What would you do in this situation?

[Aymer de Valence]

http://cloud.steampowered.com/ugc/54...74DFB2DFD4659/


Milan and Genoa are both very weakly defended and the only large Milanese army nearby is sieging Toulouse on a Crusade. I could do with a stronger hold on Northern Italy and also more money, so i was thinking about taking Milan, and a few turns later, Genoa.

There's a few problems though. I am allied with them, and attacking them may bring their allies Sicily into the conflict. Also, while at present we may be at peace, the Holy Roman Empire may try to take over Venice with their army in Bologna, since the AI has a tendency to attack weakly garissoned cities. I'm a good defender, but i cannot really afford to be fighting the Milanese, the Holy Roman Empire and also the Byzantines in Greece. Fortunately the Pope is Venetian, and so he will not be as harsh on me (i hope), but i am still unsure about what to do. Would the gains outweigh the costs?

thanks for any advice

edit: My allies, Hungary, control Innsbruck (the town just north of Bologna and Venice in the mountains - its says it under contol of the HRE, but its not) and they are at war with the HRE. I'm also allied to France, who are at war with Milan

[Silverheart]

I almost never break alliances - and if I do, I do it in a spectacular manner!
So rather, if you want the Germans or Milanese to start the war, hide most of your troops in a forest, and wait ´til they get tempted enough to attack.
Don´t forget to use this waiting time to focus on other conquests abroad, too, so that your empire becomes bigger, more intimidating and more likely to be attacked.

[ChivalrousKiller]

It's quite tempting to advise you to attack. The position you have to attack them there is perfect! But as a player for whom it has been years since the reputation got lower than "Mixed", I find it a bit difficult to say such a thing.

If you decide to attack though, you should consider the possibillity of them taking Toulouse and gaining a foothold in southern France. It would be much better if you could find a way to destroy them fast.

[In3x]

Wow, the computer has done so much in 5 turns? Are you playing a shorter turn length?

As for my advice, I always say attack. Aggressively and recklessly if at all possible.

[Gavani]

Attack. The money you will make from having their cities will fund huge armies for you. Just realise that once you betray an ally it is harder to get others to ally with you. But if you have a large economy and a large army who cares?!?!

You have some money just reinforce venice with a few units and carve em up!

[Aymer de Valence]

I edited a file, so the campaign started in 1070, instead of 1080

and thanks guys for the advice

[_Elysium_]

Having only played a short campaign with Spain, my advice may not be much use, but I'd probably spend a few turns massing my forces in the area then attack Milan before moving onto Genoa, hoping Holy Rome decide to attack so I could use the mass of units to destroy their field army and take Bologna. Then I'd quickly move to eradicate Milan and fortify the mountain passes leading into Holy Roman territory before launching a campaign on them. That could set things up for an invasion of France.

It would also be quite risky. If Sicily did join, you'd effectively be at war on multiple fronts, something which I try to avoid but am willing to accept for the greater good.

I'd also have atleast two decent assassins camped outside Rome in case his grumpiness has a tantrum.

"More tea, your holiness?"

*thud*

This is what I'd do based on what I've seen and read in the first post, though I would be tempted to first get a spy network up so I could see all of my border and all of my potential territorial gains at the same time, before launching a massive multi-pronged assault. I'd also avoid contructing the more expensive buildings, so I could build my forces.

Thinking back to my only campaign on Medieval II so far, I'd also be tempted to avoid conflict with Milan and Holy Rome until I had plenty of siege engines (Catapults, possibly Trebuchets). With the targets in close proximity to each other, and the ability to attack settlements without sieges, the whole area you've been looking at could be siezed in a small number of turns. Actually, I think I'd be more likely to do this than my first suggestion.

I suppose it depends how big a gamble you're willing to take, and how the war with Byzantium is going.

[Aymer de Valence]

Ah yes i recently built a ballista maker in Venice for that exact reason! (plan to upgrade it as soon as possible). The war against the Byzantines is going quite well; they are sieging Corinth at the moment, although the majority of the army are just archers. Thessalonika is garissoned by only 1 unit, and I plan to send a force to capture it soon, though i will have to avoid a huge horse archer army which is occupying central Greece. Money is tight though, which is why I was looking at ways to expand westwards

[ChivalrousKiller]

Ah yes i recently built a ballista maker in Venice for that exact reason! (plan to upgrade it as soon as possible). The war against the Byzantines is going quite well; they are sieging Corinth at the moment, although the majority of the army are just archers. Thessalonika is garissoned by only 1 unit, and I plan to send a force to capture it soon, though i will have to avoid a huge horse archer army which is occupying central Greece. Money is tight though, which is why I was looking at ways to expand westwards

In that case, capturing Milan and Genoa is highly advisable. Both have an enormous trade income, and since they are both quite big, you get a lot from taxes as well

[In3x]

How long is your turn length? 2 years?

[Aymer de Valence]

usual, 2 turns per year

[EmperorDan]

Mass two armies of 8 units each with 6 units of Heavy Infantry 1 or 2 catapult and 1 unit of cavalry, Heavy if possible or if not at least some sergeants. Try to get them in striking positions [attacking Genoa this would mean keeping them on a navy, right near their city] and do the job in just one turn, taking both their cities.

After this is done, fill their garrison with some militias and xbows and you are ready to go. A garrison made out of some 4 spear militias 4 heavy inf and 2 xbows can work wonders, if Milan gets Toulouse. However, you'll need this expensive garrison for a few turns, after their initial attack is wasted, their economy could not sustain further attacks. So you can disband the units if you want to, or use them to conquer Sardinia and Corsica. The world awaits you.

[Sleep1804]

Wipe out the nasty Milanese!Even if the HRE attacks, Bologna's cut off from the rest of the country. Sicily is too distant to retaliate before you take advantage of your new wealth and build up another army. If you happen to have a diplomat who can reach the Milanese the next turn, have him end the alliance so your reputation takes less of a hit. Is Hungary at war with the Byzantines too?

[Litoralis]

Wipe out the nasty Milanese!Even if the HRE attacks, Bologna's cut off from the rest of the country. Sicily is too distant to retaliate before you take advantage of your new wealth and build up another army. If you happen to have a diplomat who can reach the Milanese the next turn, have him end the alliance so your reputation takes less of a hit. Is Hungary at war with the Byzantines too?

Or if you have a ton of money, offer to buy Bologna for 5o,ooo over 5 turns or as many as HRE will take (I think I did 50,000 over 8 turns). Then pay the first payment, but quit after that. HRE will be pissed, but when I did it they didn't attack me. It goes without saying, however, that your Trustworthiness may go down a bit...

[Sleep1804]

Or if you have a ton of money, offer to buy Bologna for 5o,ooo over 5 turns or as many as HRE will take (I think I did 50,000 over 8 turns). Then pay the first payment, but quit after that. HRE will be pissed, but when I did it they didn't attack me. It goes without saying, however, that your Trustworthiness may go down a bit...

I did that in a campaign as Venice - but on the first turn! I gave the HRE all the money I had for Bologna, then it was easy to take all of Northern Italy. And by the time you have those four cities, you're pretty much unstoppable!

[dannyalex]

dont attack your allies,now if u really desperate to take some cities i suggest sent a diplomat first to cancel the alliance with Milan and then attack them

[ChivalrousKiller]

He'll have to choose between acting honourably or gaining the element of surprise, then

[Aymer de Valence]

hehe i ended the alliance in the same turn i took over Milan The Milanese took over Toulouse unfortunately but they're down to 3 regions (2 when i take Genoa very soon). They still only have 2 units in Genoa, and i'm playing on hard campaign difficulty

@sleep1804 - Unfortunately Hungary isn't at war with the Byzantines, just the HRE. They have quite a large army wandering through the Venice region at the moment (used to be a crusader army). I'm just hoping they're heading for Bologna and not Venice or newly captured Milan lol