It's The Same Thing Every Game

[Sir Winston Churchill]

I hate to say it but after beating the game once it's just boring. With any clan. You start out, take out a rebel force, then move on to a nearby clan's lands and then get stuck in an arms race with every clan. If you're not spitting out troops every turn you'll quickly face a large AI stack that they have somehow managed to come up with. God forbid if you have a war on two sides, because then there are two stacks to worry about when you can only raise one, and you have to choose which way to send that stack. You can even guess when something is going to happen, you always know Imagawa will declare war on Hojo within the first 5 turns. Without fail.

You send it one way, the other enemy stack makes a move into your lands. You're pretty much screwed unless you somehow pull off taking one region, while somehow maintaining peace with the other new ones you just met, and manage to get your main force back in time to fend off the other guys. If you do that, you're set. You can snowball the entire rest of the game managing stacks one way or another to combat other stacks that seem almost unreal. Battles can be simple given the AI has a tendency to smash its forces against your castles like retards trying to go around walls (actually, that's exactly what it is) and get massacred by maybe two units of bow and a unit of katana or yari samurai. And I've NEVER seen the AI use siege weapons, not even firebomb throwers!

If you however fail to hold back the initial starting onslaught, you are quickly overrun and conquered like all the other "great clans" (it's sad when Shimazu, Oda, etc. get conquered within the first few turns by minor clans, I kinda wanted big wars between those guys instead of faceless minor clans I've never even heard of). It's essentially the same thing through every game. At first I really enjoyed it but then it just sorta... died on me. Then again Date is a pretty nice clan to play with, you start with your back against the wall so you only have to direct troops one way, and you have a huge province size so you can prepare faster for incoming stacks. So, I guess I was on easymode?

I don't know, I'm just saddened. I try to play the game but it's just no fun on Hard and it's not much of a challenge on Normal. I mean we can sit here and say the AI is great but really it isn't. You can't even trust human drop-in players because some of them just run around and mess things up, ruining the whole "traditional warfare" feel of things. The only reason the campaign AI seems so smart sometimes is because of the small map size, there's literally not alot of room for them to get lost in. It's all smoke and mirrors to make us think the AI has improved. Sadly the AI is what really matters in a game, a game can look like and yet if the AI is good it's still worth it. I mean look at the original Shogun!

Sometimes I think we need to have poor graphics and game design to have a good AI experience. All these trees and hills and epic castles just confuse the out of it.

[LoneTophat]

I'm sadly on your side. I'm waiting for mods to help this. Until then, I shelfed Shogun II and am now enjoying Portal 2.

[Shugo560]

its really not the same anything could happen each game usegi could be destroyed first turn and some other clan would become huge, mabye another clan became shogun and you would have to deal with that

[Sir Winston Churchill]

its really not the same anything could happen each game usegi could be destroyed first turn and some other clan would become huge, mabye another clan became shogun and you would have to deal with that

Obviously not the exact same but when it boils down to it it is. You are misinterpreting what I mean. Sure clans may come and go even if the Oda almost always go, but it never really veers off far from the basic gameplay. Since everyone has the same units, it's the same thing aside pretty colors and clan symbols.

[Modestus]

The CAI cannot think so you need to help it, CA came up with a campaign map that has little room to manoeuvre except down pathways, I see it as partly a return to the risk type maps of old.

Shogun II is not pretending to be anything other then a game and I agree its limited in more ways then just the map.

[Shugo560]

Obviously not the exact same but when it boils down to it it is. You are misinterpreting what I mean. Sure clans may come and go even if the Oda almost always go, but it never really veers off far from the basic gameplay. Since everyone has the same units, it's the same thing aside pretty colors and clan symbols.

well Date im not sure why everyone thinks "less unit variety boring no strategy to it" less variety actually means more strategy and makes diffrent outcomes to everything, if you can beat a army with the same thing as they do youll need some type of plan, in rome and empire its so much variety there is no strategy to it to me its this, "ok move a line up and some weird unique dlc unit mabye 33rd new york and watch them shoot each other

[Stealthorgasm]

What did you expect from this game? Aliens kidnapping Daiymo's and space pirates taking over colonies? It's the same thing every game. Choose a nation, build it up, expand war, diplomacy and etc. Artificial intelligence can only do so much.

[Mr Kami]

There are several mods that give the game new life DMS and AUM are my personal favorites and they make a huge difference in lasting gameplay.

[Humble Warrior]

Here we go again....

[Googoo24]

Wow that's some great discussion and debate you got going on there. What an argument. How will I ever counter "HAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAA"?

Do you not recall half the clans dying out in STW in very short order? Unlike STW2, they could not return, and there were no clans to replace them, since most of the provinces were full of rebels.

Here we go again....

Apparently.......Can't someone just move this to the player review section?

[Sir Winston Churchill]

Do you not recall half the clans dying out in STW in very short order? Unlike STW2, they could not return, and there were no clans to replace them, since most of the provinces were full of rebels.

HAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAA

[Sir Winston Churchill]

I've seen Hojo AI use firebombs.

That's because they start out with a siege workshops, allowing them to train those units from the get-go. But that's about it, the CAI doesn't like siege works apparently, favoring markets over everything.

Wasn't it the same in S1TW? At least in S2TW customizable generals / technologies / naval warfare and agents come to play. Apart from the AI that you need to play legendary in order to enjoy its the same if not better game.

No it wasn't, Shogun I was it's own game entirely. I tend to want to be sick whenever people try to claim Shogun II is an improvement over Shogun I or how much better it is. It's not even in the same league. The AI in Shogun I was actually smart, or at least made sense with alot of moves. It even knew when to run away on the battlefield to conserve troops rather than throw them all in until every unit was forced to rout or be wiped out completely. Battles did not end "Your remaining troops 1223 Their remaining troops 0" alot, it was way better. The only thing Shogun II has over Shogun I are bright colors, better graphics, and all these little features you mentioned meant to make up for a piss-poor AI.

And playing in legendary is like being in little league but playing in the MLB for "challenge". All it really is is giving the AI massive handicaps allowing them to field stack upon stack within a few turns, allowing them to completely overrun you. It's not a better game just because of that, if anything it's worse and shows just how bad the AI is and how much it's in need of work.

[Ionn]

I've seen Hojo AI use firebombs.

[eleftherios]

Wasn't it the same in S1TW? At least in S2TW customizable generals / technologies / naval warfare and agents come to play. Apart from the AI that you need to play legendary in order to enjoy its the same if not better game.

[RO Citizen]

Unfortunately I have to say that not even mods changed the repetitive gameplay so far.

[fd7s]

i belive in hojo campagin you fight another clans army at the start instead of a rebel force

[emperor77]

You know, i think this is what made me stop playing, i couldn't really put my finger on the problem but now that i've read the OP, i find that i feel exactly the same about S2.

[-=Sigma=-]

I hate to say it but I am going to have to agree with you on this. I see this game as a beta for what is to come next. We will see Rome 2 or MTW3 which will be a huge success, probably an even bigger success with mod tools but we won't be that lucky. To date the two games that I still play every year are Rome Total War and Medieval 2.

[Thefallenhun]

I agree, without reading anything but the title of this thread. It IS the same thing every time. An excellent single player experience. Every. Time.

[Kikoogun]

I am still not sure, which BAI ist better S1 or S2 but definitely!
S2 hast a much better BAI then all TW games in between.
So I am reading complaints about improvements to 4 Games and Addons in between.
And all the Arguments come down to the Map is too small, and the Units are the same.
Aren't TW games not about fighting Battles?
And if the BAI is better than the the BAI of the last Games than we should be happy about!