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    Default US to Pakistan: We want names of the ISI officials who shielded Bin Laden

    Damn....the Obama Administration isn't pulling any diplomatic punches on this matter.

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    By HELENE COOPER and ISMAIL KHAN
    Published: May 6, 2011

    WASHINGTON — Pakistani officials say the Obama administration has demanded the identities of some of their top intelligence operatives as the United States tries to determine whether any of them had contact with Osama bin Laden or his agents in the years before the raid that led to his death early Monday morning in Pakistan.

    The officials provided new details of a tense discussion between Pakistani officials and an American envoy who traveled to Pakistan on Monday, as well as the growing suspicion among United States intelligence and diplomatic officials that someone in Pakistan’s secret intelligence agency knew of Bin Laden’s location, and helped shield him.

    continued
    Obama administration officials have stopped short of accusing the Pakistani government — either privately or publicly — of complicity in the hiding of Bin Laden in the years after the Sept. 11 attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon. One senior administration official privately acknowledged that the administration sees its relationship with Pakistan as too crucial to risk a wholesale break, even if it turned out that past or present Pakistani intelligence officials did know about Bin Laden’s whereabouts.

    Still, this official and others expressed deep frustration with Pakistani military and intelligence officials for their refusal over the years to identify members of the agency, the Inter-Services Intelligence Directorate, who were believed to have close ties to Bin Laden. In particular, American officials have demanded information on what is known as the ISI’s S directorate, which has worked closely with militants since the days of the fight against the Soviet army in Afghanistan.

    “It’s hard to believe that Kayani and Pasha actually knew that Bin Laden was there,” a senior administration official said, referring to Pakistan’s army chief, Gen. Ashfaq Parvez Kayani, and the ISI director-general, Lt. Gen. Ahmad Shuja Pasha. But, added the official, speaking on condition of anonymity because of the diplomatic sensitivity of the issue, “there are degrees of knowing, and it wouldn’t surprise me if we find out that someone close to Pasha knew.”

    Already, Pakistani news outlets have been speculating that General Pasha, one of the most powerful figures in Pakistan, may step down as a consequence of the Bin Laden operation.

    The increasing tensions between the United States and Pakistan — whose proximity to Afghanistan makes it almost a necessary ally in the American and allied war there — came as Al Qaeda itself acknowledged on Friday the death of its leader. The group did so while vowing revenge on the United States and its allies.

    Pakistani investigators involved in piecing together Bin Laden’s life during the past nine years said this week that he had been living in Pakistan’s urban centers longer than previously believed.

    Two Pakistani officials with knowledge of the continuing Pakistani investigation say that Bin Laden’s Yemeni wife, one of three wives now in Pakistani custody since the raid on Monday, told investigators that before moving in 2005 to the mansion in Abbottabad where he was eventually killed, Bin Laden had lived with his family for nearly two and a half years in a small village, Chak Shah Mohammad, a little more than a mile southeast of the town of Haripur, on the main Abbottabad highway.

    In retrospect, one of the officials said, this means that Bin Laden left Pakistan’s rugged tribal region sometime in 2003 and had been living in northern urban regions since then. American and Pakistani officials had thought for years that ever since Bin Laden disappeared from Tora Bora in Afghanistan, he had been hiding in the tribal regions straddling the Afghanistan-Pakistan border.

    A former Pakistani official noted that Abbottabad, the site of the Pakistani equivalent of the West Point military academy, is crawling with security guards and military officials who established a secure cordon around the town, raising questions of how the officials could not know there was a suspicious compound in their midst.

    “If he was there since 2005, that is too long a time for local police and intelligence not to know,” said Hassan Abbas, a former Pakistani official now teaching at Columbia University.

    Mr. Abbas said there was a tight net of security surrounding Abbottabad because Pakistani officials were concerned about terrorist attacks on sensitive military installations in the area.

    Art Keller, a former officer of the Central Intelligence Agency who worked on the hunt for Bin Laden from a compound in the Waziristan region of Pakistan in 2006, said the Qaeda founder’s choice of the garrison town of Abbottabad as a refuge in 2005 raised serious questions. Bin Laden certainly knew of the concentration of military institutions, officers and retirees in the town — including some from the ISI’s S directorate, Mr. Keller said. And because the military has also been a target of militant attacks in recent years, the town has a higher level of security awareness, checkpoints and street surveillance than others.

    If Bin Laden wanted to relocate in a populated area of Pakistan to avoid missiles fired from American drones, Mr. Keller said, he had many choices. So Mr. Keller questioned why Bin Laden would live in Abbottabad, unless he had some assurance of protection or patronage from military or intelligence officers. “At best, it was willful blindness on the part of the ISI,” Mr. Keller said. “Willful blindness is a survival mechanism in Pakistan.”

    The trove of information taken by the commandos from the compound occupied by Bin Laden may answer some of these questions, and perhaps even solve the puzzle of where he has been in recent years.

    A senior law enforcement official said Friday that the F.B.I. and C.I.A. had rapidly assembled small armies of analysts, technical experts and translators to pore over about 100 thumb drives, DVDs and computer disks, along with 10 computer hard drives, 5 computers and assorted cellphones. Analysts are also sifting through piles of paper documents in the house, many of which are in Arabic and other languages that need to be translated.

    In Washington and New York alone, several hundred analysts, technical experts and other specialists are working round the clock to review the trove of information. “It’s all hands on deck,” said the official, who spoke on condition of anonymity because of the continuing investigation.

    Technical specialists are recovering phone numbers from several cellphones recovered at the compound. The experts need to distinguish foreign telephone contacts from any numbers in the United States, which undergo a separate legal review, the official said.

    “We’re also looking through notes, letters, e-mails and other communications,” the official said. “We’re looking at who owns the e-mails and what linkages there are to those people.” The official said that the initial analysis would involve searching for information about specific threats or plots, or potential terrorists sent to the United States or Europe, and that the F.B.I. was pursuing a small number of leads from the information reviewed so far.
    Last edited by Darth Red; May 09, 2011 at 01:01 PM. Reason: spoiler

  2. #2

    Default Re: US to Pakistan: We want names of the ISI officials who shielded Bin Laden

    Good move. It's time that the Pakistan leadership has been purged.
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  3. #3
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    Default Re: US to Pakistan: We want names of the ISI officials who shielded Bin Laden

    Ha, if Obama was supposedly going to be the weak president, I'd hate to see what McCain would do.

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    Default Re: US to Pakistan: We want names of the ISI officials who shielded Bin Laden

    I don't believe it would suprise many that there was some ISI connection.
    "Tell people that there's an invisible man in the sky who created the universe, and the vast majority will believe you.
    Tell them the paint is wet, and they have to touch it to be sure."
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    Default Re: US to Pakistan: We want names of the ISI officials who shielded Bin Laden

    Nice, another disasterful move.
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    Default Re: US to Pakistan: We want names of the ISI officials who shielded Bin Laden

    Why should the administration stop short of calling them out of complicity? That's exactly what needs to be done.

    Tired of Pakistan's crap, whether its al-Qeada or the Taliban, they seem to have interests in both. It's not like there is going to be anymore damage done to the Afghan mission now already since Pakistan's credibility has dropped about 70 points and its looking like they are intent on perpetuating the conflict.
    Last edited by Admiral Piett; May 08, 2011 at 06:00 AM.
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    Default Re: US to Pakistan: We want names of the ISI officials who shielded Bin Laden

    Quote Originally Posted by Future Filmmaker View Post
    Why should the administration stop short of calling them out of complicity? That's exactly what needs to be done.

    Tired of Pakistan's crap, whether its al-Qeada or the Taliban, they seem to have interests in both. It's not like there is going to be anymore damage done to the Afghan mission now already since Pakistan's credibility has dropped about 70 points and its looking like they are intent on perpetuating the conflict.
    Pakistan does this on both their western and eastern borders.They host terrorist groups on their soil then claim to be fighting terrorism.
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    Default Re: US to Pakistan: We want names of the ISI officials who shielded Bin Laden

    Quote Originally Posted by Future Filmmaker View Post
    Why should the administration stop short of calling them out of complicity? That's exactly what needs to be done.
    Calling a government out on complicity would be tantamount to declaring war. Better to keep them friends and weed out the enemy. Besides, you give the Pakistan government too much credit. Isn't it obvious by now how inept and hated they are?

    Quote Originally Posted by Babur View Post
    Pakistan does this on both their western and eastern borders.They host terrorist groups on their soil then claim to be fighting terrorism.
    If that were true, then the ones carrying out terrorist attacks inside of Pakistan would not be the terrorists.

    Quote Originally Posted by hellheaven1987 View Post
    As they conducted attack on India and made Indian government so paranoid?

    Personally I think it is quite successful, since it cause few problems for Pakistan and make India panic.
    Why is India panicking a good thing, again?
    Last edited by Thema'zandaar; May 09, 2011 at 12:50 AM.

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    Default Re: US to Pakistan: We want names of the ISI officials who shielded Bin Laden

    Quote Originally Posted by Thema'zandaar View Post
    Calling a government out on complicity would be tantamount to declaring war.
    No it isn't. Not even close. Governments call each other out on things like this all the time, true or untrue. In this case, there is absolutely no plausible deniability for the Pakistani government. It's pretty crystal clear.

    Doing so would absolutely not resort to war, just lead to measures relating to diplomatic isolation. (Perhaps maybe increased aid to India as well) It's going to demonize Pakistan but I doubt its even going to lead to sanctions or anything of that sort. The US will probably still grudgingly hand out aid just in a ditch effort to keep nuclear weapons out of the hands of extremists. But there is little doubt that the storm brewing behind the scenes right now as we speak its going to inevitably lead to the government of Pakistan having little credibility and the reputation of the military and most especially the ISI having a very bad reputation unless proper steps are taken to rectify the situation.

    Better to keep them friends and weed out the enemy. Besides, you give the Pakistan government too much credit. Isn't it obvious by now how inept and hated they are?
    Members from within the Pakistani government, the ISI, and some of the Pakistani people themselves have demonstrated time and time again that they are not our friends and have no interest in being such. The Pakistani government is indirectly prolonging the conflict in Afghanistan and aiding and abetting wanted mass murderers and have been caught red-handed this time. If the government is this split and two-faced on its relationship to the US, there is absolutely no benefit for us or for the war on terror for the warm relationship to continue.
    Last edited by Admiral Piett; May 09, 2011 at 04:37 AM.
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    Default Re: US to Pakistan: We want names of the ISI officials who shielded Bin Laden

    Quote Originally Posted by Future Filmmaker View Post
    No it isn't. Not even close. Governments call each other out on things like this all the time, true or untrue. In this case, there is absolutely no plausible deniability for the Pakistani government. It's pretty crystal clear.
    You can't claim someone was bed-fellows with your enemy and remain friends after that. Given American history of converting their beliefs into facts, it would be impossible to remain on friendly terms with Pakistan if the war continues and their government doesn't change.

    Quote Originally Posted by Future Filmmaker View Post
    Doing so would absolutely not resort to war, just lead to measures relating to diplomatic isolation. (Perhaps maybe increased aid to India as well) It's going to demonize Pakistan but I doubt its even going to lead to sanctions or anything of that sort. The US will probably still grudgingly hand out aid just in a ditch effort to keep nuclear weapons out of the hands of extremists. But there is little doubt that the storm brewing behind the scenes right now as we speak its going to inevitably lead to the government of Pakistan having little credibility and the reputation of the military and most especially the ISI having a very bad reputation unless proper steps are taken to rectify the situation.
    What steps and by whom? Pakistan's credibility has been damaged beyond repair already and their PM is so arrogant he's actually thumping his chest right now...

    Quote Originally Posted by Future Filmmaker View Post
    Members from within the Pakistani government, the ISI, and some of the Pakistani people themselves have demonstrated time and time again that they are not our friends and have no interest in being such. The Pakistani government is indirectly prolonging the conflict in Afghanistan and aiding and abetting wanted mass murderers and have been caught red-handed this time. If the government is this split and two-faced on its relationship to the US, there is absolutely no benefit for us or for the war on terror for the warm relationship to continue.
    So are you talking about fringe elements within the government or the entire government? We've known for a long time that some Pakistanis are not friends of the US. They're blowing up innocent Pakistanis too, so they're not exactly friends with their own countrymen either, I guess. With the exception of the ISI, I do not believe that whole bodies of the government or military are involved in aiding terrorists. It would be like paying the people who will kill you tomorrow. The simpler, more probable explanation is that there are high-ranking individuals who have fundamentalist sympathies. The fastest way to weed them out is to keep other Pakistanis friendly.

    Dissolving warm relations will definitely alienate even those Pakistanis who are neutral, strengthening the enemy.
    Also, the Pakistan military (which unlike the government is at least better organised and focused) has been actively hunting terrorists. Remember Swat, FATA and all? These were Taliban strongholds at one point and it took considerable loss of life, civilian and military, to regain them.

    Bear in mind too that almost all of the supplies and reinforcements that the Coalition in Afghanistan recieve come through Pakistan. Loss of that route would prove costly in many ways.

    Quote Originally Posted by Visna View Post
    Just read that the Pakistani PM has launched a "full scale" investigation of the possible support networks Osama had. The problem with that is that he from the start relieved the army and ISI of responsibility. Gee, the Pakistanis investigating themselves with the two most likely culprits out of the question. This ought to be good. I wonder who (if any) will be left without a chair when the music stops.
    I'm betting on extra chairs being added with all the original players remaining seated.
    When will people realize that Pakistan needs to be cleaned from the inside out? You can't have a crook running a country and expect the best out of that country. You can't expect the common man to like you. Crooks are always! interested only and only in themselves, without exception!! It fails, again and again and AGAIN and yet the USA repeats the same damn mistake over and over.

    Zardari is called Mr. 10% by his own people. He spent ten years in prison on fraud charges that were waived after his party took power. Some suspect him of murdering his wife and using his son to get to power on sympathy votes. His Degree in Islamic Studies has still not been verified as legit. This man is probably making deals left and right with everyone just so he can stay afloat. I mean...seriously, do you expect such a man to care about his neighbours? No? Then why would he ever care about people on the other side of the globe?

    And the Great Prime Minister of Pakistan...Gilani - the man whose passage through Karachi stopped all traffic for hours, forcing a pregnancy woman to give birth in a taxi. His comment when he was questioned about it? "So what...?"
    Last edited by Thema'zandaar; May 10, 2011 at 07:09 AM.

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    Default Re: US to Pakistan: We want names of the ISI officials who shielded Bin Laden

    Quote Originally Posted by Babur View Post
    Pakistan does this on both their western and eastern borders.They host terrorist groups on their soil then claim to be fighting terrorism.
    nuke them from orbit ....."its the only way to be sure"

  12. #12
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    Default Re: US to Pakistan: We want names of the ISI officials who shielded Bin Laden

    The US didn't pull any punches with the Taliban when it came to harbouring bin Laden in Afghanistan. So fair is fair, they shouldn't pull any punches with Pakistan either.

  13. #13

    Default Re: US to Pakistan: We want names of the ISI officials who shielded Bin Laden

    Quote Originally Posted by boofhead View Post
    The US didn't pull any punches with the Taliban when it came to harbouring bin Laden in Afghanistan. So fair is fair, they shouldn't pull any punches with Pakistan either.
    The Afghan Taliban =/= Government of Pakistan. The two situations are not equitable and as such should not be approached the same way.
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    Default Re: US to Pakistan: We want names of the ISI officials who shielded Bin Laden

    Quote Originally Posted by motiv-8 View Post
    The Afghan Taliban =/= Government of Pakistan. The two situations are not equitable and as such should not be approached the same way.
    True, not to mention the fact that wheras Afghanistan has 29million population,

    Pakistan has 187million.

    That's a population greater than Russia at 143million.

    Edit; Tom got there first.
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    Default Re: US to Pakistan: We want names of the ISI officials who shielded Bin Laden

    Well Pakistan will be alot harder to tame than the Taliban who after 10 yrs are still fighting the greatest army in the world.

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    Default Re: US to Pakistan: We want names of the ISI officials who shielded Bin Laden

    Quote Originally Posted by tom cruise View Post
    Well Pakistan will be alot harder to tame than the Taliban who after 10 yrs are still fighting the greatest army in the world.
    Only because that army has its hands tied behind its back, and is muzzled. Mainly thanks to yours truly, Pakistan.

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    Default Re: US to Pakistan: We want names of the ISI officials who shielded Bin Laden

    Quote Originally Posted by boofhead View Post
    Only because that army has its hands tied behind its back, and is muzzled. Mainly thanks to yours truly, Pakistan.
    Let us not forget all those years and resources wasted in the Iraqi Picnic.

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    Default Re: US to Pakistan: We want names of the ISI officials who shielded Bin Laden

    Quote Originally Posted by SPECTREtm View Post
    Let us not forget all those years and resources wasted in the Iraqi Picnic.
    Yeah those resources could have been used in Afghanistan
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    Default Re: US to Pakistan: We want names of the ISI officials who shielded Bin Laden

    Quote Originally Posted by tom cruise View Post
    Well Pakistan will be alot harder to tame than the Taliban who after 10 yrs are still fighting the greatest army in the world.
    Do you think? They are a paper tiger compared to their neighbors to the east.
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    Default Re: US to Pakistan: We want names of the ISI officials who shielded Bin Laden

    Pakistan's estimated population in 2011 is over 187 million. Thats a lot of people to tame?I hope diplomacy and not threats are used by Obama.

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