NTW is better then STW2

NTW is way better due to it not being so 1 dimensional compared the STW in my case. NTW was the real 1sr PC game i got and after 3-4hrs i got addicted to it. Now i played shogun2 and i have to force myself to like it.

Ur thoughts?????

MY YOUTUBE http://www.youtube.com/user/TNC408 or chk my other channel better vids

been on the nappy forum. i think it will hopefully be totally biased towards nappy and likewise if it was on the shogun forum. i have to say that i love nappy. alot of players feel like u pikey about shogun so i know where ur coming from. i play nappy cos i love the history of the era. i've had some amazing experiences playing this game. u shouldnt just stop playing nappy cos shogun is the new "in" game and ur only playing it to follow the crowd.
nappy for me is an amazing game once u have mastered it.
at the end of the day its personal preferance on wot games u like. whatever floats ur boat. i will still be playing nappy for the foreseeable future.

And bacon is better than ham. =]

I thought you would of taken to shogun like a duck to water as your nappy schtick has always been about good movement and micro espec with cav. I am enjoying both at the mo however I prefer the napoleonic era as a theatre of war. Once I got my head round the tactics and speed in shogun its been great fun which has been benificial to the way I play in Napoleon.

i think theres some good points in this vid about the differences in both games.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ng1kW2dGclw

Originally Posted by triphammer

i think theres some good points in this vid about the differences in both games.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ng1kW2dGclw

I just can't bring myself to watch any more team games on flatlands.
Armies move up, shoot at each other until one flank gives way, then mopping up for another 20 minutes.
The only differences are who put their elites where, who brought how many lights and who charges in his cav when.

This is partly because team games are more static overall, I have seen boring ones in S2 too; but in NTW all battles drag on and on, even after it is very clear who has won.
Also, to me the Unit roster actually feels larger in S2. Not only is it artificially blown up in NTW, there are also whole unit types that are so useless that they're not even used (light cav anyone?). And don't say "you just have to use it right", if you're honest you only get them if can't afford another lancer.

ETW had variation and balance; S2 has speed and balance; NTW has no variation, little speed and no balance.

Originally Posted by daniu

...if you're honest you only get them if can't afford another lancer.

I avoid using lancers and get sabre cav whenever I can (I like being different)

I also avoid playing grassy flats. (hell its not even that flat, one side has a slope)

Not everyone plays the same. I just wish I had some NTW3 games going.

Sorry mate just had to prove you wrong about the lancer statement.

@daniu, the vid i put up wasnt about the match on grassy flat. if u listened to wot jmartin had said u would see he had some valid points about each game. sorry mate i totally disagree with wot u say about nappy and empire. to me empire is totally unbalanced. nappy to me is well rounded and alot more balanced.
the range differences in empire and the fact that rifles are so over powered is just one example.
that said i think cav in nappy is overpowered especially the french cav.
i,m playing alot of 3 v 4 and 2 v 3 games. they are really really good. as u have to be alot more carefull and tactical plus u have to make every shot count. to me these games can be really intense and is the highest expression of teamwork and tactical coordination.
we dont win them all but they are the most fun. from wot i've seen from shogun u just dont get that.
i've played abit of shogun and like i said in my previous statement. its personal preference as to wot u like but to me shogun has been dumbed down. to make it noob friendly. no matter how tactical u think u are at shogun it still descends into a big melee blog at the end.
i rarely play flat map anymore as they are just hammer style tactics but play on most of the other maps. i like to play long intense good games on nappy and not the premature ejaculation battles of shogun where the game lasts no longer than ten mins.
its personal preference and we all have opinions which is good.
i'm not a tw gamer i'm a napoleonic war gamer. to me theres a big difference. i play nappy for that reason. shogun doesnt interest me and infact i would say that not only have CA dumbed it down that they are also anti clan. they have made it a game for the individual. i like team games the shared experence with other players. the sense of community etc etc.
listen to the commernts in the vid instead of just watching it for 10 seconds then dismissing it as another grassy flat vid. then comment....

Originally Posted by triphammer

@daniu, the vid i put up wasnt about the match on grassy flat. if u listened to wot jmartin had said u would see he had some valid points about each game. [...] listen to the commernts in the vid instead of just watching it for 10 seconds then dismissing it as another grassy flat vid.

But it is another grassy flats vid. I see them, I turn them off, no two ways about it; they just nauseate me.
Even if jmartin were to prove Fermats Last Theorem, if he packages it into a grassy flatlands vid, I'm not watching.

I didn't comment on the vid, I commented on the games as I see them.
Nappy has three unit types: cav, line and lights. The actual differences between units within these groups are mostly irrelevant and governed by a clear optimum within each (lancers for cav, light inf instead of rifles for lights). This results in there being the same optimal setup for basically all factions.
In S2, you have more variety to begin with because while the roster looks smaller, every unit has it's use.

Speaking of factions, there is limited choice if you want to be effective; this is why every video is the same: two teams, each with a combination of GB, France or Prussia, and all with 5 lights (because lights have to be limited due to their being OP), 3-4 lancers and the rest line infantry with 1 or 2 guards.
Add to that the endless boringness that is flatlands and no art to limit variety even more.
In S2, you don't even need factions because you can create your own variety by customizing your veterans.

You can say "well but I don't use the major factions anymore or try out different builds now and then because that makes the game more interesting", but that's just crippling yourself on purpose and testament to how unbalanced the game really is.
In S2, any build I choose will work; I just have to adjust my tactics accordingly. How well it fares depends also on the opponent's build; which is much harder to guess than in NTW because every single one makes sense in S2 (as was the case in ETW).

And "long intense good games" are one thing; it's another to watch a video and think "okay that was it, only three line units left for the opponent", then look at the vid's progress bar and realize you're only halfway through. This is what I mean by "being dragged out". The fact that I easily managed to pack several battles of 20-45 minutes into 6-7 minutes vids, a third of which are cinematic filler closeups, just speaks volumes about how much of the game time is actually relevant.

Sure, you can prefer the Napoleonic era or longer battles, but that doesn't make NTW a better game.

In regarding to naval games I'd agree, NTW is less one-dimensional compared to STW2 if one plays with more than 3 ships a player.

But I did find the land games back in NTW very one-dimensional for me. Much like daniu said. Sure there were more units and factions at first glance, but there were only a select few optimal choices, both faction and unit wise. Naval suffered from the faction part as well, but made it up for a gameplay that allowed for quite a few options to pursuit, where for land, there was mainly one way to play it effectively. Disrupt enemy line while preventing the disruption of yours.

Btw, I've had some long intense games in STW2 already, but they are not found in MM.

I never use lancers only with prussia. I use rifles. Ottomans r used alot and russia in grassy team games. I do think NTW is a bit unbalanced but overall there is alot more that could be done on NTW compared to STW. Mass melee charges etc. bore me.

@daniu we'll agree to disagree. whatever floats ur boat buddy. i'll stick to interlocking my arcs of fire and using tactics which work and u stick to ur mass melee blobs and pom style hammer and anvil...

Originally Posted by triphammer

i'll stick to interlocking my arcs of fire and using tactics which work and u stick to ur mass melee blobs

If you're trying to insinuate that tactics aren't needed in S2, be aware that this makes you look ignorant, not superior.

@daniu i couldnt give a monkeys if this does make me look ignorant. i feel strongly enough about this subject to come across like that. u have totally missed my point. shogun is for the individual.
my clan HUNTSMAN is first and foremost a musket clan and more importantly than that we are a team based clan. shogun doesnt deliver that sense of community, that shared experience u get when playing a really intense team game together.
i like ur vids mate. infact i would say ur ntw ones are oscar winning but never ever see u play team games in them or even hear of u playing in team games. from wot i saw u played 1 v 1. so thats why i think u just dont get it.
napoleon delivers that shared experience whereas shogun dont.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ms9o0...eature=related
heres a vid which isnt on flat and shows good teamwork and good tactical thinking in over coming several situations u get on the napoleonic battlefield. something i havnt seen in any shogun vid on youtube...

Originally Posted by triphammer

i couldnt give a monkeys if this does make me look ignorant. i feel strongly enough about this subject to come across like that.

That's not really the issue tbh, of course you're free to prefer NTW however much you like.
But if you say something like "it doesn't require tactics", it's not directed at the game, but insulting the players.
It's like back when ETW started and all the RTW guys went "pffft firearms don't require tactics".
Also, you may not care about coming across as ignorant, but it certainly doesn't strenghten your position in the discussion

shogun is for the individual.

That might be true, at least as far as I am concerned; always been a 1v1 player myself as you state.
But I know that several "old-school" clans like RTK, Wolves and Aggony actually prefer team games themselves; I watched some of them and I can't see how it is less team oriented (I did get just as bored with at least one of those games because team games just lack the dynamics I like which is why I don't play them often).
Judging from the complaints on the boards, team MM is pretty broken though; so regarding the game itself, you're right on that.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ms9o0...eature=related
heres a vid which isnt on flat and shows good teamwork and good tactical thinking in over coming several situations u get on the napoleonic battlefield. something i havnt seen in any shogun vid on youtube...

Will watch when I come home from work I think I saw it already though.

@daniu i'm passionate about nappy and if it comes across as ignorant than like i said before i dont care but dont get all moral high and mighty with me over me over something i feel strongly about as ur sounding elitist with ur comments also.
melee is just not for me and as i've said before each to there own. thnx for watching the vid....

UUmm... flame me if im wrong but isnt STW2 using the same engine as nappy???

In which case you are saying that Nappy is better than STW2.......

but besides eye candy and unit mechanics both games are close to identical when it comes to engines, no??

@bayonetfodder its a musket thing...

Originally Posted by triphammer

@bayonetfodder its a musket thing...

Fair play.

......But not really comparable..... IMO

Originally Posted by Pikey

NTW is way better due to it not being so 1 dimensional compared the STW in my case. NTW was the real 1sr PC game i got and after 3-4hrs i got addicted to it. Now i played shogun2 and i have to force myself to like it.

Ur thoughts?????

MY YOUTUBE http://www.youtube.com/user/TNC408 or chk my other channel better vids

blasfemyyy!!!! i should or u for this !!!!