Artillery modding question

[Knonfoda]

I was just wondering, is the appearance of artillery in RTW moddable? Because I recall seeing some mods (I think it was Roma Surrectum or Roma Surrectum II) where they actually have the types of siege machines that are more akin to large scorpios/ballista than the silly wheeled catapult models we see in game.

Heres some examples:

The Standard RTW Roman Onager:

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What it would look like in reality:

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The RS/RS II model (sorry could not find a better picture, but you can see its more akin to the real one)

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

I was just wondering, can IB not use these models in their own mod?

[Justinian Australis]

I'd like to see that. Just looking at that real life version, that would quite easily make some rather wet patches in your mail coat..I wonder witch faction wore hard hats and high visibility coats in the game?

[Constantius]

Thats an Onager

[Knonfoda]

Well you know what I mean, is there any way to mod the standard RTW siege engines to make them look more like the real ones?

[florin80]

What you`re showing in your first post(the rs2 lithobolos/palintone) is actually the roman ballista. The onager looks like the one from Constantius`s post. We`ve tried to implement it like that in FoR, but we hit a problem. Much as we figured out it`s not possible(unless someone else has find out how) to adjust the starting point of the arm. So we ended up with something that looks like this:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

It`s about as close as we could get. Still, I personally find it preferable to the one in vanilla.

[Constantius]

Agreed it does look much better

[Knonfoda]

Definitely. I did mean the ballista, as those came in all sizes and could (as far as I recall) be used for siege purposes also. Could that not be used, as indeed it is used in RSII?

Also, whats the problem with that onager? Does the arm not move, is that it? Its still preferable to vanilla though, it looks really good!

[florin80]

Also, whats the problem with that onager? Does the arm not move, is that it? Its still preferable to vanilla though, it looks really good!

No, the arm moves, but the attaching point of the arm can`t(as far as we`ve figured) be adjusted or the model gets messy in game with parts floating around iirc. The result is that instead of the arm starting from the base of the catapult(like you see in Constantius`s image) it`s placed higher up. Which in turn forced us to add a few more wooden elements thus departing a bit from the reconstructions of onagers that you see in books and on the net. But it`s nothing that severe of course and I doubt onager plans were set in stone so I`m happy with it as it is. We`ve also tried to have the artillery somewhat smaller in size(relative to the crew) to match what we`ve seen books.

[Knonfoda]

I see... so which is the mod that has the ballista flinging the rocks then? Is that on the MTWII engine which I gather is easier to mod?

[florin80]

I beg your pardon?

[Knonfoda]

Sorry, the third screenshot I have attached, which mod is that? Is it RS or RSII? Is it not possible to use that model for a siege weapon? After all, I think Alexander the Great did indeed have large *ballistae* which flung rocks and could be used in-lieu of the onager in game.

[florin80]

It`s from rs2. You can use it as a battle unit(against both units and buildings; I`m actually using it in FoR), but I doubt you`ll be able to implement it as a siege weapon only in the sense the rams and siege towers work.

[Knonfoda]

Sorry, when I said siege weapon I meant in the sense of artillery to be used against walls. So that particular model can actually be used instead of the standard onager. In that case, wouldn't it be more accurate to use it instead?

[florin80]

The onager was apparently more popular during the late antiquity even though it allegedly had less accuracy then the two-armed artillery and had a shorter range than the ballista because it was also simpler to make and less expensive. But technically yes, you can replace the onager with the rs2 ballista.