God of War units!!!..?

[regie27m]

For pits sake!!! why does it take half of my unit stacks to take down a single company of TROLLS or OLooG HAI!!! or any of those damn fouled-mouthed beast

I'm playing VH/VH, but those trolls are getting on my nerves, its frustrating to have 3 groups of your best infantry unit lay waste by a single beast, I tried archers, 4 groups baring down the damn company of Olog Hai (sp) and got FUBARed, I have 5 units or Arnorian Knights and just the same, FUBARed!!!

This is also true with those MUMAKIL or whatever, they annihilated 3 groups with 2 units each (that 6 units!!!) Arnorian Sergeants and knights!!!![IMG]file:///C:/Users/YUAN-M%7E1/AppData/Local/Temp/msohtmlclip1/01/clip_image001.gif[/IMG]

Frankly, I have never experience such a beating in TW!!!, though it may sound Fun at first, but under vh/vh MORDOR just spawn after spawn high stacks of armies with those trolls and i cant break out and take osgiliath!!!

So, I believe I have to tell you, these units are too beef up, there just overpowered... you've seen the movie, that damn slick Legolas kill a troll single handle y, so too with an oilephant.... i suggest it should be at least toned down...

(unless someone here knows how to deal with those beast...)

[Rero]

playing battle dificulty vh gives ai huge morale and stats bonus. try playing vh/m instead

[Trailhog250]

playing battle dificulty vh gives ai huge morale and stats bonus. try playing vh/m instead

This is wrong

No offense to you but I have done extensive research on this and as I quote CA said: "Very Hard provides the most realistic challenge whilst neither side gain bonuses' that's not 'word-for-word' but it's close. Plus I have done tests, other people have done tests, and quite simply VH takes morale and fatigue to the next level for BOTH sides. In RTW they would get 'uber' bonuses where militia would kill you best troops but NOT in M2TW. ETW should not be played past H/H however due to 'cheats' via the AI.


And quite simply I maul the AI all the time on VH/VH and quite simply I would know if it was cheating, but putting aside my word for it they DO NOT get cheats, bonuses, beefs or anything else of the sort. Although I think on Easy the player gets bonuses and battles are more arcade like.


To stay on topic use Catapults or Trebuchets and bring some body bags

[♔DARTH LEGO♔]

Monsters vs Men buddy... always going to be the way

but there are ways.....


say it with me now :

T....A.....C.....T....I....C....S

[Dava2710]

Use AP units against trolls, you will still suffer casulties but it will be much more acceptable. Also try to spray incoming trolls with archers before they come too close, it also helps. Trolls will always be extremely harsh enemy, expecially olog hai (just look at them) but some use of tactics will help a lot.

As for the Mumakil I have no advice. Nations with jevelin throwers have it easy, not even talking about Rohan Skirmishers, it was almost ridiculous watching 1 unit killing 2 units of mumakils, with heavy casulties but still... If you don't have jevelins try to hit them with balistas or catapults, try to make them catch Amok. Fire arrows also help, but what do you expect, you saw the movie. At least they just stand there shooting at you for some time before charging, it gives you some time to rout them.

[sher]

Trolls have to be effective - it is all evil nonhuman factions have. They are not too dangerous though if you know how to manipulate them. And gondor generals can have Doctor as retinue so troll's damage to the troops can be healed. Archer militia is cheap and very effective as meatshield.

Real beasts are harad oliphants if they are out of ammo. Harad overall has very powerfull army but not right from the start.

[Janne]

Mumakil go down absurdly easy vs ballistas or javelins (too easily IMO). Trolls, etc. are a complete pain, perhaps someone else could verify, but I think if you have thicker ranks your heavy infantry does better against them.

I can't stand the idiotic bits in the movies where Legolas does something OP, I don't understand why they didn't just use a catapult to throw Legolas into every single enemy army in those movies so he could surf down oliphaunt tusks while shooting three arrows out of his bow at the same time. It always confused me that the other elves were so squishy and useless when compared with Legolas.

[sher]

Mumakil go down absurdly easy vs ballistas or javelins (too easily IMO).

They are only gigantic animals with thick skin. So ballista's bolt or boulder has to be effective. But if you do not have siege engines (and usually you do not use them in regular armies because they are too slow) or many units with javelines or crossbows - you're dead when they are out of ammo. They have too high armor value for other troops and melee units have little chance even to hit them as they throw everybody away. They'll trample all your army easily if they will be still alive when they're out of ammo. Archers on their backs are player's best friends.

[Khales]

What´s that? The search button is absolutely awesome!

But the last sentence about Legolas made me rather think about...

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

[NickTheGreek3]

What´s that? The search button is absolutely awesome!

But the last sentence about Legolas made me rather think about...

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Hahahaha! Epic video!!!

the easiest way to kill mumakils is with ballistas and catapults with fire ammo if you hit them then you have one shot kills

Also if you use catapults with flaming ammo, the rest go running amok.

[Argaladir]

Well, I didn't have any problems with Harad and those nasty beasts till I saw two armies heading for one of my cities.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

9 units of mumaks is like 27k in upkeep, and thats just the two armies i can actually see atm.. how in gods name do they pay the upkeep? Even with the money scripts this seems way to overpowered.

I have disabled the ingame console too, so I can't auto_win out of this.. And imagine all the other mumaks out there o_O

[lionhero]

9 units of mumaks is like 27k in upkeep, and thats just the two armies i can actually see atm.. how in gods name do they pay the upkeep? Even with the money scripts this seems way to overpowered.

I don't think the script really distinguishes between like 1k deficit or a 100k one. I'd recommend running like hell and hope they get in a ship then sink it.

[Aronor]

You can also use your spearmen units against mumakil and you will see that they are also quite effective.

[Emperor of Hell]

the easiest way to kill mumakils is with ballistas and catapults with fire ammo if you hit them then you have one shot kills

[Salvatore_Fox]

well, Khales already posted the link to Jan's troll post (lol)

And concerning mumakils, they are easy beaten by ballistas and catapults. And if you're not willing to use these tools, u should probably not play on highest difficulty

[Makus]

archers to make em bleed, spears to hold em, and cavalry to do dirty things to their behinds (flank and charge from the rear that is)

[The Mouth]

I find a cavalry charge (As long as their as good as eored heavy lancers, though any cavalry can at least heavily damage them) can be very effective against trolls in fact a single charge from some elite cavalry often can take out 4-5 trolls (Well i did this against mountain trolls not olog-hai but it should work against them to) instantly all you have to do is repeatedly charge them.

[regie27m]

And quite simply I maul the AI all the time on VH/VH and quite simply I would know if it was cheating,

... well I pffttt the AI on M2TW with other mods too, but with Mordor spawning stacks upon stacks of units, i cant help but wonder what the hell is going on on that mountain!!!! by the way what faction are you playing on vh/vh?

how in gods name do they pay the upkeep? Even with the money scripts this seems way to overpowered.

... damn right something is wrong, especially Mordor

Here's a sit rep on my campaign:

I have at the top with fort Litash and Carn Dom secured....
In the Middle, my front from Edoras to Entwade to Limlightfort defended by 2 Armies( one Arnorian one Eriardor).. watching both the remnants of Isengard and my neighbor dwarves...

Now, below is where the thing hits the fan, I have 3 armies FUBARED trying to save Gondor...
I set off via sail and raided both Mordor and Harad settlements... basically siege, sacks and offer settlements to Gondor and some to high elves( a fun way to do...), my tactic is to wear down Mordor gather a strong force and then when Gondors secured combine assault on all evil at the black gate.... sort of ROTK style,

BUT to my surprise and horror, every time I take a settlement and give it to Gondor... the next few turns Mordor will have it back... worst it seems Suaron had spawned not one but 2 stacks of armies for every town I take!!!... hell I even take the guts to raid East Goliath( sp? whatever the town is) give it to the Dwarves(quite strong faction now) and esentially blocking the entry of units from the damn mountain itself... but lo and behold!!! some mighty mordor armies pop out after a turn inside the gondor territories and now barreling down all the settlements... after some hit and run, gondor is now left with only 3 or 4 settlements!!!

and I cant do a thing, why? because I'm broke!!!! I have over 35+ settlements plus the moneys i gain from the raids and still cannot support having only about 4 Armies in the fields !!!! .....on the other hand Mordor has only about 5 or 6 settlements and fielding 6 full stack armies attacking... talk about overrpower ehhhhh...

well anyway I'm having a Frustratingly-Fun Campaign Now

[sher]

i cant help but wonder what the hell is going on on that mountain!!!!

There are a lot of castles and only 3 towns. Mordor is one large training center.

Try to play as Gondor - you'll learn how to fight mordor armies effectively or you'll die fast. Simple choice.

In fact, Mordor is very easy to defeat when there is no Harad.

[Trailhog250]

... well I pffttt the AI on M2TW with other mods too, but with Mordor spawning stacks upon stacks of units, i cant help but wonder what the hell is going on on that mountain!!!! by the way what faction are you playing on vh/vh?

Gondor ftw, when the AI doesn't get cheats I enjoy the game more. Even though I have played it with them on it's simply not as appealing to me when I feel like numbers are the only way to win... So that's why they give a guide on how to remove them in the FAQ. With the cheats on (they are by default) the AI will get free stacks when you besiege a city, free money, stakes that deploy as soon as a cavalry charge takes place, among other things.

Sorry I should have specified more Yes the AI will get cheats on ALL levels in TATW unless the AI-Cheat scripts are de-activated. (I play like that because it ruins the fun factor and immersion fighting an attrition was against a 'fake' opponent )

What I mean is some people believe something like this:
Battle Difficulty
Easy - +4 morale and attack for player units (This one MIGHT actually be true unsure, let's hope no one here plays on Easy anyway )
Medium - +0 morale and attack for player AND AI units
Hard - +4 morale and attack for AI units
Very Hard - +8 morale and attack for AI units

Whereas the truth of the mateter is that there are no 'fake' bonuses when this is adjusted. It just means if your Militia get flanked on Easy and they hold the line in time for you to fix it, on VH they're going to rout A LOT faster, funner this way imo.

That's how it was in RTW, I meant battles are 'fair'. Turning up/down the difficulty slider won't affect the intelligence either, it will make it less like a arcade game and more like a simulation. (Kind of ) It just makes units tire more quickly, morale is a MUCH bigger factor. Things like that. High-Tier units can decimate units with low morale if used right on VH. (Yes the AI raids my bloody archers all the time )