UN: Israel used excessive force on Nakba day.

[Sir Pignans]

http://www.haaretz.com/print-edition...a-day-1.371640

That's honestly surprising for me, I personally think the IDF was widely underequipped for this task, a water cannon (or similar crowd control devices such as tear gas) may have also forced protestors to retreat. But I still think that the UN should have conducted a full investigation, this condemnation seems awfully quick.

[Armenum]

Well the UN should also condemn some of the rowdy protests those days which got out of hand and specifically provoked Israeli troops into those actions. The Israeli response was harsh, but only after fierce protests by protesters who seemingly wanted to draw the attention of the Israeli army, and thus gather such condemnations.

[King Gambrinus]

I didn't realise the UN had the spine to condemn it. Now lets see them intervene...

[John ''True Grit'' Wayne]

The UN should be on the border keeping people away from each other if they are so concerned.The UN lets Israel get away with everything as the UN is a toothless chimp.And this trigger happy country has nukes

[Heathen Hammer]

Funny thing is, Israel actually has WMDs. Yet we don't see them same "liberation" process that occurred with Iraq and 2003.

[mrmouth]

Yeah, the UN...

[humvee2800]

Funny thing is, Israel actually has WMDs. Yet we don't see them same "liberation" process that occurred with Iraq and 2003.

So does Russia, which is a heck of alot more corrupt to boot.

[King Gambrinus]

Funny thing is, Israel actually has WMDs. Yet we don't see them same "liberation" process that occurred with Iraq and 2003.

You forget Israel is the USA's puppy. I wouldn't be surprised if they have to go to DC to get authorisation to use those. It's the price to pay for the US convincing the masses that Israel makes sense...

[humvee2800]

You forget Israel is the USA's puppy. I wouldn't be surprised if they have to go to DC to get authorisation to use those. It's the price to pay for the US convincing the masses that Israel makes sense...

North Korea is Taiwans puppet !

Sure is fun making baseless accusations.

[King Gambrinus]

North Korea is Taiwans puppet !

Sure is fun making baseless accusations. watching Fox news all day

If it wasn't for the US and their intervention in the ME, Israel wouldn't exist anymore. Any sane person will tell you that. In my book, that makes Israel a puppet state.

[Heavy Weapons Guy]

If it wasn't for the US and their intervention in the ME, Israel wouldn't exist anymore. Any sane person will tell you that. In my book, that makes Israel a puppet state.

USA is controlled by Jews what do you expect.

[John ''True Grit'' Wayne]

Funny thing is, Israel actually has WMDs. Yet we don't see them same "liberation" process that occurred with Iraq and 2003.

[molonthegreat]

The UN? Does anyone still care about what that big inefficient and generally useless organisation condemn? That's news for me.

[Surgeon]

Because Israel is a democracy, duh.

[King Gambrinus]

Because Israel is a democracy, duh.

That's right, I forgot the arabs in Israel have the vote, duh.

[Rome101]

That's right, I forgot the arabs in Israel have the vote, duh.

They do have a vote.

Ah! So they're the ones who vote for a zionist in power.

No, they vote for Arab parties, who have several seats in the parliament, who call for the complete dismantling of Israel.

(did I hear somebody say "fail"? You're a beacon of silly arguments)

I'm sorry, but I've heard from multiple people that most Arab-Israelis choose to boycott elections. Not 100% if that's true.

I don't know if "most" do, but there is a part of them who does that. And still, they are deciding not to vote - like 33% of the Israelis, mind you. Either be it an all-out boycott or just lack of interest in the political field, there's nothing to blame Israel for. They can't force people to vote. That's a part of democracy.
Besides, if they don't vote, how do they expect to install equality and get their interests taken care of?
To me, it seems like their choices are to participate in the democracy or fight it. And they choose, deliberately, to fight it.


To topic:
Funny the UN in condemning Israel's actions after they allowed thousands of civilians into Israel.
Last time I checked, breaching a sovereign country's border isn't something that goes unanswered. Only 14 deaths (and even that is, AFAIK, unconfirmed) - calculating the fact that many of these are probably the fault of a stampede to begin with, that's quite impressive.
The US, for example, would probably do a lot worse if Mexico had gotten up one day and decided to go all Sinko De Mayo with Molotov cocktails and stone hurling and guns and over the US border.
I mean, they basically invaded - some were not armed, other were. It's an invasion nontheless, and UNIFIL did nothing to stop them.

I don't understand why the UNIFIL even bothers to maintain a buffer zone between Israel and Syria if they don't even want to enforce it. Don't let your kid hit his brother repeatedly then get mad at the brother for fighting back. Blame yourself for not restraining the attacker first.

BTW:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VG0ic...eature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vFyjp...eature=related

[King Gambrinus]

They do have a vote.

No, they vote for Arab parties, who have several seats in the parliament, who call for the complete dismantling of Israel.

(did I hear somebody say "fail"? You're a beacon of silly arguments)

So it's just a minority that's being oppressed then.


I feel so much better...

[Georgy Zhukov]

So it's just a minority that's being oppressed then.


I feel so much better...

They don't have to serve in the army and they don't have to pay taxes. How exactly are they being oppressed?

[Sir Pignans]

Bollocks, there's no way you can call it an invasion. Maybe an 'armed incursion by irregular forces' if you really want to push it....

[Rome101]

Bollocks, there's no way you can call it an invasion. Maybe an 'armed incursion by irregular forces' if you really want to push it....

Call the elephant anyway you like. It's still an elephant. Yeah, "invasion" sounds a bit too intensive, but the facts remain clear: They pushed into the border, breached the fence, ran as far as Tel Aviv (in which, coincidentally, a Jihadist took over a bulldozer and started wrecking havoc, running over peoples and cars) and they had Molotov cocktails, rocks, flare guns (one had an actual gun)...
"Low-tech armed incursion by irregular forces" is a great naming, to be honest. But it's still an armed force breaching an enemy country. Sounds like an invasion to me. (to be clear, my parameters never change - Mexican drug dealers who run drugs and guns into the US border are also performing an invasion).



I have an interesting analogy regarding the UN blaming Israel for excessive force:

One day a kid named Israel went up to his teacher, Mr. UN and said, "Mr. UN, one of the kids in the class said he is going to take my lunch money tomorrow. What do I do?"
"Who is the kid?", replied Mr. UN and added, "Tell me his name and I'll make sure everything is gonna be alright".
"His name is Arabs, I sure hope you'll talk him out of it sir."
"Sure will kiddo, don't you worry", promised the teacher and set off to gate.

The next day, Arabs comes up to Israel before lunch and says:
"Hey Israel, where's my money you douche?"
Israel replies:
"You're not taking away my money! I need to buy lunch with it, it's a long day at school today and I'll be really hungry if I don't eat my lunch! Go buy your damn own food!", said Israel. He looked around for his teacher, and saw him standing in the hall, observing the two boys arguing over the lunch money.
"That's no way to treat a friend, Israel", slowly replied Arabs, knuckling his fists loudly. "I'm gonna show you what it's like not to give me my lunch money!", said Arabs as he pushed Israel into the wall. Israel turned his eyes on Mr. UN, but he just stood there, raising his shoulders as if asking, "What do you want me to do? You're a big boy - handle this yourself".
Israel, afraid its lunch money is going to be taken, shoved Arabs back. Arabs didn't like that, and raised a fisted hand into the air, flinging it towards Israel's face.
Israel, thinking the worse is going to happen, did the only thing it had left to do - it kicked Arabs in the groin, suffered Arabs's fist but replied with a fist of its own.
Arabs laid down on the ground, bleeding through the nose and holding its junk, twitched in pain.

Then, Mr. UN rushed in and grabbed Israel by the hand.
"What do you think you're doing Israel?! This is no way to treat a classmate! You're coming with me, let's see what the principal has to say about that. Your parents will hear about this, you barbaric beast!"


You see, that's just about what happened - the UN decided not to prevent the Arabs from breaking into Israel (even though it said it will), then blamed Israel for doing the only thing it knew how to do.
Should Israel (in the analogy) invest in Tai-Kwan-Do lessons, so it can apprehend Arabs the next time it attacks? (Tai-Kwan-Do is an analogy to more advanced crowd control methods) The answer is yes.
Could it do anything else in that moment? The answer is no.
Should the UN blame Israel for walking the only path available, one it was forced to walk down because the UN couldn't keep its promises? Again, the answer is no.

And to be fair, Israel tried tear gas and rubber bullets, as well as verbal warnings and warning shots - but the protesters came prepared against gas, were not deterred by the rubber bullets and ignored all warnings. Israel, by the way, never used an actual bullet against demonstrators, only against incursions who wouldn't respond to verbal warnings and rubber bullets.
Among the 14 claimed dead by the Syrian government (the same one that claims it is not killing hundreds of its own people), you can account for:
People who got stamped to death
Accidental ricocheting of rubber bullets hitting peoples' heads
People who fell down the very rocky steep hills as they charged down them en-mass, and finally
People who died because of mines; the area is filled with early-20th-century mines, some date back as far as the British fighting the Ottomans of WWI; it has been reported that Molotov cocktails and burning tires set fire to the local fields, which were dry from the heat of the summer's sun; the fire spread widely and caused several mines to blow off.