Pentagon: Russia provided US to Saddam

[allthesedamnnamesaretaken]

source: http://edition.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/me...sia/index.html

a rather interesting development if true. looks like the cold war is not quite over just yet

"Soviet Union? But I thought you guys dissolved!"
"HAHAHA! that's what we wanted you to think!"
*berlin wall springs up from ground*
*Lenin rises from the dead: "MUST CRUSH CAPITALISM!"*

[Ahiga]

I've heard about this. My stance is that it was a poor movie on the Russians, especially since they did not *To my knowledge* appear to openly oppose our actions, but that it's more of a worry that we even had the leak to begin with.

Besides that, I can't help but feel like Russia was simply opting to help who they saw as the defenders. We were the aggressors, the invaders, the conquerors, liberators. Russia may have wished to help a nation they saw as the victim. Both we and they have had a history of helping the other one's foe, though I do not see why they persist this practice now that the cold war has ended.

Of course, the bitter irony is, if this was Iran or Jordan, we'd be invading there or very near to giving great military action, most likely.

Russia did a poor movie and risked having less warm relations with the United States. Anything serious in the form of military responce to their actions is just..well, M.A.D.

[crazyj]

I've heard about this. My stance is that it was a poor movie on the Russians, especially since they did not *To my knowledge* appear to openly oppose our actions, but that it's more of a worry that we even had the leak to begin with.

Besides that, I can't help but feel like Russia was simply opting to help who they saw as the defenders. We were the aggressors, the invaders, the conquerors, liberators. Russia may have wished to help a nation they saw as the victim. Both we and they have had a history of helping the other one's foe, though I do not see why they persist this practice now that the cold war has ended.

Of course, the bitter irony is, if this was Iran or Jordan, we'd be invading there or very near to giving great military action, most likely.

Russia did a poor movie and risked having less warm relations with the United States. Anything serious in the form of military responce to their actions is just..well, M.A.D.

Oh man its wonderful watching the moral equivocations on this site. Of course the Russians and French didn't try to get us to not invade because Saddam owed them BILLIONS, but because the Russkis felt bad for the poor defenceless Iraqis. And we all know about Russias history of philanthropy right?

No, the opposed us because Saddam was a fat cash register to them; they helped him get rid of his WMDs precisely so that afterwords they'd be contracted to help rearm those WMDs. They gave him battle plans in hopes that we could be made to bleed heavily enough to pull out with Saddam in power. Open your eyes folks, Putin is an (ex?) KGB ironman who doesn't care about the "poor wittle Iraqis."

And guys, Osamas role in Afghanistan and our funding of Islamic fundamentalism has been way overhyped. Most of our funding went to native Afghans, made up of Tajiks, Uzbeks, etc. many of which went on to compose the Northern Alliance. Osama went out and fired his rifle once, as the Sauds and Pakistanis were also supporting the resistance but to different factions. After the war, these factions started battling it out, leading to the Taliban pushing what came to be called the Northern Alliance out of most of Afghanistan. This was inspired partly by the Sauds (and other ME countries) decision to not allow the fighters they sent to Afghanistan to return home. Which is why Osamas greatest hatred is reserved for the infidel governments of the Middle East.

[Sidus Preclarum]

a rather interesting development if true. looks like the cold war is not quite over just yet

At the bottom of the Kremlin's neurotic view of world affairs is traditional and instinctive Russian sense of insecurity. Originally, this was insecurity of a peaceful agricultural people trying to live on vast exposed plain in neighborhood of fierce nomadic peoples. To this was added, as Russia came into contact with economically advanced West, fear of more competent, more powerful, more highly organized societies in that area.

You think there would have been no cold war had the Russian not been communists after WWII ? Think again.
The Russian awowed communism just had the great advantage for the US to be able to mobilize its own population through the clever use of their anti-communist sentiment. So, you can't believe that, because the USSR fell, Russia and the US are not rival anymore...

[Last Roman]

Russia back up to it's old tricks huh?

Like Sidus said, you can't really expect them to be rivals for 70 years and then expect them to all of a sudden love us

[Mangalore]

I cannot really believe that Russia's support of Iraq was very out of the ordinary. I remember there was a website up during the Gulf War where supposedly Russian defense experts analyzed the events of the war and evaluated threat scenarios and what Iraqis and US forces really were doing. It was closed some weeks into the war, but I doubt that Russia telling Iraqis similar stuff over official channels would really constitute fundamental help. Given Iraq's bad performance ( thx to Saddam tieing the hands of its own military) I doubt it had any major effect on the outcome.

Russia is not behaving like in the Cold War but they stopped their friendly tones towards the west as well as they felt to be taken advantage of. Thanks to rising energy prices and Putins authocratic achievements in increasing Russia's stability Russia now continues a stance of independant politics, neither willing to submit to the west nor anyone else. If they can keep that up I don't know but for the near future Russia's finances are back in order (last I read was that it had reduced its foreign credits to virtually zero) and thus it is not easily forced to do anything against its will anymore.

[RusskiSoldat]

Strange, I read it on another site which claims that we gave them a lot of unimportant intellegence, but the wrong date for the attack (April 15) so they were caught by surprise.
I wouldn't be surprised if the FSB (new version of KGB) and the CIA were working together on this.

[Primvs Sextvs Loverlord]

Strange, I read it on another site which claims that we gave them a lot of unimportant intellegence, but the wrong date for the attack (April 15) so they were caught by surprise.
I wouldn't be surprised if the FSB (new version of KGB) and the CIA were working together on this.

That's what the cover-up's gonna be.
To be honest, the invasion of Iraq was not in Russia's favour. Even the Afghan invasion was not. Putin is a Russian of the old style and he wants his country to regain it's honour - don't you see what he's doing with the oil and the gas and the influence on the former republics?

[Ó Cathasaigh]

Well, add this to Russias Checklist of good deeds for the new millinium

A.Tamper with elections
B. Skrew with Ukraine more, via oil
C. Sell out their "allies"

what a great century so far!


Russki

I've heard otherwise. in fact I've heard it was accurate info, but saddam pulled a Hitler and didn't listen to reason

[imb39]

Well, add this to Russias Checklist of good deeds for the new millinium

A.Tamper with elections
B. Skrew with Ukraine more, via oil
C. Sell out their "allies"

what a great century so far!


Russki

I've heard otherwise. in fact I've heard it was accurate info, but saddam pulled a Hitler and didn't listen to reason

Well, it was gas. But the rest stands. Do they have any allies left? Putin seems to be doing a good job of driving away any supporters at the moment.

[Mangalore]

Well, it was gas. But the rest stands. Do they have any allies left? Putin seems to be doing a good job of driving away any supporters at the moment.

Actually, no, Putin just has realized that flattering the West gives him no rest with his authorcratic doings and actually is no longer in the interest of Russia and instead has decided to turn east in a sense seeking closer ties to China and gaining back its influence in central asia.

For Russia having no dough, that's simply not true for the government anymore, while not superrich, Russia's economy has developed very positively thanks to vast energy resources which grew in importance in the last years and allowed them to make extra profit. That's also the reason Putin seems stupid enough to play hardball with the west, he is simply not dependant on our money anymore while the west depends on Russian gas and oil now and in the coming future.

[Erik]

I've heard otherwise. in fact I've heard it was accurate info, but saddam pulled a Hitler and didn't listen to reason

Read the article.
The "intel" was false in all but one area.

It sound strange to me that Russia would give secret intel to Saddam, and it sound even stranger to me that they would give him the wrong intel.

Unless the Russian ambassador was working WITH the US to fool Saddam of course, then this makes perfect sense.
Russia doesn't have to be involved here, it could be one Russian working on his own..probably for the money (my theory at least)

[Major.Stupidity]

It sound strange to me that Russia would give secret intel to Saddam, and it sound even stranger to me that they would give him the wrong intel.

Well, it is Russia after all....

[Sétanta]

No surprises here. Russia is strapped for money and why not make a little dough by giving some intel (which the russians have always been very good at getting) to a favorite customer.

Assuming of course the Iraqi's paid for it.

Anyway. It helped them out none and perhaps even gave us an advantage.

[Ó Cathasaigh]

Read the article.

why, what makes your sources more reliable than mine?

[therussian]

A.Tamper with elections

Actually, it's funny that you bring that up

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4846006.stm

Anyway, on topic
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4843394.stm

[Nationalist_Cause]

As if this information would have an earth shattering impact on what is going on in Iraq today. Certainly the individual who is responsible for this leak of information should be dealt with. Aside from that, this story is just another manifestation of administration efforts to distract the public from the incompetence and bad policies in Iraq.

[RusskiSoldat]

Speaking of which, anyone hear of the incident a couple of months back when Brits were caught spying on us?
Well, no one cared about that for long either.
Just like that, this will die down eventualy.

[God]

my question is...why?

[Tom Paine]

Why they handed over intel? because despite what you may think, the Cold War isn't nearly over enough, maybe?