I've seen the term "shock army" around these forums - what does that mean?
Shock Armies
I've seen the term "shock army" around these forums - what does that mean?
Biarchus
Re: Shock Armies
Most likely an army made up of extremely well trained units. Shock army would have a shock and awe effect on the enemy. They would be so dominate and effective, the enemy wouldnt have a chance.
An example of a shock unit in my opinion are the norse cleric horsemen from denmark. There so effective against enemy calvary that its almost unfair to even use them.
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Centenarius
Re: Shock Armies
i think of an Army that is Confident for the all-out attack. "FORward!" -- so lots of Knights / Heavy Cavalry, heavy infantry -- top tier units / high experience, armor / weapons upgrades etc...
The kind of army ready to move in and quickly engage the enemy, or to attack a settlement in one go and devaste everything.
Re: Shock Armies
a melee based army that rushes in to confront the enemy, hopefully before they finish setting up into their position. the attack usually comes from the front as well both flanks for maximum effect. it is most commonly used mainly by strong infantry factions with weaker cavalry and range units like Scotland, Denmark, etc.
Re: Shock Armies
Oh alright thanks guys. Why wouldn't you just use that army all the time
Re: Shock Armies
well, most factions don't have killer melee infantry units, but rather solid spear units to hold the line with. many factions have superb cavalry which combines very well with said spearmen, hammer and anvil Alexander style. many nations have better ranged options, be foot archers(Longbowmen, Scots Guard, Janissary Archers, etc), mounted archers(horse archers, jav cav, basically the Iberians and Eastern factions), Gunpowder, etc. the standard line tactics fit best for most factions, as its a much more stable and balanced formation. shock is a very specific formation and is there to help mitigate said factions' weaknesses(mainly lack of good cavalry and range options).
Artifex
Re: Shock Armies
You really should only use such tactics with a faction that lacks strong range/spear components. Best faction for it, by far, is the danes. 10 dism huscarls, 9 war clerics and a general is the ultimate shock army. Late Russia also does well with one of their ap inf and the elite cav.Originally Posted by 13lackGu4rd
Factions like HRE & scotland that get a strong spear/pike component should stick to hammer & anvil, because their inf will be wiped out against a shock army.
England & milan should base itself around the ranged components, because they are so strong.
Serious shock armies only work if you have both inf and cav superiority.
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Primicerius
Re: Shock Armies
Denmark is one of the favorites in MP.
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Re: Shock Armies
I did mention that it wasn't the standard but rather a specific case, so I really don't get your attitude here. anyway, if you have clear cavalry superiority than you should not use shock tactics! cavalry superiority=hammer and anvil, even if your anvil isn't as good. the reason Scotland uses shock armies is because Border Horses can't charge worth a damn, so your only options are either Mailed Knights of Feudal Knights, both of which still work fine against the AI's "brilliance" however on equal footing(as in better AI mods, MP or just very lucky to get the AI to actually charge your cavalry with its own) they'd lose to any elite cavalry unit. HRE doesn't use shock armies not because of their Armored Sergeants but because of the Imperial and Gothic Knights. that's not to say they can't use them, as they have all the components for it: Zweihanders and Forlon's Hope are brutal infantry troops, Dismounted Imperial Knights are good too. it's just that the HRE has so much more than infantry that it's just not worth it. oh, and Denmark, which even you admit uses shock tactics, has cavalry superiority? what...? Norse War Clerics aren't superior to Chivalric Knights, not to mention other elite cavalry(Lancers, Gothic Knights, Familia Ducale, Tsar's Guard, etc). it's because Denmark doesn't have cavalry superiority that they use shock tactics, not because they do...
Re: Shock Armies
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shock_troops.
For some history.
Last edited by Re_Minder; July 11, 2011 at 06:10 AM.
Artifex
Re: Shock Armies
My apologies if I came across a little aggresively in my previous post, I didn't intend it to be that way
What I was saying about the danes was more because they have both neccesary components early. Because war clerics only need an abbey, training is no problem and they are still very good(and from cities, a nice bonus). Huscarls are also an early addition to the army, replacing armoured seargents IIRC in the recruit tree.
Against late period armies they do lack a little, but the armies that they face at the time they have those units....
Shock armies have a lessening effect as time passes anyway, due to increasing morale/defense. That's why late period armies with similar strengths are used differently
Last edited by crzyrndm; July 12, 2011 at 01:45 AM.
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Re: Shock Armies
Playing as Portugal, you can make an army which is one general and nineteen (!) Jinettes, where u can approach, expend all of your javelins on your opponents, and withdraw, which can easily kill 300 while losing about ten. This is quite fun
Re: Shock Armies
Ah, okay. Now I have to ask (like the low-experience player I am) what is a hammer and anvil? I mean I think it's when you have your cavalry flank and repeat-charge them but does this require more than one cavalry unit? It seems when I charge with cavalry it's insanely difficult to get them out of the fray for another charge...
Re: Shock Armies
The Anvil holds it in place well the hammer smashes it.
Is normally more than 1 unit in the hammer and anvil.
Think a line of infantry holding a enemy attack, just enough to hold the enemy, Well your hammer blow flanks and hit the enemy from behind.
Just have to hope that the anvil is strong enough to hold well the hammer gets into position.
Re: Shock Armies
Alright, thanks for clarifying. Let the battle for cavalry superiority begin :p
Semisalis
Re: Shock Armies
I dont use any differently.
I just mass infantry and only have maybe 4 cavalry in an army pin the enemy with a double thick infantry line 2/3 infantry in the front line 1/3 behind who join the front line after the enemy's charge is wasted to bolster the line.
Cavalry ram into the center of the enemy's line from behind all 4 units on 1 enemy unit and brake it at that point they split 2 going left 2 right the moment the 2 next units brake cavalry pulls out to regroup the infantry line brakes in half folds up both flanks cavalry splits goes to the far flank of both enemy forces brakes them and wallah ur enemy has 2 smaller forces both shaken both cut off from each other and unable to escape because there outflanked on both sides with cavalry units behind.
Best shock tactic i found so farbrake the enemy in half brake the flank fold them up and its over ur enemy is trapped with no hope of escape and rapidly dropping morale so they fight very porely
Works well with pure infantry forces to just take ur best men and use them as the hammer
Only down side is that they move slower so ur anvil is more vulnerable and takes more damage before u can swing the hammer in.
Last edited by mesor; July 12, 2011 at 11:15 AM.
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