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Thread: Tsardoms Total War - Suggestions (Gameplay)

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    Icon2 Tsardoms Total War - Suggestions (Gameplay)

    STRAT MAP SCRIPTING - SUGGESTIONS (GAMEPLAY)





    Units

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    1) Byzantine Gunpowder [by happyshopper] (Post #4)
    Quote Originally Posted by happyshopper View Post
    Will gunpowder be available from the start? If not, the Byzantines could have an event a while after the other factions that gives them the option of a gunpowder building, but which would cost a huge amount and require upkeep. This would allow them to modernise if they had wanted to and had the money, but a little later than others.

    2) Fressian Horses [by umcsultan] (Post #380)
    Quote Originally Posted by usmcsultan View Post
    Also there should be an option to have Fressian (konji krizanci) type horse stables. These horses are slow but they are very powerful.

    3) New Bow Strings [by DobroVece] (Post #659)
    Quote Originally Posted by DobroVece View Post
    Animated bow strings







    Buildings


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    1) Greek Culture Building Textures [by Vict0r_1984] (Post #102)
    Quote Originally Posted by Vict0r_1984 View Post
    Excuse me if I post something about this the third time, but I want to know only how much work is needed to create a new culture of the game.
    You can create a new culture called greek who will make the buildings for bizantynes look like the roman ones from RTW? (the empire maintained some elements from the ancient culture, excepting religion, gladiator fights and other stuff who was oposite to religion) A metropolis like Constantinopole had reasons to be wanted by christians and also by muslims, due to its monuments and ancient wonder.

    The buidings can remain the same, cause modernization has expanded his borders over all Europe in time, but the houses should look like in this image at bizantynes, because the ancient rears were destroied only in the time of the turk occupation, and the houses haved over 1000 years when the game is starting.
    The cities can have also fountains and plazas with beautiful trees and paved roads.
    The greek culture had some new influences, but it existed as an ancient - medieval combination, and the old traditions were hard eliminated.
    So how much work is needed to create a new culture, like northern european, southern european or middle eastern? There are much files to be changed?
    I want to help but my problem is that temporal I don`t have Kingdoms in the computer and I don`t have space to put it. I have a hard only of 40 Gb.

    2) Religious Buildings [by NapoleonSRB] (Post #279)
    Quote Originally Posted by NapoleonSRB View Post
    U can post your ideas here...

    I have i few...
    1. ...
    2. ...
    3.[this is not my idea but i dont know was it accepted] Some religius buildings in a city..
    example: 1 orthodox church and 1 islamic mosque?

    3) Saxon Guilds [\Vazul's Ghost/] (Post #369)
    Quote Originally Posted by \Vazul's Ghost/ View Post
    I suggested something a while back about player controlled Saxon migrations. Romano Dacis pointed out that that isn't very historical, but he suggested representing the Saxons with guilds somehow. Do you guys think you will introduce any form of player customization regarding the Saxon populations in the mod? I'm pressing it because I think if a way could be pulled off to simulate it it would give the player more control over the customisability of his communities and economy and would also be historical... What do you think?

    4) Water Mills [by umcsultan] (Post #380)
    Quote Originally Posted by usmcsultan View Post
    I think you should have option to build water mil (vodenca ili mlin) in regions where there is a lot of rivers. Also some regions could build wind mils too.

    5) Religion Shrines [by Nenadovcanin] (Post #382)
    Quote Originally Posted by Nenadovcanin View Post
    *Presumably when you choose to exterminate population you execute people of different religion. That causes the percentage of that faith is decreased and from that moment all new people are divided between your and native religion. Religious buildings of native people is not destroyed. If you choose to remove them it causes massive riots. You should remove it only after 80/90% of population is converted.

    6) Prisons [by Nenadovcanin] (Post #382)
    Quote Originally Posted by Nenadovcanin View Post
    Here are few ideas:
    *Beside the armies, buildings and agent, centers should have prisons. Allows the negotiation of higher ransom. Holding prisoners cost money, but increase the morale. Captured soldiers are used as workforce an increase production, but die out in time. Captured kings, heirs, generals allow collection of big ransoms and exchanging them for Vassalage, peace, alliance, and parts of territory.







    Agents


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    1) Augmented Role of Princesses and Clergy [by docjenson84] (Post #3)
    Quote Originally Posted by docjenson84 View Post
    I think it would be interesting if there was a mod which revolutionized the role of princesses and the clergy.

    These are just ideas really for those more talented and able than I, but I think it would be rather interesting if instead of becoming inactive once married Princesses would stay active and become like diplomats in the game. Further I think it would be even more interesting if a King/Emperor could be succeeded by his daughter if he had no surviving sons. Imagine a Princess becoming faction heir? I think that would give a new perspective to the game. Perhaps also a Queen agent also would be very fun to wield and have; almost like a chess game.

    I think the clergy right now are very limited also. Given their immense role in the medieval world clergy should be more powerful. Firstly all provinces should have a bishop (perhaps given the historical title also after a full turn in the city). Then as the clerical buildings increase in provinces so should the role of their priests; for instance a province with a cathedral should have a archbishop and a province's archbishop with a huge cathedral would become "Primate of the Church in [country]." The clergy should also wield more power and serve as diplomats with countries of the same faith.

    Also abbeys should be separate religious structures. Provinces should be able to build monasteries or nunneries. With the option of religious orders houses popping up like a guild.

    I would also like to give cardinals more influence and power but am struggling to think of what...

    I also think royalty, such as princes, kings, and (if made) queens should be more distinctly ostentatious figures. I think the original MTW also had a very good custom and that MTW2 should borrow is that clerical vestments, other than bishop and priest should be more distinct and different.

    Also, why is there no coronation video, anyone else think that odd to be left out?

    I ALSO THINK GIVEN THE PERIOD OF HISTORY MEMBERS OF THE ROYAL DYNASTY SHOULD BE ABLE TO BECOME PRIESTS/NUNS (PERHAPS AUTOMATICALLY AS A TITULAR BISHOP/ARCHBISHOP/ABBOT/ABBOTESS) BY PRESSING A BUTTON ON THEIR DETAILS LIKE AS IF YOU WERE TO HAVE THEM JOIN A CRUSADE. THEY WOULD THEN BECOME PLAYABLE RELIGIOUS AGENTS.

    These are just ideas up for discussion and possible creation by those much more talented than I!

    2) Religious and Diplomatic Agents [by saneel] (Post #159)
    Quote Originally Posted by saneel View Post
    What about titles for priests and imams : grand mufti o ottoman muslims, chief of serbian orthodox church,... the best priest or imam should have this trait.
    Or for diplomats, for example,if one bosnian diplomat work a lot with the hungarians, he should receive a title ambassador for hungary, or something like that?

    3) Desease carrier Agents [by SerbianInfantry] (Post #418)
    Quote Originally Posted by SerbianInfantry View Post
    Ohh! Speaking of plague. Have you guys ever use (thou not ethical) a biological warfare in Medieval total war? I have, I got my spy trained in my own plague infected region. And sent him in foreign region to spread the plague








    Traits & Ancillaries


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    1) Lordship Titles [by saneel] (Post #126)
    Quote Originally Posted by saneel View Post
    Will there be any lord titles like for example : Duke of Vojvodina,Duke of Hum,...
    In SS 6.1 they made this very good,because every city has the title,and the governers had some bonuses for example: Duke of Vojvodina:country known for their farming and the town of Novi Sad(i dont know which town was the biggest in 14 c.),and mighty river Sava that flows through.
    +5 tax collection,knows something about farming,improves law and order.

    2) Supply System [by saneel] (Post #131)
    Quote Originally Posted by saneel View Post
    Stainless steal or Europa Barbarorum have a nice system for supplies.

    3) Supplies through ships [by umcsultan] (Post #380)
    Quote Originally Posted by usmcsultan View Post
    It would be kind of cool to attach fishing ships to invading armada so let say while you are besieging city you can send your general back to the ship to get food for besieging units. That way the main army don't run out the food.

    4) Heir Chosing [by Nenadovcanin] (Post #382)
    Quote Originally Posted by Nenadovcanin View Post
    Here are few ideas:
    *The heir of the crown can be chosen by player(like in RomeTW). It always must be from royal family. Only in case there are not live members crown is past to the most influential family. This is shown by the number of territories and troops family has.

    5) Feudal System [by Nenadovcanin] (Post #382)
    Quote Originally Posted by Nenadovcanin View Post
    *Nobleman can be appointed to some region which becomes his feudal dominion. So, if he is good ruler, people are loyal to him(better production), if not they rebel(rebel bands appear more offen). When a nobles leave their dominions, it loses/regains public order, but remain their dominions. Their dominion, after death, is passed to the person who is chosen(the same way the heir is chosen in RomeTW).(There should be more children and a possibility of infant death or assassination) If there is none it returns to the faction's leader to appoint other general. If the prev lord was tyrant, after his death region turns to rebel state(it could become new faction?). If the heir of some dominion is given different dominion by the king, before his father dies he should become lord of both lands that increase the family power.

    *When you look at the noble's info, it should state his rank. If he has one dominion he is a ,,lord'' of it, 2-5 for Serbia is Knez, From 5-10 is Despot. Captain of a garrison or a general in some fort or tower is a Kefalia.
    Every faction has it's own rank hierarchy. These ranks are noted in treats of a person.(like those in original game(Templar Knight, Hospitaller knight) or in barbarian invasion(magister millitum pre Orientes...)) One noble can have multiple titles. He can be Knez of Ras, Pristina i Krusevac and Vojvoda
    Krajiški(if his dominion is on the border)(if he is a Lord of Kotor, title is Lord of Kotor and lands to the sea).

    *Faction Leader has a capitol region as his dominion, and he can't give it to others. Tsar Dušan should have this titles. Dušan, Tsar od Serbs, Lord of Skoplje and all lands to the Sea.If he conquers Constantinople he is Tsar od Serbs and Greeks, Lord of Carigrad and Skoplje and all lands to the three seas. If Bulgaria fall, then Tsar od Serbs,Greeks and Bulgars, Lord of Carigrad,Skoplje and Sofija and all lands to the three seas. You get the idea.

    *Every Faction starts whit certain number of noble families and one dynasty who all have their well known coat of arms which is flown above the castle along the faction flag. These flags also appear together in battles. That way when army is composed of units from different region it is shown on flags of each unit. Generals who are levied from captains get their own coat of arms.








    Gameplay


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    1) Crusades [by happyshopper] (Post #4)
    Quote Originally Posted by happyshopper View Post
    You could trigger crusader/jihad armies (not all powerful - there could be some hermit armies to represent the disorganised mobs who tried to go on crusade) as AI/player controlled reinforcements if there was a ridiculous overbalance of power. In the case of the crusaders they could return some settlements but try and keep others for themselves.

    2) Transformation of Settlements [by ComnenusTheOne] (Post #33)
    Quote Originally Posted by ComnenusTheOne View Post
    It is possible, besides AoR, to have an independant system that will radically "convert" a settlement? What i mean is that, same way the Brittannia campaign has a cultural system that changes the units and buildings available, Tsardoms should have the same thing.

    So if for example the Ottoman conquer a Bulgarian settlement, it will slowly start converting to the Turkish culture. So Bulgarian units will not be available for the Ottomans, but their own units. Maybe even a name change, from Slavic to Turkish, or something.

    3) Historical Crusades [by 2Shy] (Post #162)
    Quote Originally Posted by 2Shy View Post
    From 1354 to 1530 there were 3 crusades:
    Crusades in the Balkans

    To counter the expanding Ottoman Empire, several crusades were launched in the 15th century. The most notable are:

    Are they going to be presented ingame somehow (at least the crusade of Nicopolis which is the last large scale crusade) ?

    4) Triggers of Crusades [by Romano-Dacis] (Post #173)
    Quote Originally Posted by Romano-Dacis View Post
    The big questions are:
    1) What is the trigger?
    a. Capture of key cities. In my opinion this would not add to the historical accuracy. The Long Crusade and the one at Varna for instance were not called against a specific annexation but rather to lift the siege of Constantinople. We might make a script for a crusader army to appear when Constantinople is besieged, but it sounds harder than it should be.
    b. Make a script for when the Ottomans reach a certain size. If the Ottomans have 1/3 of their objectives, call a crusade. If the Ottomans have 1/2 of their objectives, call another crusade etc.
    c. Let the player decide when to call crusades while playing as Catholic factions.

    2) Who controls the crusader army?
    a. It is an AI faction that will work like the Timurids or Mongols.
    b. It will be controlled by Hungary, which makes sense historically.

    5) Triggers of Crusades [by \Vazul's Ghost/] (Post #190)
    Quote Originally Posted by \Vazul's Ghost/ View Post
    Yes but as far as I'm aware Orthodox factions can't control a crusade in the Medieval II engine... (can they?)

    If its put in that Hungary has to control the crusade, it would be more historically accurate, but it would need to be counter balanced by some sort of tax on Hungary. But even if Hungary leads a crusade, how would other factions like serbia contribute their troops and resources as they did in history. Is this possible?
    Could a non-player horde faction be made called Crusaders, that both orthodox and catholics can give their troops to?

    6) Dowries [by 2Shy] (Post #273)
    Quote Originally Posted by 2Shy View Post
    At least the allies must stay alles-not to betray you.I think that the royal marriage must mean something - not to be just on paper.And if it can be code when there is royal mariage the father of the bride must pay - "zestra/зестра" ( I don't know how it is in english-the father of the bride must pay gold or province to to father of the groom ( when we look at the history books we can see that it's verry common)).

    7) Historic Events [by CrazyAjvar] (Post #307)
    Quote Originally Posted by CrazyAjvar View Post
    Will there be some special events in some period of time? Or emerging factions? I didn't had time to read all info on this mod so I am just shooting wild guesses (sorry if that is off topic).

    8) Ottomans in Europe [by \Vazul's Ghost/] (Post #314)
    Quote Originally Posted by \Vazul's Ghost/ View Post
    Are there going to be any scripted in ways to encourage the Ottomans to invade Byzantium. I believe there should be, as the Ottoman wars are the most emblematic part of this period, and Tsardoms would be a bit strange if it involved the Ottomans happily sitting in Anatolia the whole time and never invading.

    If you haven't already thought of a way, perhaps you could script in the earthquake in Gallipoli of 1354. If it is possible, you could script the earthquake to eliminate all the troops holding a PSF there, or the castle in that region (should you choose to put it on the map), and then spawn the Ottomans an army just outside the fort/castle, with a pop up for an Ottoman player saying something like "the recent earthquake in Gallipoli has provided you with an opportunity for conquest the local ghazis will not let you pass up. An invasion force has been rallied and is ready to strike Gallipoli at your command, giving us a foothold in Europe". This historically marked the beginning of the Ottoman conquests in Europe, and I think it would be a great way to put it into the mod.

    What do you think/ Is it possible?

    9) Diplomacy [by 4th Regiment] (Post #354)
    Quote Originally Posted by 4th Regiment View Post
    PS. In the same line - is it possible by ussing scripting to increase unrest level if faction/player attack with no casuss beli? (or faction with same religion). Who played EU he knows what I am talking about. For example breaking the truce + attacking faction with no casus beli + same religion + mutual royal marriage brings down stability all down from +3 to -3. (I think breaking the truce is -2, everything else is -1) That would be interesting feature, so diplomacy would be much more important, since you can not bliz the map and will bring much more realism. In our game -1 would be increase in 10% or maybe 20% unrest in provincies.

    10) Diplomacy [by SerbianInfantry] (Post #381)
    Quote Originally Posted by SerbianInfantry View Post
    ...Anyway, conserning alliances. We would like to have more complexed relations. Like if you are allies it doesn't mean they will forever be yours but not that they will turn on you the next turn ether. Like if you have married princesses and princes, supported them in some war, gave them help in money ect, they will not only help you in war (for real not just declareing a war) but they will also offer money, or attack your enemy. But on the other hand. If you are in horrible relations (fe. didn't help them in a battle and than took their settlament from their enemy and not return it to your allies) They can betray you and attack smart (when you are in a war or just in a wornuable state). Damn, how can I explain this. Ok have you played Civilization? You get relations bonus for trading, same religion, supported them in war, gave them gifts... And you have a score for seeing how much they like you (offcourse to make it realistc you should hide this score), and all these scores increase tru time, which is logical. I hope you understood my mess of a writing
    Oh AND some more diplomatic options would be very much appriciated.

    11) Methods to avoid the black death [by Nenadovcanin] (Post #394)
    Quote Originally Posted by Nenadovcanin View Post
    Good ideas, but also, consider the fact that nobles used to go to monasteries during the plague outbursts. Car Dušan even went to Mount Athos, with his empress Helen. So maybe you can hide your nobles in the monasteries or in some small castles which are less possible to catch the disease.

    12) Religion Hierarchy System [by Nenadovcanin] (Post #382)
    Quote Originally Posted by Nenadovcanin View Post
    *Factions have religion leaders. Patriarchs, bishops, ,,mitropolits'', Archbishops... Every region has a religion rank.(patriarchy is named by the name of faction (serbian, bulgarian, hungarian, venetian... yes, they can change it if you convert 70% of factions population) Conversion in other faction's land is done by priests. If your priest survives for 10 turns he becomes a bishop of that region. If you have 4 bishops in that country one is turned in Mitropolit. If that faction changes religion(catholic to orthodox) than those bishops and mitropolit go to that faction and you lose contol over them. But than your patriarch gets a title Patriarch of Serbs and Hungarians, which brings a lot of money.
    FOR ORTHODOX You create a priest in a region and when bishop dies, the best priest in faction becomes new bishop. from bishop to Archbishop(on every 6 bishopes comes 1 archbishop), patriarch is chosen among the best of Bishops and Archbishops. Patriarchs act as popes in original game, except being controlled by player, they can call upon other factions if the faction with different religion attacks and loots churches and execute the priests.
    Catholics use their ties to the Pope to improve relations with any other catholic faction. Pope can call a Crusade only on muslims and heretics. If Rome is conquered Pope still exists. He can't be eliminated. Let's be honest, there was never a hungarian or croatian Pope. So He can't be elected among Cardinals that will appear in the game. Instead, there should be a limit of cardinals at one per faction. There should be more bishops,archbishops and abbots. Allow princesses who are not married by 30 years of age or their husband dies to join the monastery. They increase the conversion and piety. If there is more than one nun in a region, than one should become abyss or mother igumanija.

    13) Patriarchical System [by Nenadovcanin] (Post #382)
    Quote Originally Posted by Nenadovcanin View Post
    *If factions share same religion, and have good relationship it's harder to declare war. You need to spoil relations to minimal level in order to attack it. If you choose to attack faction with good relations then all of your alliances, trade rights are broken. If you attack the faction which your patriarch controls, they proclaim their own.

    *If one orthodox faction conquers another, the patriarch of conquered faction remains with all off the priest and bishops, but with time, as they die, and conquering priests are created and assume all titles of natives. In that case There would be two patriarchs. In case of Serbia - Bulgaria, if Serbia culturally assimilate the Bulgars, when the B. patriarch die they don't elect new one. Then S.P becomes P.of Serbs and Bulgars. But there is a bishop in one of Bulgarian regions with rank of mitropolit of Bulgaria. Same is with catholic cardinals. In case of Venice - Hungary. If H. conq. V. there are two cardinals as long as their is a venetian culture.

    14) Unlock buildings [by Nenadovcanin] (Post #382)
    Quote Originally Posted by Nenadovcanin View Post
    I have just come across this on some site about M2TW-Kingdoms:
    ,,Also, when playing as New Spain, as you progress through the campaign, you will be presented with missions by the King of Spain, and when sufficient influence is gained, you may be granted a higher title of nobility, such as Baron, Count, etc. These titles unlock more advanced building levels for the player to use.''
    Then I had an idea. Instead of king of Spain, we put Tzar's Sabor(in case of Serbia) which gives tasks of military but more of,economic,diplomatic,and logistic type. To the general, who fulfills it a trait is given. It than allows more advanced buildings and units. For example:
    Task: Production of gold in Prizren must be above 2000 coins. Governor of Prizen, after raising the gold production by building mines gets a trait that allows him to build new stuff in Prizren. Traits like:
    -Tzar signed ,,povelja'' on mines(allows extra mines, increases production, brings Ragusian traders(guild))
    -Tzarsky neimar(allows building of big churches or monasteries, increases the speed of building, stronger walls)
    For military tasks(like counques) a rank of Vojvoda is given(Only with it, a general can recruit mercenaries, after more tasks rank of Veliki Vojvoda allows recruitment od knights). For diplomatic tasks a title of ,,Tzar's own Cupbearer''(elite troops, better trained diplomats, because of influence more peace). Every trait with prefix Veliki allows building of ,,zadužbina'' which replaces huge cathedral from original game for monastery.
    This can be implemented for muslim(hatišerifi, fermani) and catholic(lex, promissio, bull...)

    15) When a F.L. dies [by SerbianInfantry] (Post #386)
    Quote Originally Posted by SerbianInfantry View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by 2Shy View Post
    4.When the faction leader die there must be riots all aroind the country(espacially in the conquerd regions).
    In the conquerd, ok but MUST in ALL. No, it should depend on the heir and the loyalty of the noble families. If the heir is good (this is why it's good to chose your own heir) than it's no use for anyone to rebel (if they are loyal). And also having high dread should instill obidiance or loyalty in nobels. So low level of chivalry or dread resoults in loss of loyalty. How ever politics and points of views should have impact too. If your heir is high chivalry than the dreaded general might rebel if his dread is higher than heirs chivalry, if not higher than he just loses loyalty and not nesesary start a riot, depending of chivalry/dread ratio. I think this would be best solution to this.

    16) Homesick soldiers [by Nenadovcanin] (Post #387)
    Quote Originally Posted by Nenadovcanin View Post
    Soldiers from one end of the country are rarely eager to fight on the other end. You know, families, crops and that. So that is why, captains who lead men without a general have less morale. So if you don't have a general and you need troops in other place, it is better to get the mercenaries. This has to do with types of domestic armies of Serbian Empire. ,,Baštinska vojska'' It is recruited from the people of the inner regions, it was rarely used, only in defence. ,,Krajiška vojska'' are professional soldiers recruited in the border regions, good for defense and could be used for attack. Third type is mercenary army, which were far economical for conquest. The idea is to allow mercenary units to refill ranks(replace dead)

    17) Ottoman "Script" [by alien_t] (Post #402)
    Quote Originally Posted by alien_t View Post
    Something that is realized in TATW and I like it very much. Lets call it Ottoman Invasion Scripting.

    Anyone who played TATW with Gondor should know what I'm suggesting. AI controlled Mordor(in our case Ottomans) are constantly attacking player controlled Gondor(in Our Case could be every faction in Balkans). I think this is achieved via:

    1) Kings Purse(descr_strat) -to be scripted if the Ottomans are controlled by AI they should receive 2 or 3 times bigger amount of money than all other factions(both ai and player controlled) in they king's purse.

    2) scripted stack emerging - every 10 or 15 or 20 turns again if the Ottomans are AI controlled they could receive one(or more) free stack/s. It composition could depend on in game time period or to be predefined and constant.

    3) Scripted jihads - their targets could be:


    • following the history - fist Galipoly, when it is conquered, next target Dimotica -> Adrianople -> etc
    • some other predefined order.
    • random order


    or combination of the above 3 points.

    I could guarantee based from my experience from playing the above mentioned mod that the fun is great!

    Something other I personally like is and would like to see implemented is garrison script(campaign_script.txt). Basically it gives the AI controlled city put under player's siege, free units(basically lover quality units) depending on the siege length.

    18) Crusading Knights [by 2Shy] (Post #578)
    Quote Originally Posted by 2Shy View Post
    A week ago when my history teacher and I were discusing the Ottoman invasion she told me some interesting stuff- when the ottomans first came on the Balkans the news reached the Iberian peninsula .When the news that muslim armies are invading Europe and the local christian rullers cant stop them some spanish and french nobles who were taking part in the Reconquista sailed to the Balkans to fight the turks.
    Unfortunately I couldnt find anything in internet but my teacher assured me that its documented.So I was woundering If someone know anything about it.
    If it can be presented ingame it will be great for the gameplay- like the crusading nobles from the Teutonic campain.The problem is that this nobles were individuals and it will be hard to find who they were.







    Factions


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    Battle Map


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    1) Custom-made cities [by Zack-Stefy] (Post #547)
    Quote Originally Posted by Zack-Stefy View Post
    ook, first of all, there is a new tool for M2, made by the team from the mod Princes, Kings and Heroes . Take a look at what KK ,the mod leader of Third Age:Total War made http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=409073
    With this tool you cand make historical accurate cities
    So..do you want these kind of cities in the mod?








    Campaign Map
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    1) Little Ice Age
    [by Manuel Comenos] (Post #7)
    Quote Originally Posted by Manuel Komnenos View Post
    Today I had lecture about that thema, my professor said that one of reasons that hungarian defence system (that Mathias Corvinus established) collapsed were very low temperatures.
    Look:


    It seems that, last decades of this mod were affected greatly, so it's possible to script turns (in last decades) to be 3 turn winter, one summer?

    2) Sailable Rivers [by Wallachian] (Post #283)
    Quote Originally Posted by Wallachian View Post
    I was reading in some mod that they enlarged the rivers so that ships can navigate them. since the map is so focused on a region is it possible maybe to make the Danube wider so that ships can navigate up and down? I think that would be really cool and historically accurate. Although, not sure what implications it would have for river crossings and bridges...

    3) Change of Settlement Names [by Wallachian] (Post #297)
    Quote Originally Posted by Wallachian View Post
    I saw an awesome script in Third Age Total War where a city changed name depending on what faction owned it. I was playing with Gondor and took Minas Morgul from Mordor and then the city changed the name to Minas Ithil. I was very pleasantly surprised by it. It would be cool if for example Constantinopole changed name to Istanbul if the Turks take it.

    4) PSFs [by Nenadovcanin] (Post #382)
    Quote Originally Posted by Nenadovcanin View Post
    *Just as map shows monasteries,churches and mines. It should show small permanent towers and small castles (temporary forts should be turned into camps, no walls, only carts and logs, maybe with tents in middle). Every region has more defenses than just one. Tower are placed, near monasteries and mines. Forts in mountain passes, near river crossings(if the capitol is not there) They can be garrisoned, but can't raise troops. Upgrades are done in region's center. Region is conquered only when all defenses fall. When the last defence fall all prisoners(including spies, diplomats, priests, and princeses) can be ransomed, liberated, executed, or taken prisoner. If army conquers the center first, remaining defenders run to the nearest fort or tower(Survivers from towers and forts run to the center). This makes the conquest very hard. If army conquers all towers but not the center and the faction make peace, conquering army stays in the fort. It gives a better position for next attack and reduces the revenue and production of the region. Also it allows to have an army in enemy territory, and it allows the usage of that region's resources.(If you take a tower near mine, it's revenue is yours). To enrich the look of map, you should create small scale models of churches,monasteries, villages,mines,towers, small castles. Monasteries and churches should be randomly placed in region. For example: if a region has a Bishop, than small church appear, if it has a archbishop than a bigger one appears, if a seat of patriarch is there than a large church or monastery appears. Same thing is with catholic and with islam mosques.
    Here you can find many churches as models. Stile is good for all orthodox cultures.
    http://www.arkeo3d.com/byzantium1200/contents.html

    *Towers and forts from above allow troops to be healed. If a center has an improved blaksmith or armory, than garrison can be upgraded.







    Miscellaneous

    Click to reveal
    1) Xenophonia for Tsardoms [by ComnenusTheOne] (Post #79)
    Quote Originally Posted by ComnenusTheOne View Post
    How about making a "xenophonia" for TTW. Bulgarians speaking bulgarian, Romans speak greek, Romanians romanians, Ottomans turkish and Hapsburgs speak german.

    I just cant stand the english language dominance anymore.

    2) Songs & Voices [by NapoleonSRB] (Post #239)
    Quote Originally Posted by NapoleonSRB View Post
    great then i don think there is much time left...

    anyways I wanna ask would u guys put in our songs and voices,i think i seen somewhere that u are gonna put our songs but are they puting in voices?

    3) Faction Voices [by dabela] (Post #316)
    Quote Originally Posted by dabela View Post
    also, ive been playing Bulgaria total war, and i think you should ask them to use their voices.. I meen it is stupid if all merchants, diplomats, generals etc speak english no mater the faction they are from...?











    Last edited by SpyrosM91; August 28, 2011 at 04:48 PM.

    TTW GRANDMASTER

  2. #2

    Default Tsardoms Total War - Proposals

    reserved_2
    Last edited by SpyrosM91; June 14, 2011 at 06:10 AM.

    TTW GRANDMASTER

  3. #3

    Icon4 Revolutionize the Princesses and Clergy!

    I think it would be interesting if there was a mod which revolutionized the role of princesses and the clergy.

    These are just ideas really for those more talented and able than I, but I think it would be rather interesting if instead of becoming inactive once married Princesses would stay active and become like diplomats in the game. Further I think it would be even more interesting if a King/Emperor could be succeeded by his daughter if he had no surviving sons. Imagine a Princess becoming faction heir? I think that would give a new perspective to the game. Perhaps also a Queen agent also would be very fun to wield and have; almost like a chess game.

    I think the clergy right now are very limited also. Given their immense role in the medieval world clergy should be more powerful. Firstly all provinces should have a bishop (perhaps given the historical title also after a full turn in the city). Then as the clerical buildings increase in provinces so should the role of their priests; for instance a province with a cathedral should have a archbishop and a province's archbishop with a huge cathedral would become "Primate of the Church in [country]." The clergy should also wield more power and serve as diplomats with countries of the same faith.

    Also abbeys should be separate religious structures. Provinces should be able to build monasteries or nunneries. With the option of religious orders houses popping up like a guild.

    I would also like to give cardinals more influence and power but am struggling to think of what...

    I also think royalty, such as princes, kings, and (if made) queens should be more distinctly ostentatious figures. I think the original MTW also had a very good custom and that MTW2 should borrow is that clerical vestments, other than bishop and priest should be more distinct and different.

    Also, why is there no coronation video, anyone else think that odd to be left out?

    I ALSO THINK GIVEN THE PERIOD OF HISTORY MEMBERS OF THE ROYAL DYNASTY SHOULD BE ABLE TO BECOME PRIESTS/NUNS (PERHAPS AUTOMATICALLY AS A TITULAR BISHOP/ARCHBISHOP/ABBOT/ABBOTESS) BY PRESSING A BUTTON ON THEIR DETAILS LIKE AS IF YOU WERE TO HAVE THEM JOIN A CRUSADE. THEY WOULD THEN BECOME PLAYABLE RELIGIOUS AGENTS.

    These are just ideas up for discussion and possible creation by those much more talented than I!

  4. #4

    Default Re: General Discussion

    Looks like a really good mod - keep up the good work!

    The map size and region number sounds about right to me - any bigger and it would turn into another version of vanilla, and any more regions and it would be a siegefest.

    A couple of ideas for features:
    You could trigger crusader/jihad armies (not all powerful - there could be some hermit armies to represent the disorganised mobs who tried to go on crusade) as AI/player controlled reinforcements if there was a ridiculous overbalance of power. In the case of the crusaders they could return some settlements but try and keep others for themselves.
    Will gunpowder be available from the start? If not, the Byzantines could have an event a while after the other factions that gives them the option of a gunpowder building, but which would cost a huge amount and require upkeep. This would allow them to modernise if they had wanted to and had the money, but a little later than others.

    Also, will there be an AOR system?

  5. #5
    Sarmatian's Avatar Biarchus
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    Default Re: General Discussion

    1) We're still discussing stuff about crusades. They're gonna be in, but in which form, we shall see later.

    2) Same thing for gunpowder, but I'm guessing we're gonna use event for that.

    3) Yes, there will be an AOR system


  6. #6

    Default Re: General Discussion

    Greetings, your mod skins look amazing. I have a few questions, how will you represent the Timurid invasions of the middle east and anatolia, and the battles of Nicopolis and Varna? Looks very good btw, good luck

  7. #7
    Manuel Komnenos's Avatar Senator
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    Default Climate change - little ice age

    Today I had lecture about that thema, my professor said that one of reasons that hungarian defence system (that Mathias Corvinus established) collapsed were very low temperatures.
    Look:


    It seems that, last decades of this mod were affected greatly, so it's possible to script turns (in last decades) to be 3 turn winter, one summer?
    Last edited by Manuel Komnenos; March 07, 2008 at 06:20 PM.
    Why we dig up the past? To understand it.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Climate change - little ice age

    Quote Originally Posted by Manuel Komnenos View Post
    Today I had lecture about that thema, my professor said that one of reasons that hungarian defence system(that Mathias Corvinus established) were very low temperatures.
    Look:


    It seems that, last decades of this mod were affected greatly, so it's possible to script turns (in last decades) to be 3 turn winter, one summer?
    Interesting point of view!The extreme climate(too hot or too cold) actually has given the victory to more than one occasions!
    SEMPER ALLITER SED IDEM

  9. #9
    Manuel Komnenos's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Climate change - little ice age

    I forgot to write collapsed - that M.C defence system collapsed My mistake.
    Little ice age - environmental catastrophe -> years of famine -> year of pestilence + ottoman attacks -> years of famine -> e.c...and so go on

    Some notes
    With the coming cooler climate in the 1400's, temperatures became too cold for grape production and the vineyards in southern England gradually declined.
    Between 1400 and 1700 German wine production was never above 53% of the production before 1300 and at times was as low as 20% of that production (Lamb, 1995.)

    A study of the tree populations in forests of Southern Ontario by Campbell and McAndrews (1993) shows how the tree population in Europe might have been changed by the LIA. Their analysis of pollen demonstrated that after the year 1400, beech trees, the formerly dominant warmth-loving species, were replaced first by oak and subsequently by pine. Further, the forest under study appears to have remained in disequilbrium with the prevailing climate of today. That suggests that tree population distribution takes hundreds of years to recover from major climate changes.

    Medieval warm period (MWP) ended about 1300, from then it will be colder and colder, with 1565, as one of coldest years.
    Last edited by Manuel Komnenos; March 07, 2008 at 06:37 PM.
    Why we dig up the past? To understand it.

  10. #10
    Sarmatian's Avatar Biarchus
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    Default Re: Climate change - little ice age

    Well that's true, but if you look closely at the graph, you'll see that between 1345 and 1530 there weren't no great variations. And between the lowest (1600) and highest (2004) there is one degree celsius difference. It certainly doesn't warrant such a drastic change like 3 winters and 1 summer.

    We know that armies were able to campaign 9 months a year generally... That one degree averege difference would be felt in winter, because that would mean more extreme temperatures in winter, but armies weren't on campaigns than anyway...

    We could nerf population growth, but that is already done, and income from farming but in the end we still have to balance it anyway... Maybe lowering income from farming wouldn't be bad because there are gonna be more ways to earn the florins in tsardoms than in vanilla...

    And also, that was felt more in central Europe than southern. So effect of that was even smaller in Italy or Anatolia and southern balkans. Hungary and Austria would be affected more but that is only 15% of the map...
    Last edited by Sarmatian; March 07, 2008 at 06:59 PM.


  11. #11

    Default Re: Climate change - little ice age

    Guys, it was a half-degree difference, not the coming of Ragnarok. It was certainly not like 1815, when a giant volcanic explosion in Indonesia resulted in "a year without a summer", and massive crop failures. I don't even think it's worth scripting for.

    "Environmental catastrophe" is a bit of an exaggeration.

  12. #12
    Manuel Komnenos's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Climate change - little ice age

    Quote Originally Posted by Sarmatian View Post
    Well that's true, but if you look closely at the graph, you'll see that between 1345 and 1530 there weren't no great variations. And between the lowest (1600) and highest (2004) there is one degree celsius difference. It certainly doesn't warrant such a drastic change like 3 winters and 1 summer.

    We know that armies were able to campaign 9 months a year generally... That one degree averege difference would be felt in winter, because that would mean more extreme temperatures in winter, but armies weren't on campaigns than anyway...
    Believe or not, that one degree celsius was huge change, enough to speed coming of winter and prolongate it.
    I will take examples of Germany and Alps - Estimates can be made as to the average temperature differences between the warm period and the centuries which followed. In this warm time (Medieval warm period), vineyards were found at 780 meters above sea level in Germany. Today they are found up to 560 meters. If one assumes a 0.6-0.7şC change/100 meter vertical excursion, these data imply that the average mean temperature was 1.0-1.4şC higher than the present. For the successful production of grapes a frost-free spring is required after the blossoms are finished. Additionally a warm summer and autumn are required to increase the sugar content. Harvesting should be accomplished before the first fall frost.
    A further botanical evidence which suggests a climatic shift to a colder time is the lowering of the tree line by 70 to 300 meters in the Alps (Lamb 1977). This observation is supported by the remains of peat deposits and forests at higher elevations than they presently occur. A similar 100-200 meter lowing of the tree line also occurred in Northern Germany.

    The thing is that LIA wasn't confined on parts of Europe, it was global:
    The world was on average one or two degrees Celsius cooler than it is today (during the late Ice Age it was six-to-nine degrees cooler). Precisely dated stalagmites from Cold Air Cave as far away as northern South Africa provide evidence of cooler temperatures during the Little Ice Age. Glaciers advanced, tree lines fell, and seas cooled. By 1500 European summers were about seven degrees Celsius cooler than they had been during the Medieval Warm Period.
    The following sections are from Fagan's ''The Little Ice Age'' (Basic Books, 2000):

    “Only 150 years ago, Europe came to the end of a 500 year cold snap so severe that thousands of peasants starved. The Little Ice Age changed the course of European history. Dutch canals froze over for months, shipping could not leave port, and glaciers in the Swiss Alps overwhelmed mountain villages. Five hundred years of much colder weather changed European agriculture, helped tip the balance of political power from the Mediterranean states to the north, and con*tributed to the social unrest that culminated in the French Revolu*tion. The poor suffered most. They were least able to adjust to changing circumstances and most susceptible to disease and increased mortality. These five centuries of periodic economic and so*cial crisis in a much less densely populated Europe are a haunting reminder of the drastic consequences of even a modest cooling of global temperatures.....

    .......The Little Ice Age was not a monolithic deep freeze, but a period of constant, and sometimes remarkable, climatic shifts between torrid summers and subzero winters. As climatic conditions deteriorated, a lethal mix of misfortunes descended on a growing European population. Crops failed and cattle perished by diseases caused by abnormal weather. Famine followed famine bringing epidemics in their train, bread riots and general disorder brought fear and distrust. Witchcraft accusations soared, as people accused their neighbors of fabricating bad weather….

    Because shorter summer armies on Balkan of that time indeed were longer on campaign, prologating it also in winter bc summer was to short.
    examples:
    November 10, 1444, the Battle of Varna
    October 13, 1479 defeat of huge turkish army at Szászváros


    Quote Originally Posted by Sarmatian View Post
    We could nerf population growth, but that is already done, and income from farming but in the end we still have to balance it anyway... Maybe lowering income from farming wouldn't be bad because there are gonna be more ways to earn the florins in tsardoms than in vanilla...

    And also, that was felt more in central Europe than southern. So effect of that was even smaller in Italy or Anatolia and southern balkans. Hungary and Austria would be affected more but that is only 15% of the map...
    ''I came to an immense mass of ice . . . . It was two or three pikes thick, and as wide as the range of a strong bow. Its length stretched indefinitely inwards, so you could not see its end. To anyone look*ing . . . it was a horrifying spectacle, its horror enhanced by one or two blocks the size of a house which had detached themselves from the main mass.''

    -Sebastian Munster, on a Rhone glacier, August 4, 1546

    If you want, I can found you chronicle descriptions of that time. When wine freezed in goblet in city of Zadar and barrels break under pressure of cold.

    Quote Originally Posted by Romano-Dacis View Post
    Guys, it was a half-degree difference, not the coming of Ragnarok. It was certainly not like 1815, when a giant volcanic explosion in Indonesia resulted in "a year without a summer", and massive crop failures. I don't even think it's worth scripting for.

    "Environmental catastrophe" is a bit of an exaggeration.
    Believe or not, there were massive crop failures, there were extreme colds, chroniclers said that human teeth were failing. How years advanced it was worse and worse. Look on red line. And for people of that time, e.c. was word of reality. This is little later, but have you heard for pictures of Breughel or freezing of Thames?
    His winter landscapes of 1565 (e.g. Hunters in the Snow) are taken as corroborative evidence of the severity of winters during the Little Ice Age.


    Inspired by the Black Death, themes of Danse Macabre increased in LIA, related with increasing number of years of famine, years of pestilence.

    I found this in one health magazine, interesting theory:
    In 2006 a scientific study by Dr Thomas van Hoof (Utrecht University) suggests the Black Death contributed to the Little Ice Age. Pollen and leaf data, collected from lake-bed sediments in the southeast Netherlands, supports the idea that millions of trees sprang up on abandoned farmland soaking up carbon dioxide from the atmosphere and thus cooling the planet. The line of research is new and there are questions and further research is needed, but it does pose an interesting theory that man-caused climate change is older than current theories suggest.

    At the end, my opinion is, if it's possible to make last decades 3/4 winter (maybe 1490. - end), then is worth scripting
    Last edited by Manuel Komnenos; March 08, 2008 at 08:01 PM.
    Why we dig up the past? To understand it.

  13. #13
    Sarmatian's Avatar Biarchus
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    Default Re: Climate change - little ice age

    Manuel, you are right in everything you've written, you're only forgetting that Tsardoms map include Italy, Balkans and Anatolia. You're examples include Germany, England, France... What about Greece and Italy? Don't you think it would be silly if there is 9 months of winter there? Or in Anatolia?

    That mini ice age would be felt in Austria, Hungary and a part of central Balkans (Serbia). But it wouldn't be felt in Greece, entire Italy, Anatolia and Egean and Adriatic islands because it is much more to the south and because of the influences of Meditarenean. And those parts cover most of the map.


  14. #14
    Manuel Komnenos's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Climate change - little ice age

    Quote Originally Posted by Sarmatian View Post
    Manuel, you are right in everything you've written, you're only forgetting that Tsardoms map include Italy, Balkans and Anatolia. You're examples include Germany, England, France... What about Greece and Italy? Don't you think it would be silly if there is 9 months of winter there? Or in Anatolia?

    That mini ice age would be felt in Austria, Hungary and a part of central Balkans (Serbia). But it wouldn't be felt in Greece, entire Italy, Anatolia and Egean and Adriatic islands because it is much more to the south and because of the influences of Meditarenean. And those parts cover most of the map.

    I will quote myself:

    The thing is that LIA wasn't confined on parts of Europe, it was global:
    The world was on average one or two degrees Celsius cooler than it is today (during the late Ice Age it was six-to-nine degrees cooler). Precisely dated stalagmites from Cold Air Cave as far away as northern South Africa provide evidence of cooler temperatures during the Little Ice Age. Glaciers advanced, tree lines fell, and seas cooled. By 1500 European summers were about seven degrees Celsius cooler than they had been during the Medieval Warm Period.
    So effects were visible even on Meditterean.
    Last edited by Manuel Komnenos; March 09, 2008 at 10:11 AM.
    Why we dig up the past? To understand it.

  15. #15

    Default Re: Climate change - little ice age

    Quote Originally Posted by Romano-Dacis View Post
    Guys, it was a half-degree difference, not the coming of Ragnarok. It was certainly not like 1815, when a giant volcanic explosion in Indonesia resulted in "a year without a summer", and massive crop failures. I don't even think it's worth scripting for.

    "Environmental catastrophe" is a bit of an exaggeration.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kuwae#C...s_of_the_event

    you guys may want to check this out... a really gigantic volcanic explosion in the year 1453-same as the fall of Constantinople..

  16. #16
    Manuel Komnenos's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Climate change - little ice age

    Yeah, related with last moonless night in the city. ''Sign of God'' that city is on it's own.
    Why we dig up the past? To understand it.

  17. #17
    Matthćus's Avatar Knez Bribirski
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    Default Re: Climate change - little ice age

    how about script that will limit income from agriculture in years after 1490's ?
    to simulate climate influence ?

  18. #18

    Default Re: General Discussion

    No sure if Im posting this in the right place.

    I had an Idea that might be very interesting to implement, if it already hasn't been thought of.

    For units that are known to ride to battle on horseback, but tend to fight dismounted. I would be awesome to have them have the traveling distance (Per Turn) of Cavalry, but appear on the battlefield dismounted.

  19. #19
    Sarmatian's Avatar Biarchus
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    Default Re: General Discussion

    @beavis
    Timurids will appear on the map much like in vanilla. Several stacks of very experienced troops. How many stacks, we don't know yet, we have to se how it balances out. Of course, minus the panzer elephants.
    On the battle of Nicopolis and Varna - well we haven't started working on historical battles yet. They won't be in the first version, so they aren't a priority right now.

    @helloose

    Not a bad idea at all


  20. #20
    Vict0r_1984's Avatar Libertus
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    Default Questions about orthodox factions

    You can post here questions about the orthodox factions

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