Triarii - spear's trick

[BiggBudd]

Ok been playing awhile, got to thinking about what the triarii men do with their spears when the switch to swords? are they like snooker cues a quick swivel and there in pieces? do they pop up like umbrella's? do they stick em down their trouser legs or what? Seriously thou what did they do with them IRL, just fix them in the ground like stakes? drop them? any ideas?

[Kaweh]

Don't know. But what did hoplites do with their spears? I guess once the formation was broken, they droped them, since in one-on-one combat this spears would be useless...

K.K

[Imperator of Rome]

I think historically they made some sort of spearwall with the shields in front and the triarii kneeling.http://home.zonnet.nl/richardevers2000/Pic/triarii.gif

[Kaweh]

Yes, Persian Sparabara ("Spearbearers") did the same, but his question was what happened to the spears when they start fighting one-on-one with swords?

K.K

[Imperator of Rome]

Well triarii spears are shorter then hoplite spears,so they probably fought with it longer then hoplites and switched to swords when their spears broke etc

[Kaweh]

Triarii spears were quite long, if not even as long as some greek hoplite spears (I'm not talking of the long pikes (sarissa), but of the rather short spears of the greek hoplites), and I guess you're right when you say they continued fighting with them for a while, but once the formation was broken, they had to switch to swords, since on the long run swords are ways better for one-on-one combat than spears.

K.K

[Imperator of Rome]

Ok yes I was talking about phalagite pikes,Triarii arent supposted to be used unless there is a emergency etc,they wasn't even used at cannae.In most of my battles I dont use triarii,just principes and hastati.

[Boudicca]

I would throw my spear away. Even if I had a place in my clothing where it could be put, it would be useless in 1 on 1 sword combat. And it would rather make my moves more difficult, thus give the enemy an advantage, if he were without a spear.

[Matrix33]

Triarii (...)wasn't even used at cannae.

First time I meet such information. Are you sure? I'm just curious. Could you provide any kind of source?

[Imperator of Rome]

A spear is useful as long as you keep your distance,plus triarii have fairly large shields.

[Imperator of Rome]

Yes,at cannae the triarii were camped while the principes and hastatii fought.

[TLv1.0]

Livy never mentiones that, where have u read this? i doubt paulus held any of his men back despite not agreeing with Varro attacking, and varro brought what he had. however, livy only refers to the army as fomred by light infantry, infrantry and cavalry.

Triiri were a part of the standard roman battle line so why weren't they used in this engagmenet, they were esential in the resistance Flaminius raised at trasimene until he was killed.

[Imperator of Rome]

History channel,when they were talking about the battle of cannae.I looked for any sources myself so Im not sure its true.

[Kaweh]

I looked at wikipedia, hastati and principes are mentioned, however no single word about triarii. So I guess they were either not there, or at least not involved.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Cannae

K.K

[Imperator of Rome]

Doesnt make sense to leave the most experienced troops sitting in a camp though.

[TerraHero]

Doesnt make sense to leave the most experienced troops sitting in a camp though.

Imagine, you brought a massivly huge army to fight an enemy, one you outnumber, on open ground with heavy well trained infantry. I dont think they saw a reason to bring there Triarii to the battle aswell, it was quite common for Romans to leave there Triarii to garison the fort to prevent it from falling to the enemy as the main force was engaged some miles away.

It is argued that the Romans would probably have won if the (aprox.) 8.000 Triarii where present at the battle, Triarii often kept in reserve and quite capable of dealing with cavalry would have prevented a complete encirclement, in theory atleast.

[Freddie]

.

It is argued that the Romans would probably have won if the (aprox.) 8.000 Triarii where present at the battle, Triarii often kept in reserve and quite capable of dealing with cavalry would have prevented a complete encirclement, in theory atleast.

Triarii are only as good as then men who command them.

[TLv1.0]

they sent in their legions and lost most of them, two thirds of the army were raw recruits so it's more likely that they lacked triiri then that they didn't use 'em. thats however pure specualtion on my part

[Kaweh]

Also the fact that Hannibals cavalry was so immensly effective is another sign that maybe there were no triariis, since they could have stopped the cavalry. (Pure speculating)

K.K

[Imperator of Rome]

Yes a reserve of spearmen could of helped the romans somewhat,the romans just walked or ermm charged into that trap.