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    Vanoi's Avatar Dux Limitis
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    Default Terror leader lives freely near Pakistani capital

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110615/...tan_jihadistan

    ISLAMABAD, Pakistan – On the outskirts of the Pakistani capital lives a militant considered so powerful that Osama bin Laden consulted with him before issuing a fatwa to attack American interests.
    Fazle-ur-Rahman Khalil heads Harakat-ul-Mujahedeen, a terrorist group closely aligned with al-Qaida and a signatory to bin Laden's anti-U.S. fatwa in 1998. Khalil has also dispatched fighters to India, Afghanistan, Somalia, Chechnya and Bosnia, was a confidante of bin Laden and hung out with 9/11 mastermind Khalid Sheikh Mohammed.
    Pakistani authorities are clearly aware of Khalil's whereabouts. But they leave him alone, just as they tolerate other Kashmiri militant groups nurtured by the military and its intelligence agency to use against India.
    continued
    Khalil is also useful to the authorities because of his unusually wide contacts among Pakistan's many militant groups, said a senior government official who is familiar with the security agencies and who spoke on condition he not be identified fearing repercussions.
    Khalil's presence in an Islamabad suburb, confirmed to The Associated Press by Western officials in the region, underscores accusations that Pakistan is still playing a double game — fighting some militant groups while tolerating or supporting others — even after the solo U.S. raid that killed bin Laden on May 2.
    The U.S. Congress, enraged that bin Laden found refuge for at least five years down the street from Pakistan's equivalent of West Point, has threatened to cut off the billions of dollars in aid being spent here.
    Obama administration officials and U.S. Army officers are trying to rebuild the relationship, considered vital to American hopes of negotiating an end to the Afghan war, but if anything the two sides appear to have drifted further apart in recent weeks.
    Pakistan's intelligence service has arrested five Pakistanis who fed information to the CIA before the American raid that killed bin Laden, according to a Western official in Pakistan.
    The group of detained Pakistanis included the owner of a safe house rented to the CIA to observe bin Laden's compound in the military town of Abbottabad, a U.S. official said. The owner was detained along with a "handful" of other Pakistanis, said the official.
    Also, CIA Director Leon Panetta confronted Pakistan's intelligence service about tipping off militants running bomb factories aimed at killing U.S. soldiers in Afghanistan. Pakistan denied tipping them off. The militants belong to the Haqqani network, an Afghan Taliban faction that has ties to al-Qaida.
    Khalil's Harakat-ul-Mujahedeen, blamed for a deadly attack on the American Consulate in Karachi in 2002, has links to the Haqqanis and is considered a terrorist organization by the U.S. Hundreds of militants are thought to belong to his organization, though the strength of these groups are the links they share with each other, say analysts.
    Khalil himself is not on any U.S. wanted list. In the Islamabad suburb of Golra Sharif, he lives in a nondescript two-story compound that includes a seminary or religious school, hidden behind a traditional high wall protected by barbed wire.
    Reached by the AP on his cell phone last month, Khalil dismissed suggestions that he may have been in touch with bin Laden while the al-Qaida leader was hiding in Abbottabad.
    "It is 100 percent wrong, it's rubbish," Khalil said. "Osama did not have contact with anybody." The AP obtained Khalil's phone number from a former aide who has since left the terror organization.
    The Pakistani senior government official who spoke with AP said Khalil has been arrested twice but each time was released on orders from Pakistan's intelligence agency.
    "He was significant for Osama bin Laden," the official said. "He has connections with all these groups in Waziristan but he is living here and we don't go after him. He is the one you go to when you need to get to these groups," tracking kidnap victims for example.
    Khalil was once the boss of terror leader Ilyas Kashmiri, believed killed in a drone strike on June 3.

    Like most of the militant groups that get a wink and a nod from Pakistan's security agencies, Harakat-ul-Mujahedeen's primary focus is Kashmir, a picturesque region divided between India and Pakistan and claimed by each in its entirety. Kashmir has been the cause of two of three wars between the South Asian neighbors and brought them perilously close to a nuclear confrontation in 2000.
    Khalil's group has kidnapped foreigners in Indian Kashmir, killing one. His group also helped in the 1999 hijacking of an Indian airlines plane that resulted in the release of three militants, including Ahmed Omar Saeed Sheikh, who is now on death row for his part in the 2002 killing of Wall Street Journal reporter Daniel Pearl.
    Khalil's militant ties include the anti-Indian Lashkar-e-Taiba group, blamed for masterminding the November 2008 assault on Mumbai that killed 166 people. The AP learned from the same official that seven training camps are operating in Pakistani Kashmir and most of them are run by Jamaat-ud-Dawwa, the name Lashkar-e-Taiba took after being banned.
    "There are seven jihadi camps working in Kashmir right now, giving them explosives training," the official said. He said military and intelligence agencies say the camps provide Pakistan with "strategic depth."
    "They say we need them, otherwise India will treat us like the rest of South Asia, like they can dictate," he said. "It is only the military and intelligence. The government has no say."
    Pakistan has said it has severed its links with these Kashmiri militant groups, though many suspect that is not the case. But it does recognize the dangers posed by some militant groups in another corner of Pakistan — near the Afghan border.
    Since deploying troops in 2004 to the region near the Afghan border, Pakistan has lost 3,000 soldiers to militant attacks, more casualties than NATO has suffered over 10 years in Afghanistan.
    "Our concern at this point in time is our involvement with northwest Pakistan. We cannot manage to open a new front in central Punjab and in south Punjab," where these groups are headquartered, said a senior military official on condition of anonymity. "Our army is not well trained for counterterrorism in urban centers and we do not have the capacity in our civil law enforcement agencies" to go after these groups.
    But many Pakistanis wonder how they got to this place, besieged by militants who bomb them daily while suffering a litany of criticisms and perceived humiliations from their U.S. allies for not doing enough.
    Dr. Pervez Hoodbhoy, a physicist, columnist and peace activist, recently dubbed his homeland "Jihadistan," saying it wasn't always this way. He laid the blame on an array of players for the current state of affairs in Pakistan.
    In a recent column, he first pointed the finger at former military dictator Gen. Mohammed Zia ul Haq. Zia made Islamic radicalism the centerpiece of his military and political strategy, launching the country and the security forces on a path of religious extremism.
    Hoodbhoy then blamed Washington's Cold War doctrine that partnered the United States with Saudi Arabia, Egypt and Zia's Pakistan in the 1980s to embrace Islamic radicalism to defeat Soviet forces in Afghanistan. The partnership brought Islamic radicals from across the Middle East to Pakistan.
    The strategy worked, and the Russians left Afghanistan. But the cost of victory was a toxic mix of Islamic radicals.
    "Jihadistan is a messy place these days, a far cry from the simple bastion of anti-communism in the 1980s," he wrote. "Today the military must kill some of its former proteges and some radicals even as it secretly supports others."
    A former U.S. ambassador to Islamabad says throwing money at Pakistan won't wean it off jihadi groups so long as its fear of India dictates its security policies.
    "It is the perception of India as the primary threat to the Pakistani state that colors its perceptions of the conflict in Afghanistan and Pakistan's security needs," Anne Patterson said in a 2009 cable made public by WikiLeaks.
    She said the United States should discourage India from excessive involvement in Afghanistan, and scale back American military sales to New Delhi. "We need to reassess Indian involvement in Afghanistan and our own policies toward India, including the growing military relationship through sizable conventional arms sales, as all of this feeds Pakistani establishment paranoia and pushes them closer to both Afghan and Kashmir-focused terrorist groups while reinforcing doubts about U.S. intentions," Patterson said in the memo.

    What do you know, a terrorist leader living freely in Pakistan, and the Pakistanis are doing nothing about it. This to me is just more evidence that the US should stop sending aid to Pakistan. They say they are helping the US fight terrorism while they continue to hide terrorists in their own capital. The relationship between the US and Pakistan has failed, and i would rather see the aid sent to another country whom the US can actually trust.
    Last edited by Darth Red; June 16, 2011 at 09:27 AM. Reason: spoiler

  2. #2
    Trey's Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Re: Terror leader lives freely near Pakistani capital

    It's alright. None of the Pakistanis seem to care if their country is going to hell in a hand basket.
    for-profit death machine.

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    Default Re: Terror leader lives freely near Pakistani capital

    This isn't surprising, there are quite a few terrorists living on Pakistani soil
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    Default Re: Terror leader lives freely near Pakistani capital

    This is going towards a really bad direction.
    The Armenian Issue
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    Babur's Avatar ز آفتاب درخشان ستاره می
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    Default Re: Terror leader lives freely near Pakistani capital

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDarkLordSeth View Post
    This is going towards a really bad direction.
    Yeah along with arresting informants who help gather intelligence on militants
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    Default Re: Terror leader lives freely near Pakistani capital

    Quote Originally Posted by Babur View Post
    Yeah along with arresting informants who help gather intelligence on militants
    Time to send in Seal Team 6 again?

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    saglam2000's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: Terror leader lives freely near Pakistani capital

    It's like nurturing rabid dogs for fun
    "The Turks are never trapped. It's the people who surround them who are in trouble."Anthony Hebert

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    MathiasOfAthens's Avatar Comes Rei Militaris
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    Default Re: Terror leader lives freely near Pakistani capital

    Pakistan is suffering from two ideological forces. You have the westerners on one side and the religious fanatics on the other who have been recruiting their type into certain sectors of the Pakistani Military or intelligence.

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    LaMuerte's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Terror leader lives freely near Pakistani capital

    So ... both the Russians and the Americans lost the war in Afhganistan?

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    Default Re: Terror leader lives freely near Pakistani capital

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMuerte View Post
    So ... both the Russians and the Americans lost the war in Afhganistan?
    No? The war in Afghanistan isn't over?

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    LaMuerte's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Terror leader lives freely near Pakistani capital

    Quote Originally Posted by Azoth View Post
    No? The war in Afghanistan isn't over?
    How can the Americans/NATO ever win in this hotbed of deceit?

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    Default Re: Terror leader lives freely near Pakistani capital

    Why am I not surprised. Pakistanis are probably going to regret this some day when suicide bombs and so on goes off on a weekly basis in Lahore and other large cities.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Terror leader lives freely near Pakistani capital

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMuerte View Post
    How can the Americans/NATO ever win in this hotbed of deceit?
    We can't lose, at the very worst we just go home. The real losers are the Pakistani people, they're the ones that have to rot in the crap hole they are creating. You make the bed you sleep in, and America's bed is one of the comfiest in the world.

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    LaMuerte's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Terror leader lives freely near Pakistani capital

    Quote Originally Posted by brandbll View Post
    We can't lose, at the very worst we just go home. The real losers are the Pakistani people, they're the ones that have to rot in the crap hole they are creating. You make the bed you sleep in, and America's bed is one of the comfiest in the world.
    Then the Russians didn't lose either , they just went home as well. Going home , without reaching your objective (stabilizing Afghanistan / dismantling Al-Qaeda and Taleban) , counts for a defeat , no? All those soldiers' lives that got lost , the immense cost of the whole operation ,....If I follow your logic America didn't lose the Vietnam war either , because they just went home.

    I agree though that the real losers are as usual the common people...
    Last edited by LaMuerte; June 16, 2011 at 11:10 AM.

  15. #15

    Default Re: Terror leader lives freely near Pakistani capital

    Quote Originally Posted by brandbll View Post
    We can't lose, at the very worst we just go home.
    That would be technically a strategic defeat, just like with USSR.
    The real losers are the Pakistani people, they're the ones that have to rot in the crap hole they are creating.
    Not Pakistani people, only their government.

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    CamilleBonparte's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Terror leader lives freely near Pakistani capital

    Send in the Seals.
    "If History is deprived of the truth, we are left with nothing but an idle, unprofitable tale." - Polybius
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    Default Re: Terror leader lives freely near Pakistani capital

    The HUM is one of the military/ISI darlings, its predecessors as well. Musharraf one of their protectors. The military establishment has always had a policy of using and nurturing these groups until they started to create problems, then disbanded them/killed a few, and used the remnants to start a new group. The military still thinks it can do so without little damage. Over the years they've lost track and count so it seems. They don't care if they have links with AQ, they think they can separate the two and hold an acceptable level of control. They live on another planet.

    The same logic can be applied to how they deal with FATA - punitive actions against these 'illiterate savages' should be enough to cajole them back into submission. As the British did. Go in, kill in large numbers, torch the place and leave. They are clueless in who they are dealing with.

    The mindset of the Pak military is sectarian: First of all they are military, a closed society in general, in the case of Pakistan they really think they are the only one capable and smart enough to govern Pakistan and they truly think they can outsmart everyone else on the planet. Read Musharraf biography, a pompous ego, vain beyond any normal standard, bad analyses, strategically weak, an ideologist, a great tactician though.

    Pakistan's military is walking into the trap it has laid out for itself. India who can do a lot more to ease tension with Pakistan, is also playing its murky game as in blocking a Kashmir settlement, the nuclear deal with the USA has triggered a new nuclear arms race. The USA plays along following it's own interest, hoping in vain it can push Pakistan into another direction, that's based on the false assumption (I hear that too many times, also here) that Pakistan is a proxy for them or the Chinese. We also like to think we're smarter than others. Our Pakistani allies play their own game, we have no shared interest with them, they are using us. We're all marching not into folly but towards a genuine disaster if it continues like this.
    Last edited by Gumpfendorfer; June 16, 2011 at 05:02 AM.

  18. #18

    Default Re: Terror leader lives freely near Pakistani capital

    I think the conclusion that the US needs to stop helping develop India's military and nuclear program because it scares Pakistan is completely flawed. India is obviously the future of south asia and as a democracy that values human rights, it deserves to be treated not as a pawn but as a partner. Long term, the relationship with India will be far more important than the relationship with Pakistan. That doesn't mean that turning Pakistan around isn't also important, but it shouldn't been done at the expense of US-Indian relations.

  19. #19

    Default Re: Terror leader lives freely near Pakistani capital

    Quote Originally Posted by Sphere View Post
    I think the conclusion that the US needs to stop helping develop India's military and nuclear program because it scares Pakistan is completely flawed. India is obviously the future of south asia and as a democracy that values human rights, it deserves to be treated not as a pawn but as a partner. Long term, the relationship with India will be far more important than the relationship with Pakistan. That doesn't mean that turning Pakistan around isn't also important, but it shouldn't been done at the expense of US-Indian relations.
    Not really, no, because the military build up is aimed against Pakistan which has not been the only country responsible for the tensions/wars between the two countries. Tension which are rising. Human right in India are a joke as they are in Pakistan, that's no argument either. Indian-US relations do not suffer if you leave out the nuclear and military stuff for the obvious reasons. Would be a nice change for a change if foreign relations are not solely based on guns, geopolitical reasons, or the quick buck for an ailing nuclear industry, in other words the short term, go directly against possible long term consequences. And if you do in this case the USA could have bargained for more -solving the Kashmir.

    The possible risks are far too big.

  20. #20
    Darth_Revan's Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Re: Terror leader lives freely near Pakistani capital

    Pakistan is not doing anything to help itself when it comes to international relations with Western nations.. India should annex it in the future and reclaim its old borders to what it once was before the Brits and Muslim nationalists under Jinnah tore it apart.

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