Weird thought about the brain.

[Sumonious]

Hey, I'd like to hear your thought. Should a dead brain be consider:

1) a dead person that missing a body

or

2) a missing organ from a dead person ?

Extra: Are we just a bunch of encased brain moving around in humanoid biological machine?

Edit: The concept of soul or its existence is not a subject of debate here.

[Cúchulainn]

When your brains gone, you're gone.

Your can talk endless to someone, who would listen, about the "soul" but the fact remains.

[Sumonious]

Wait wut? No, this is not a religion thread. I'm an atheist btw.

[Cúchulainn]

Wait wut? No, this is not a religion thread. I'm an atheist btw.

It's the Ethos. It always comes to religion.

And plural "you" not singular, cause someone is going to mention a transcendental aether or whatever it is they call it.

[Sumonious]

O...k...! So what's your thought on the subject matter? Is a dead brain a deceased person or just a pile of dead meat?

[Cúchulainn]

The Brain is the person.

[Sumonious]

The Brain is the person.

That's right. But this is a dead brain. It ceases to have the ability to reason and experience. Should we still consider it a the actual person more than, say, a severed foot? And we don't look at a severed foot the same way we look at a pulsating brain, aren't we?

Also, do you think we are just brain moving around that are covered in different skin?

[Cúchulainn]

That's right. But this is a dead brain. It ceases to have the ability to reason and experience. Should we still consider it a the actual person more than, say, a severed foot? And we don't look at a severed foot the same way we look at a pulsating brain, aren't we?

Also, do you think we are just brain moving around that are covered in different skin?

The foot or any limb is only sensory. It relays information to the brain, specifically to parts of the brain that deal with that sense.

Hence "phantom limbs" the foot is gone yet the lobes of the brain are undamaged.

A loss of a limb is significant only because we have no means to replace it.

I would say that a person is bigger than their brain. But this is just an opinion, not scientific fact.
The act of smiling (even when forced) releases chemicals in the brain that make the person feel good. The experience of ‘feeling good’ occurs in the brain but because the cause of the good feeling started in the smile ‘the self’ extends beyond the brain and into the body. The brain is only the self when it is in the wider context of the body because everything is one whole.
This is why we needed the concept of ‘mind’.
I do not see why it would be necessary to invent souls if they had not been invented already, so I do not believe in them.

With a Smile not "in". A smile which is controlled and initiated by what? You guessed it.

The Mind isn't beyond the brain.
Take anyone, chop off there skull and take a peek. With electrodes you can actually interrupt a thought.
Not someone will stop mid sentence, they will break, pause, resume and have no recollection off the break.

[Himster]

The Brain is the person.

A person is really the data and proccessing of the brain, not the physical brain. The physical brain physically recycles it's components roughly every 7 years, yet the person is fundamentally the same(usually).

[Cúchulainn]

The physical brain physically recycles it's components roughly every 7 years, yet the person is fundamentally the same(usually).

And where did you hear this?

[Claudius Gothicus]

The brain is the material and biological sustain of your conscious existence, without it(neuronal death) you are nothing but a biological system surviving through absolute external assistance, how can some people consider that ''a human being'' is beyond me.

The human being is the brain in conscious functioning, everything else(irrecoverable vegetative state) is not...

[Sumonious]

The brain is the material and biological sustain of your conscious existence, without it(neuronal death) you are nothing but a biological system surviving through absolute external assistance, how can some people consider that ''a human being'' is beyond me.

The human being is the brain in conscious functioning, everything else(irrecoverable vegetative state) is not...

Well, people may still consider it as a human being because our thinking is affected by how we see thing. We used to see a human being as the body while rarely interact with the brain, so we subconsciously define the body with the consciousness and not the brain itself.

[Cúchulainn]

The brain is the material and biological sustain of your conscious existence, without it(neuronal death) you are nothing but a biological system surviving through absolute external assistance, how can some people consider that ''a human being'' is beyond me.

The human being is the brain in conscious functioning, everything else(irrecoverable vegetative state) is not...

People attach a lot of meat to their flesh.

[removeduser_4536284751384]

And where did you hear this?

I've certainly heard that most of the molecules in our body are replaced several times over? But then neurons supposedely last your lifetime?

And lest we forget, the brain is capable of making multiple "you's." Multiple personality disorder can create several people living within the same body. Can any other organ or system of organs do that?

I do not believe they are seperate consciousses, but as the name says, just different personalities. We all change our behaviours based on our current einvornment, and multiple personalities is just a very extreme version of that.

[Vizsla]

I held a human brain once. Surprisingly heavy for its size, I thought, but maybe that was more perception than reality.
It was an odd feeling.
On the one hand it was very deceased.
But on the other hand it had obviously been someone, someone with opinions and feelings.

I would say that a person is bigger than their brain. But this is just an opinion, not scientific fact.
The act of smiling (even when forced) releases chemicals in the brain that make the person feel good. The experience of ‘feeling good’ occurs in the brain but because the cause of the good feeling started in the smile ‘the self’ extends beyond the brain and into the body. The brain is only the self when it is in the wider context of the body because everything is one whole.
This is why we needed the concept of ‘mind’.
I do not see why it would be necessary to invent souls if they had not been invented already, so I do not believe in them.

[Sumonious]

Very interesting Colonel Blimp. I, on the other hand, always think of the brain as our real selves and the rest are just extension. Maybe because I watch a lot of sci-fi . It could also because I want to dismiss my own insecurity of my appearance or 'Shell'. Well, not just appearance, I consider appearance, wealth, social tie and social status and the like as 'Shell' as well.

A person is really the data and proccessing of the brain, not the physical brain. The physical brain physically recycles it's components roughly every 7 years, yet the person is fundamentally the same(usually).

Now it's even more thought-provoking, isn't it? Classic Ship of Theseus paradox. So is a brain a just vessel as well as the body? And no, I'm not implying that it's a vessel for a soul or other magical object.

[Denny Crane!]

It is a missing organ. I think you are looking at the idea of a seat of consciousness? Well the body is also a fundamental part of who you are so I don't think the brain being the seat of consciousness makes it the entire person I think the person is a gestalt that includes everything.

[Claudius Gothicus]

It is a missing organ. I think you are looking at the idea of a seat of consciousness? Well the body is also a fundamental part of who you are so I don't think the brain being the seat of consciousness makes it the entire person I think the person is a gestalt that includes everything.

Absolutely, and the body does work as a system with both outputs and inputs but it's important to notice that it's an Asymmetric System and the brain does indeed condition the existence of the rest.

Without it our consciousness simply doesn't exist, without a leg, an arm, or being paralyzed from the neck down our consciousness are radically modified(our psychological predisposition especially) but without our brains we simply do not exist.

[Big War Bird]

It is a missing organ. I think you are looking at the idea of a seat of consciousness? Well the body is also a fundamental part of who you are so I don't think the brain being the seat of consciousness makes it the entire person I think the person is a gestalt that includes everything.

I disagree, you can do without a great deal of your body and still be "you." You can lose your hands and legs, eyes, ears and nose and still be you. You don't need all of your digestive tract and many organs are replaceable. You however cannot be you without your brain.

[Vizsla]

I disagree, you can do without a great deal of your and still be you. You can lose your hands and legs, eyes ears and nose and still bbe you. You don't need all of your digestive tract and many organs are replaceable. You however cannot be you without your brain.

You can't live without a heart either and that is just a muscle.
There was an experiment on rats recently where they hooked up an electronic circuit replacement cerebellum. When the chip was turned off the rat was unable to learn a conditioned response, when the chip was turned on it could. So the circuit was properly functioning as a part of the rat's brain.
http://www.sens.org/node/2210/
The aim being to one day replace bits of damaged brain in humans.

Then the question becomes: if they replace bits or all of your brain, are you still you?
I prefer to think that you are software and the brain is hardware, so the answer would be yes.