A question on diplomacy

**Sweger** · July 18, 2011, 02:01 PM

I noticed, that after 60 turns or so, it's impossible to get map info from the AI, map info against your map info, is seen as "fair deal" but these offers always get rejected. Often I get a counteroffer where they offer money (normally 150-300 florins or so) for my map info. The point is that i want theirs, so I start to offer up to 2000 florins for their map info, and that is considered as "very generous" however the AI ALWAYS turns this down...

What's the sense of that, to I actually have to spam out spies just to keep my friggin map up to date?

However i think that the fog of war is slightly unrealistic in this sense: sure, you should not be able to see all agents and armies, but I'm sure the rulers new which regions were controlled by whom, i.e. I think you should be able to see the regionborders and settlements and the reigning power of that region.

**tudor93** · July 18, 2011, 02:18 PM

well, if you have a bad reputation even if your offers are very generous the AI refuses to deal with an untrustworthy person like you

**Silverheart** · July 18, 2011, 02:20 PM

It is usually because the AI has either
1) unchanged borders - no new map information to add to what you already have or
2) no interest in sharing their map information with a such a dangerous potential enemy as you.

You can still offer map information as a bonus to sweeten some deals, and make the AI more likely to accept.

**King Gambrinus** · July 18, 2011, 02:21 PM

I think factions that have poor to abysmal relations with you or if your reputation is poor are hardcoded to reject any map info demands. That doesn't come into the "deal-o-meter" but it's like some factions rejecting alliances for huge amounts of money 'cause they're going to attack you next turn.

Also, map info from big faction is pretty hard to get if you're a smaller faction. But that normally comes in with the "deal-o-meter"...

**AJenny58** · July 18, 2011, 03:20 PM

It is because they think you are going to use the map info to destroy them. I hate it that you don't know who is in control of lands. Sometimes you march to what you think will be a rebel settlement and it turns out someone else got there first and your relations with that faction drop just because they wouldn't give you map info.

**Diamond** · July 18, 2011, 05:58 PM

Originally Posted by AJenny58

It is because they think you are going to use the map info to destroy them. I hate it that you don't know who is in control of lands. Sometimes you march to what you think will be a rebel settlement and it turns out someone else got there first and your relations with that faction drop just because they wouldn't give you map info.

Send a spy into the territory first - relations won't drop and they have a great line of sight

**AJenny58** · July 18, 2011, 08:00 PM

Originally Posted by Diamond

Send a spy into the territory first - relations won't drop and they have a great line of sight

Yeah, this is good advice. I almost always forget to train agents. In my current campaign I have been doing this and it helps a lot.

**Sweger** · July 18, 2011, 03:23 PM

Well my, reputation was "reliable" and those who refused where mainly my allies with which my relations where either "very good" or "excellent" and my faction was at the time 5-6th biggest.

But it defenitely seem to be some kind of hardcoding there.

**Drustan** · July 18, 2011, 04:28 PM

Originally Posted by Sweger

Well my, reputation was "reliable" and those who refused where mainly my allies with which my relations where either "very good" or "excellent" and my faction was at the time 5-6th biggest.

But it defenitely seem to be some kind of hardcoding there.

In that case it's probably because you had all of their map information already.