unit stats not logical

**prske87** · April 11, 2011, 07:57 AM

does anyone knows why the attack is much more stronger than the defence skill ? its stronger about four times than the defence skill. i created two units one with attack 5 charge 1 armor 0 defskill 0
and the second one with attack 1 charge 1 and defskill 10, and the unit with the attack 5 beats the crap out of the defensive unit, they didn`t stand a fighting chance !!! these stats makes no sense to me at all...
People, any ideas, insight or anything that can help ? i am trying to make a mod with much more realism and historical accuracy, where the fighting will last much longer than in the vanila version of the game, but the stats are not logical at all...

**capt_falcone** · April 12, 2011, 12:44 AM

It just seems that it's not a 1:1 ratio. Just make the defense stats much higher.

**prske87** · April 12, 2011, 10:29 AM

Originally Posted by capt_falcone

It just seems that it's not a 1:1 ratio. Just make the defense stats much higher.

It not even a 5:1 ratio ! There must be something else... I gave the defensive unit 15 armor and 15 defence skill but the unit with no armor and no def skill still beats a crap out of them... I got a difference about 15 soldiers... this realy suck... the only thing that helped me to get a fight to last longer is that i put the units in seven ranks... but it seems to me that defence sk and armor almost make no change... the unit will bigger attack wil surely win...

i will try to make the my mod more realistic, with longer fights but it will be a heavy chalenge... I am working with my brother, he makes the models more realistic and with better historical accuracy and i am making the stats and some other stuff... we reacently received a new guy to help us with the mod. If anyone wants in on it here is my mail prske87@hotmail.com so feel free to contact us if you are up to it... we are looking for translators, we have one(the new guy)modelers, and some help with editing the stats... thx for help
sorry bout bad english and grammar

PEOPLE HAVE BAD VIEW OF HAPPINES
IT`S NOT ABOUT MONEY OR SELF IMPROVMENT
IT`S ABOUT BELIEVING IN A WORTHY CAUSE

**Col** · May 06, 2011, 02:59 AM

I don't think the relationship between attack and defence are linear. Melee attack always seems more important to me, its like in the game its actually melee attack vs melee attack to determine who wins a fight.

**Ecka65** · May 06, 2011, 04:13 AM

Just some anectdotal evidence on what Col said: I've found using a smithy for + melee is FAR FAR FAR better than using it for added armor. So I think you're right - melee attack is what makes or breaks.

**GnaReffotsirk** · May 06, 2011, 05:02 AM

Does attack skill/rating (attack) determine the unit's attack speed/rate? Or is there no such thing in S2?

**Col** · May 06, 2011, 07:56 AM

From observation I dont think there's any attack speed difference, the animation is always played at the same speed.

I thinking however big differences in attack rating makes it more likely to get the "quick kill" animation rather than the slower "dueling" animation.

**General Malaise** · May 06, 2011, 01:49 PM

Originally Posted by prske87

does anyone knows why the attack is much more stronger than the defence skill ? its stronger about four times than the defence skill. i created two units one with attack 5 charge 1 armor 0 defskill 0
and the second one with attack 1 charge 1 and defskill 10, and the unit with the attack 5 beats the crap out of the defensive unit, they didn`t stand a fighting chance !!! these stats makes no sense to me at all...
People, any ideas, insight or anything that can help ? i am trying to make a mod with much more realism and historical accuracy, where the fighting will last much longer than in the vanila version of the game, but the stats are not logical at all...

My ZenMod deals with this, as well as regularizing samurai armor more instead of having differing values. Quite a few mods do actually I believe. Pretty sure Radious, darth, s2realism, etc. all raise defense as well.

**GnaReffotsirk** · May 06, 2011, 03:45 PM

I see these in the kv_rules:

armour_melee_penetrating_divisor
armour_melee_piercing_divisor
armour_missile_penetrating_divisor
armour_missile_piercing_divisor
projectile_damage_defense_divisor

Maybe these has something to do with kill rate?

What about the defensive stance, or defense mode? Maybe in S2, units won't use defense skill when defense mode is off?

**bluefalcon9226** · March 19, 2012, 12:35 PM

I'm not sure, but I think maybe the primary stat is "(Melee) Attack," which is used to determine basic fighting strength. "Defense" may decide the unit's resiliency to flanking maneuvers, initial charge power reduction (reduce enemy charge effectiveness), and ability to hold walls (push climbing enemies off?).
That would explain why your 1 vs 1 did not show defense factoring in.

Also, armor is better for reducing casualties from incoming missiles (PFM says about .5 divisor or something). So again, not nearly as important in melee.