Belief in god but not the church

[RO Citizen]

I've lost my confidence in any Church way before becoming an Atheist. I actually think I believed only in some kind of God for like 4-5 years.

[Veliky Kaiser Theos]

That is what I would call "good" religion. None of the muck that results from organization.

[Pontifex Maximus]

OPs do not have the right to request thread closures, thread reopened.

[Ancient Aliens]

Self interpretation of the divine is just the step before atheism. You'll come to the same conclusion we all did eventually.

[Ancient Aliens]

Not really, because I would have stepped on the path called atheism long time ago. Despite being a science fan I still retain my belief partly because of the creation of the world.

Based more or less on my perception I am already a Deist.

There is still time for you to mull those all important questions around in your mind. And there are other answers to the concept of creationism other than those of a god or gods.

As with regards to the morals I for one do not need to be told by the Church what is moral and what is not, I believe that following what is true to your own set principles is much more productive for you and for those around you without having to respect a very strict set of rules.

Good. Ultimately it doesn't matter if people are deists or atheists, as long as they don't allow themselves to be the puppets of the morally bankrupt, whoever they may be.

[xcorps]

Funny that. I was born and raised a Catholic, but left the Catholic church based for quite a few reasons. I now follow a non denominational path that has strengthened my relationship with God. But maybe because I didn't interpet God, instead I interpeted the Church.

[Lysimachos11]

I used to believe in the Christian (Churchly) God also, not because of being raised a Christian but because I went to Christian schools (Catholic lower, Protestant higher). I was sort of raised with the idea that there was a God that you could communicate with and that watched over the world so to speak. The idea of a God has therefore always appealed to me.

However after studying philosophy (mostly in my free time with the odd course at uni) I came to the conclusion that the thing called God is actually the reason that permeates the universe. It's totally not original as ever since the earliest philosophers do they identify the godly with Logos. But it makes a lot of sense actually. For me reason is reasoned thinking but also the fact that the laws of nature are the same everywhere on a consistent basis. You cant have a ball falling upwards. For me that regulating power is God or the Godly.

Is that Godly thing conscious? You might think no at first, but we as humans possess reason and we are conscious. That is something. The only thing that, for me at least, rules out a purely Christian (Churchly) God is it's emphasis on belief instead of on reasoned thinking. Believing means not excercising man's greatest power, which is the power of reason. I have reasoned that there can be a God now, I did not just assume so because they told me in school.

[Cooraan]

Churches are only good to strengthen your belief with God through fellow Christians and through the sermons by the preacher. If you feel you aren't getting what you should from a church leave it, there are many good Churches out there. Try a small informal church, you'd be surprised at how much better they can be.

[Hilarion]

Anyone here the same as me? I'm a firm believer in God, that something somewhere up there created this world but on the other side I do not believe in the Church.

I've been raised as a Christian Orthodox but I don't believe in it any longer. I did but as I grew up I felt that there is no need to intermediate the relationship between a simple man and God, and that the relationship should strictly be man to God, to put it that way.

Anyone here as well?

Unfortunately, as Ancient Aliens pointed out, you're on the road to atheism. The Church is a community, brought together to worship God. Forsake the Church and you isolate yourself from this community, inviting neglect of God and departure from Christianity, in which the intimate bond between worshipers shared in the Church is both natural and essential. Unless you're willing to take up asceticism, I'd recommend reconciling your differences and returning to the Church.

[Visna]

Anyone here the same as me? I'm a firm believer in God, that something somewhere up there created this world but on the other side I do not believe in the Church.

I've been raised as a Christian Orthodox but I don't believe in it any longer. I did but as I grew up I felt that there is no need to intermediate the relationship between a simple man and God, and that the relationship should strictly be man to God, to put it that way.

Anyone here as well?

Congratulations, you're well on your way to become a deist. Or *gasp* an atheist. The Church acting as the official medium for contact to and interpretation of God is a truly bizarre construction. They might as well lecture their flock on the nature of dragons as far as I see it.

[Poet]

Anyone here the same as me? I'm a firm believer in God, that something somewhere up there created this world but on the other side I do not believe in the Church.

I've been raised as a Christian Orthodox but I don't believe in it any longer. I did but as I grew up I felt that there is no need to intermediate the relationship between a simple man and God, and that the relationship should strictly be man to God, to put it that way.

Anyone here as well?

I congratulate you on feeling this. There is certainly no one to intermediate the relationship between a simple man and God. In Christondom Priest was given this power to hear confessions and to issue ceritficates of innocence, in Islam some mullahs took these powers by themselves, but certainly man is free and there is one God enough to bow before, why bring someone between men and their creator. May God guides you to the best.

[Prodigal]

Outside of the Church we are lost. Christ established His Church for a reason, and It lives today! How blessed you were to be baptized into it, I pray that you return.

[Ancient Aliens]

Outside of the Church we are lost. Christ established His Church for a reason, and It lives today! How blessed you were to be baptized into it, I pray that you return.

Did I enter a time warp to the 13th century?

[Hilarion]

Did I enter a time warp to the 13th century?

Kaitsar was writing sincerely in modern English, not sure how you think it came from the 13th century. Maybe if he had said it in Latin...

[Poet]

Outside of the Church we are lost. Christ established His Church for a reason, and It lives today! How blessed you were to be baptized into it, I pray that you return.

Chruch or Mosque is good for prayers, priest and Mullah are good to take responsibility of religious rituals, but men hate men when they try to be God. It's a simple fact.

[Sphere]

Even if you are convinced that there must have been/is a creator of the universe, there is something incredibly self centered in thinking that one has a direct communication channel with said creator, and that he has a plan for you.

Obviously it might be pleasing to the ego to think this to be the case. Indeed, even a cursory look around human history shows that people seem to be getting divine directions all the time. But at the same time these divine directions and the supposed diety giving these directions are myriad and contradictory. And even more telling, these communications seem to almost exclusively support/fit into pre-existing beliefs.

I mean, how can hundreds of millions of muslims earnestly pray to this God five times a day, and fail pick up the slightest hint that the Koran doesn't contain the true word of God? How is it that near constant communication with the divine consistently leads to false beliefs? And you can fill in the previous statement with essentially any of the thousands of religions, dead or alive, violent or peaceful, polytheist or monotheistic, all of which considered as a whole greatly enhance my point. If there is a singular God behind all this communication, he is either schizophrenic, deceptive, or so unclear as to be mysterious beyond all comprehension and should be ignored as a matter of course.

I think the far safer, and more honest conclusion would be that we as homo sapiens have a craving in our nature, whereby we desire to be both incredibly important, enough so that the creator of all existance cares about us personally. But also we need to have support and approval for our actions, preferably of a divine nature. And we seek that approval whether it be declaring war on Troy, or changing career.

Working with that premise, the history of religion, and more specifically the results of prayer/"divine" communication throughout history make complete of sense. It explains why the Aztecs can conclude that the divine demands human sacrifice and the Jain's can conclude that it is very important to the divine that we do not hurt flies and ants.

[hellas1]

@Basileos Leandros I,

In my thread, I discuss the fact that Biblical Christianity DOES NOT say anything about an intermediator, such as a priest or pastor.

Biblical Christianity DOES speak of Elders, deacons, Apostles, Pastors, Evangelists, Teachers, Prophets and all gifts of the Holy Spirit but NOT a hierarchy, which is what I'm saying and which the New Testament pattern supports.

That's it.
hellas1.5

[Basileos Leandros I]

Even if you are convinced that there must have been/is a creator of the universe, there is something incredibly self centered in thinking that one has a direct communication channel with said creator, and that he has a plan for you.

That's taking it much, much too far. I didn't say he has a plan for me or anyone else, I was just referring to the fact that it should be a "personal relationship", for the lack of a better word rather than anything else.

Obviously it might be pleasing to the ego to think this to be the case. Indeed, even a cursory look around human history shows that people seem to be getting divine directions all the time. But at the same time these divine directions and the supposed diety giving these directions are myriad and contradictory. And even more telling, these communications seem to almost exclusively support/fit into pre-existing beliefs.

I didn't argue about directions or divine intervention, I simply stated my belief about God and the Church.

[basics]

To believe in God, that is to know God, one has to be born again, and that means whether you like it or not, you are the church. So where does that leave the others such as the poster? Religious? Perhaps, but no more than that. In other words he believes there is something supernatural but what, he has no idea.

Put another way, one has to be a part of the body that comprises the church if one is to know God. It is a Spiritual entity in which all the parts are bound together by the Spirit of God so that each part works to the glory of the Head who is Jesus Christ our Lord. It is not an outward seen building and doesn't need any seen things to make it work simply because all its works begin inwardly.

But, and there is always a but, members of the body of Christ are obliged to associate with other members for mutual benefit, not to hide themselves away, so that what God has to say can be appreciated by all who do assemble together as His messages are not always delivered to one and all especially in accordance to the gifts given in their disparity.

[xcorps]

Obviously it might be pleasing to the ego to think this to be the case. Indeed, even a cursory look around human history shows that people seem to be getting divine directions all the time. But at the same time these divine directions and the supposed diety giving these directions are myriad and contradictory. And even more telling, these communications seem to almost exclusively support/fit into pre-existing beliefs.

.

It's quite the opposite for me. When I contemplate God's plan and my place in it, it makes me feel quite insignificant and small. It makes me strive to better myself, in thought and deed, so as to be more worthy of judgement. Usually, I fail. But one never quits.