TROM3 - Feedback and Suggestions

[Edax]

That's somewhat correct, becoming a Ronin wasn't a popular avenue either, Seppuku was the choice of the Majority of beaten Samurai. But yes most samurai would not serve a conquering Daimyo unless their Daimyo was subjegated as well, then they would have no choice in the matter. This tactic was done frequently in the Sengoku Jidai period. Vassals would be one label you could throw on it but the situations were far more diverse then is represented ingame.

Also for the sake of game balance: Ikko-Ikki can't recruit Samurai units for obvious historical reasons, so Ronin are their best and only option. So if Yarkis was to make Ronin available to all, then for fairness sake he must all make samurai available to Ikko-Ikki. Also why a Faction that can build Samurai would want Ronin, besides for flavour is beyond me?

Maybe Ronin would have a lower upkeep cost, but Samurai would have higher moral? A Ronin could be a discount Samurai, or be a means to bolster your elite infantry strength beyond the unit cap, but by not being true Samurai, would not have the same pride as being one and thus more likely to break in battle.

[Chrysantheme]

i think it doesn't have to be unbalanced to ad ronins to all clans. for example, there could be different unit caps for ikko and the other clans (you just need to copy the ronins, give them a uniqe id and other unit caps - ingame they would look the same, but all clans exept ikko could get lower unit caps then ikko).

but then they should be recruitable in logicial buildings - maybe high level economic buildings (merchant guild for example) - and they should get a penality (lower morale is a good idea i think).

[[G-Shock]]

Yes that's the link.

With the turns I am referring to recruitment times, not how the year is divided. If it takes 2 turns to build a unit and 5 to merge into a general, the AI will NEVER be able to defend anything at all.

[Yarkis de Bodemloze]

Yes that's the link.

With the turns I am referring to recruitment times, not how the year is divided. If it takes 2 turns to build a unit and 5 to merge into a general, the AI will NEVER be able to defend anything at all.

The AI in S2 is set to all assault attacks. No mod will change that. You can only make it placid, but then it will not attack at all ( I treid that). TROM3 favours a slower gameplay. Both the player and the AI need more time to build up and battles are more decisive. That's on purpose and I have no intention to change it. My hope is that with the next patch the AI is more competent in battles, especially sieges. The problem of the AI in TROM3 (and vanilla) is not that it hasn't enough troops, the problem is that it ruins its armies in sieges. If it would starve the player out instead of mindlessly running aginst walls people would cry for easier difficulty settings.

[[G-Shock]]

You're dead right on that, of course... but if you read again the problem I reported when I fought vs Amako, you'll see in about 20 yrs I conquered from Nagato to Kii, and meeting only ONE army from Amako in Ise (and this army did not fight because Amako surrendered).
Perhaps it would be better to rise a bit more the autoresolve odds needed to win. At least with credible losses the player may also be slowed down which gives AI a chance.

[Kurisu Paifuaa]

Indeed. The relative scarcity of troops compared to vanilla was one of the most compelling features from the onset and imho vastly improved gameplay. It would be better to address plausibility in time and movement scale by changing the superficial presentation instead.

Towards the end of my recently resigned campaign, I had an AI stack (with many reinforcements) siege my last town for the maximum duration. My only hope (and expectation) was that it would smash itself foolishly in an assault. For whatever reason, it did not and my game was effectively over. It certainly plays it correctly on occasion, but what factors into that decision making isn't obvious. It's certainly far too infrequent.

[whitewolfmxc]

well heres some ideas :

1) own Territory own troops speed increased (you know the roads and no afraid of being attacked , full map speed)

2) enemy territory own troops speed decreased (you dont always know your way , the locals arent helping , your afraid of ambush so need to scout ahead and advance accordingly)

3) The more decent a territory has , the more attrition / and speed reduction on your troops will have be it enemy or own territory

4) winter should decrease movement speed a lot , same goes for special events like (monsoon random scripted events etc)

5) longer to assimilate captured cities , script so that it takes at least 1 - 2 turns (depending on city size) to let the AI or player repairing / building / recruiting / supplying lost troops in the captured settlement , to simulate the time to set up ruling system and governor etc , also help stop blitzing

[Yarkis de Bodemloze]

well heres some ideas :

1) own Territory own troops speed increased (you know the roads and no afraid of being attacked , full map speed)

2) enemy territory own troops speed decreased (you dont always know your way , the locals arent helping , your afraid of ambush so need to scout ahead and advance accordingly)

3) The more decent a territory has , the more attrition / and speed reduction on your troops will have be it enemy or own territory

4) winter should decrease movement speed a lot , same goes for special events like (monsoon random scripted events etc)

5) longer to assimilate captured cities , script so that it takes at least 1 - 2 turns (depending on city size) to let the AI or player repairing / building / recruiting / supplying lost troops in the captured settlement , to simulate the time to set up ruling system and governor etc , also help stop blitzing

Sadly I see no way to implement your suggestions. There are no variables for such changes and scripting is very much limited.

[Chrysantheme]

The Shogun always had a gardener with the title "Oniwaban". This gardener was a ninja himself with connections to other ninjas - if the Shogun needs the service of a ninja, he just walks in his garden and talks to the gardener about it (to the Oniwaban).

I think Oniwaban could be a better fitting name for the "Kisho Ninja Master".

[Kruik]

In the realm of playable minor factions, I'd like to see Yamana and Ouchi added to the list. I've found that region of the map to be rather lacking in playable factions (with only Mori to be played), and I think there is more than enough historical information that might allow for some uniqueness and differentiation.

[crunchyfrog]

Ikko Ikkis's Katana ashigaru are pretty weak compared to yari ashigaru.

Katana ashigaru:
Attack: 4
Charge: 5
Defense: 5

Ikko Ikki yari ashigaru:
Attack: 3
Charge: 8
Defense: 6

Regular yari ashigaru:
Attack: 4
Charge: 8
Defense: 7

Oh, and killing anything in melee in the (only this new version?) apparently takes forever, and archers are complete killing machines. The AI is pretty smart about this, and just spams daisho samurais, backed up by archer spam.

My whole army was practically gone before it could even get engaged in melee. It's pretty ridiculous too see that, and then see two units fight each other for 10 minutes in melee.

Ps. What's the point of having ranked-by-fire when all your ranks can fire?

[Yarkis de Bodemloze]

Melee hasn't changed in v1.5. Ikko katana ashigaru will win against the ikko yari ashigaru despite those stats, because katana have hidden advantages (probably related to their animation). Ranked fire lets fire all men with no line of sight problems and the unit gets a reload bonus.

[crunchyfrog]

Hmm, sorry... I had a other .pack file to alter the missile damage.

Funny, it was DMS_Projectile boost pack, which changes the damage multiplier to 0.85, and you haven't altered it from the vanilla 1.0. But it caused the missile damage to go through the roof.

The melee thing is apparently simply because units get to the exhausted state in no time.

Great mod, I've done some tweaks to my likings, like slighty less combat exhaustion and slight regeneration when walking. Spear infantry stronger in auto resolve(look at swords and missile troops kill amounts against these in auto resolved battle reports) and removed of the "unique" level 1 markets, sake dens and temples (Why is this on? Why shouldn't i be able to upgrade one in a region to level 1 before i've upgraded the other one?).

[bydlo]

Maybe recruitment priority and limits should be tweaked a bit? Because the late game is very boring. I can just stomp armies like this with cavalry zerg, and castles sieges a big cheat for a player. Because poor teppo ashigaru can't do much on the walls.

[The_Nord]

I just have a suggestion that could increase the realism to the mod. The Oda long yari ashigaru have the type of Yari I believe is the correct one Nagae-yari and pike and shot yari should use. It's a long straight edged yari. The yari samurai should have the trident looking yari in my opinion, and the great guard should be the only cavalry unit whom have the trident spear.

[Loger]

Hey! I love the mod, it's really brilliant. One of the only things I'm miffed about is (as with crunchy and bydlo) the recruitment priority of the AI. They make far too many shooty units compared to how many melees they got. Makes some fights quite boring, sadly. I don't think archer damage should be nerfed but maybe giving them less ammo would balance them out?

In any case, if you could somehow change the AI so they build more melee troops that would be awesome.

Also agree with The_Nord on the long yari ashi. Give late ashigaru pikes!

[Yarkis de Bodemloze]

Hey! I love the mod, it's really brilliant. One of the only things I'm miffed about is (as with crunchy and bydlo) the recruitment priority of the AI. They make far too many shooty units compared to how many melees they got. Makes some fights quite boring, sadly. I don't think archer damage should be nerfed but maybe giving them less ammo would balance them out?

In any case, if you could somehow change the AI so they build more melee troops that would be awesome.

Also agree with The_Nord on the long yari ashi. Give late ashigaru pikes!

The AI is set to recruit between 10-30% ranged units. This should be the norm. Don't know why it doesn't follow these settings.

[Blatta Optima Maxima]

This mod looks interesting. When I get back to my gaming PC I will definitely try it out...

I have one question - how exactly do the pike&shot ashigaru work? Is that some kind of new breakthrough in unit making - by allowing modders to create composite units?

[Yarkis de Bodemloze]

Not really. Soldiers can have two weapons. In pike & shot units they have muskets and pikes. At range the frontline of the unit shoots while the lines behind wield pikes. In close combat all soldiers switch to pikes. To do this I had to rearrange the animation files. There is a small glitch (before aiming the soldier will shortly switch to his pike) but other then that it works fine. Pike & shot units also have square formation available. It is not a dense square, but the open one from NTW. You have to make compromises.

[Blatta Optima Maxima]

Not really. Soldiers can have two weapons. In pike & shot units they have muskets and pikes. At range the frontline of the unit shoots while the lines behind wield pikes. In close combat all soldiers switch to pikes. To do this I had to rearrange the animation files. There is a small glitch (before aiming the soldier will shortly switch to his pike) but other then that it works fine. Pike & shot units also have square formation available. It is not a dense square, but the open one from NTW. You have to make compromises.

That's fine! A really smart idea if you ask me.