled any either? A true communist does not support oppressive regimes, but will follow Marx's idea that a communism should be done democratically.

Erm no. The idea that communism and democracy can work together is laughable its like saying you can mix electricity and water.

A true commy is prepared to use violence in order to inflict there wicked, cruel and evil believes onto the free. Try to think of Communism as the left wing parallel of Fascism, both are at the extreme ends of the political spectrum and true believers in each of the philosophy have no qualms in killing people in order to achieve their aims. For example how many people did in the Russian revolution?

Many people on these boards who think they are communists are just kidding themselves. Most of them are just socialists who think that having the loudest megaphone make them a commy. Sadly they are misguided.

If you believe that government is all about creating an equal and fair society were the state is there in every part of life (i.e. healthcare, welfare and nationalised industries etc) and you believe governments and people should be freely elected no matter what there political orientation is then you really ought to consider yourself an socialist.

[removeduser_426582376423734]

Freddie, your argument is quite littered with bias. What Fenris said is completely true. Marx didn't want bloodshed in the Communist government, heck, he wanted only peace and a utopia, as did Jesus. His followers, however, had a different view.

[Clibby]

No. Why, because communism sees little value in the individual. Communism focuses on the good of thw whole community even if that means individuals, freedoms, and creativity must be sacrificed for the good of the whole whereas Christ focuses of the individual and his value insted of the community's. Christ does preach helping your neighbor and not being greedy, but that does not mean certain people should not be allowed to be better off; it is what you do with what you have.

[Fenris]

No. Why, because communism sees little value in the individual. Communism focuses on the good of thw whole community even if that means individuals, freedoms, and creativity must be sacrificed for the good of the whole whereas Christ focuses of the individual and his value insted of the community's. Christ does preach helping your neighbor and not being greedy, but that does not mean certain people should not be allowed to be better off; it is what you do with what you have.

So basically, communism is only an institutionalisation and a politisation of Christ's message. I don't see how your justifications leads you to a no, because it does justifies a yes.

[Clibby]

So basically, communism is only an institutionalisation and a politisation of Christ's message. I don't see how your justifications leads you to a no, because it does justifies a yes.

The problems with a communist government in today's world from a Catholic point of view:

1) The Error of Communism (Socialism)

-False idea of human nature as set by Jesus and the Saints
a)no worth of individual except as part of the whole
b)economic class determines man
c)assumes that man is perfectable

2) The Results of theis False View of Man

-at an economic level it just does not produce the goods
-significantly reduces or destroys human freedom and creativity

3)Free Markets work Better

a)They deliver the goods with better quality and more efficiently
b) tends to protect basic human freedoms better
c) Tends to protect creativity better

[stop-3]

'according to the bible, jesus was a communist'. So, communists can ressurect the dead, turn water into wine, proclaim themselves the son of god?

Sure, there's the quote in one of the gospels: 'the meek shall inherit the earth'. I suppose that's a bit commie/socialist in its rabble rousing sense.

[DarkKnight]

'according to the bible, jesus was a communist'. So, communists can ressurect the dead, turn water into wine, proclaim themselves the son of god?

Sure, there's the quote in one of the gospels: 'the meek shall inherit the earth'. I suppose that's a bit commie/socialist in its rabble rousing sense.

:sign_what
I fail to see how you confused the statement that Jesus was a communist with the statement communists are Jesus

@Clibby
Touche

[Fenris]

The problems with a communist government in today's world from a Catholic point of view:

1) The Error of Communism (Socialism)

-False idea of human nature as set by Jesus and the Saints
a)no worth of individual except as part of the whole
b)economic class determines man
c)assumes that man is perfectable

2) The Results of theis False View of Man

-at an economic level it just does not produce the goods
-significantly reduces or destroys human freedom and creativity

3)Free Markets work Better

a)They deliver the goods with better quality and more efficiently
b) tends to protect basic human freedoms better
c) Tends to protect creativity better

The problem with your comparison is that you compare an extremist socialist to a moderate free market. Compare a extremist socialism to an extremist free market, and you'll see things do not turn out in the favor of one or another.

[stop-3]

To say extreme socialism is equal to extreme free market is false. Extreme socialism in effect means a tiny clique of people trying to control everything. Extreme free market is a sort of chaos where anything may happen. Very, very different.

[kid]

Don't post a "communism is this" line unless you've read Karl Marx in all his 3 volume glory. Communism isn't a simple concept. It's layered. And for the record, communism itself does not incite to violence and totalitarianism. Just because all communist countries so far have abused power, says nothing of communist countries in general (and that's false, too. There have been humane communist movements, look up the date of September the 11th, 1973). Darth Wong would back me up! It's a logical fallacy.

[stop-3]

Is this the same Karl Marx who didn't pay his maid a wage and shagged her? There's exploitation for you. Sorry to prick your religion (no I'm not!) but Marx was a very nasty character who wrote some very violent stuff, like letters to others expressing his beleif that whole groups of people should be exterminated.
Communism/socialism is inherently extremly violent in that it is the ultimate power-religion. That is, a very small group (in many cases just one person!) says they know the answer to life's problems and in the name of equality they shall impose there beliefs on the rest of us. Peace and justice they say! Evil persons have been playing this trick for thousands of years but all are vastly nothing to the communists/socialists who are the very best of all in this trickery.

As to the Jesus lark, our own (in 'cool brittania') dear great leader, brair-brain-blair, has declared Jesus a socialist. The self-saying Jesus declaring he was the son of god. There's equality for you!

[DarkKnight]

Is this the same Karl Marx who didn't pay his maid a wage and shagged her? There's exploitation for you. Sorry to prick your religion (no I'm not!) but Marx was a very nasty character who wrote some very violent stuff, like letters to others expressing his beleif that whole groups of people should be exterminated.

That is just an ad hominem. It says nothing about the concept of communism he theorized.

Communism/socialism is inherently extremly violent in that it is the ultimate power-religion. That is, a very small group (in many cases just one person!) says they know the answer to life's problems and in the name of equality they shall impose there beliefs on the rest of us. Peace and justice they say! Evil persons have been playing this trick for thousands of years but all are vastly nothing to the communists/socialists who are the very best of all in this trickery.

I myself don't like communism because it is idealistic and will never work. In all practical communism, it is oppressive and violent. But in a theoretical world that the idea of communism would not be. It would be peaceful, harmonious, and everyone would exist peacefully contributing everything to society. Each person would take equal share in profits. This is the kind of communism being refered to. I think it is pretty close to what Jesus taught. So I say yes, according to the bible Jesus was a communist.

[Sétanta]

Jesus is a commie now? I thought he was the reptilian ancestor of Bush and Osama bin Laden.

*Must keep up with my tabloid reading*