Mujahideen

[Ancient Aliens]

I've been wanting to ask this question of the Muslims on these forums for some time. I was wondering, and this is completely serious, what do female mujahideen receive for committing suicidal istishhad? What about monogamous mujahideen? Or homosexual mujahideen? Or mujahideen who dislike having sex with virgins? Does the Qur'an even delve into this, and is the act of suicidal martydom even mentioned in the Qur'an at all, because I don't recall reading about it...

[PointOfViewGun]

I've been wanting to ask this question of the Muslims on these forums for some time. I was wondering, and this is completely serious, what do female mujahideen receive for committing suicidal istishhad? What about monogamous mujahideen? Or homosexual mujahideen? Or mujahideen who dislike having sex with virgins? Does the Qur'an even delve into this, and is the act of suicidal martydom even mentioned in the Qur'an at all, because I don't recall reading about it...

Are you referring to the idea of receiving 72 virgins?

[Col. Tartleton]

Im guessing it's probably a metaphor not that I'd expect warriors of god to consider that.

72 Virgins: Free Coke and Sex Parties For Everybody

[-Stormrage-]

The idea that muslims receive 72 virgins in heaven is Falso propaganda.
Where did you here about this ? "oh george bush was talking about it the other day" or " i heard it on CNN" . Your gonnaa ask George bush what muslims beleive ? or ask CNN what muslims beleive ?

This is False.

[Heretic]

No its not false propaganda, its true martyrs are guaranteed 72 wives in paradise according to hadith. They are supposed to be very beautiful. As for women I've heard it before and i've just been reading that they will also get something similar as god is fair and just.

[PointOfViewGun]

No its not false propaganda, its true martyrs are guaranteed 72 wives in paradise according to hadith. They are supposed to be very beautiful. As for women I've heard it before and i've just been reading that they will also get something similar as god is fair and just.

Only Quran matters, especially on topics of afterlife.

[Heretic]

Not according to Sunnis who comprise over 80% of the muslim world so the answer was valid.

[PointOfViewGun]

Not according to Sunnis who comprise over 80% of the muslim world so the answer was valid.

Not really. My country is pretty much all made up of Sunnis and no one talks of getting 72 virgins if they die as martyrs.

[panzer 4]

Not really. My country is pretty much all made up of Sunnis and no one talks of getting 72 virgins if they die as martyrs.

iirc, i think there was a survey which showed turkey had about 94% muslim, but only 20% were practicing.

[PointOfViewGun]

iirc, i think there was a survey which showed turkey had about 94% muslim, but only 20% were practicing.

Doesn't make them non-Sunnis. And, you wouldn't even hear that 20% talking about how the martyrs will get 72 virgins.

[panzer 4]

Doesn't make them non-Sunnis. And, you wouldn't even hear that 20% talking about how the martyrs will get 72 virgins.

true

[Heretic]

Not really. My country is pretty much all made up of Sunnis and no one talks of getting 72 virgins if they die as martyrs.

So what if no one talks about it, it's in a well known hadith.

[panzer 4]

suicide is haram in islam and those who suicide never enter heaven.
http://muttaqun.com/suicide.html
the mujahideen that do suicide are branded munafiqeen and dont represent the muslim population at all.

[Heretic]

suicide is haram in islam and those who suicide never enter heaven.
http://muttaqun.com/suicide.html
the mujahideen that do suicide are branded munafiqeen and dont represent the muslim population at all.

Yeah I agree with you, but martyrs are people who fight in battle and are slain.

[Vizsla]

I've been wanting to ask this question of the Muslims on these forums for some time. I was wondering, and this is completely serious, what do female mujahideen receive for committing suicidal istishhad? What about monogamous mujahideen? Or homosexual mujahideen? Or mujahideen who dislike having sex with virgins? Does the Qur'an even delve into this, and is the act of suicidal martydom even mentioned in the Qur'an at all, because I don't recall reading about it...

This answers everything:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2002...uardianreview5
I'm particularly fond of the last bit. The theory that that part was originally written in Syriac and not arabic and so the 72 virgins should actually be translated as 72 grapes. I imagine that would be quite a disappointment.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Luxenberg tries to show that many obscurities of the Koran disappear if we read certain words as being Syriac and not Arabic. We cannot go into the technical details of his methodology but it allows Luxenberg, to the probable horror of all Muslim males dreaming of sexual bliss in the Muslim hereafter, to conjure away the wide-eyed houris promised to the faithful in suras XLIV.54; LII.20, LV.72, and LVI.22. Luxenberg 's new analysis, leaning on the Hymns of Ephrem the Syrian, yields "white raisins" of "crystal clarity" rather than doe-eyed, and ever willing virgins - the houris. Luxenberg claims that the context makes it clear that it is food and drink that is being offerred, and not unsullied maidens or houris.

In Syriac, the word hur is a feminine plural adjective meaning white, with the word "raisin" understood implicitly. Similarly, the immortal, pearl-like ephebes or youths of suras such as LXXVI.19 are really a misreading of a Syriac expression meaning chilled raisins (or drinks) that the just will have the pleasure of tasting in contrast to the boiling drinks promised the unfaithful and damned.

As Luxenberg's work has only recently been published we must await its scholarly assessment before we can pass any judgements. But if his analysis is correct then suicide bombers, or rather prospective martyrs, would do well to abandon their culture of death, and instead concentrate on getting laid 72 times in this world, unless of course they would really prefer chilled or white raisins, according to their taste, in the next.

[panzer 4]

This answers everything:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2002...uardianreview5
I'm particularly fond of the last bit. The theory that that part was originally written in Syriac and not arabic and so the 72 virgins should actually be translated as 72 grapes. I imagine that would be quite a disappointment.

you do realise the quran was written in arabic?

[Ancient Aliens]

So is it mentioned in the Qur'an? Because again, I don't recall reading it at all. I know that suicide is a damnable sin (as it is in Catholicism), which is what led me to question the whole "72 virgins" thing. Is it written in a non-canonical book?

[PointOfViewGun]

So what if no one talks about it, it's in a well known hadith.

A well known Hadith doesn't make it an accepted one.

So is it mentioned in the Qur'an? Because again, I don't recall reading it at all. I know that suicide is a damnable sin (as it is in Catholicism), which is what led me to question the whole "72 virgins" thing. Is it written in a non-canonical book?

It's not mentioned in the Quran whatsoever. However, Quran bans suicide completely.

[Iustinianus]

So is it mentioned in the Qur'an? Because again, I don't recall reading it at all. I know that suicide is a damnable sin (as it is in Catholicism), which is what led me to question the whole "72 virgins" thing. Is it written in a non-canonical book?

RCC's position on suicide from the Catechism on the Vatican's own website.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Suicide

2280 Everyone is responsible for his life before God who has given it to him. It is God who remains the sovereign Master of life. We are obliged to accept life gratefully and preserve it for his honor and the salvation of our souls. We are stewards, not owners, of the life God has entrusted to us. It is not ours to dispose of.

2281 Suicide contradicts the natural inclination of the human being to preserve and perpetuate his life. It is gravely contrary to the just love of self. It likewise offends love of neighbor because it unjustly breaks the ties of solidarity with family, nation, and other human societies to which we continue to have obligations. Suicide is contrary to love for the living God.

2282 If suicide is committed with the intention of setting an example, especially to the young, it also takes on the gravity of scandal. Voluntary co-operation in suicide is contrary to the moral law.

Grave psychological disturbances, anguish, or grave fear of hardship, suffering, or torture can diminish the responsibility of the one committing suicide.

2283 We should not despair of the eternal salvation of persons who have taken their own lives. By ways known to him alone, God can provide the opportunity for salutary repentance. The Church prays for persons who have taken their own lives.

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_cs...m/p3s2c2a5.htm

[Heretic]

No its not in the Quran, its in the hadith which is an important part of Islam. It's a reward for martyrs so suicide bombers woudn't get it I guess.