skaven in storm of chaos

[Valiant Champion]

i understand skaven constructed a doomsday device during the time period. where on the map was the device located?

[Himster]

Middenheim.

[Valiant Champion]

i wonder than if the dark elf spawns (not sure if they are there anymore in 1.4.4 ) should be two stacks of skaven?

[Ulysses S. Grant]

The Skaven don't really attack anyone during the Storm of Chaos. They are involved, but in a more covert way (Eshin does a lot). They aid the forces of Chaos quite a bit, most notably when they aid the Nurgle general Feytor in taking several Empire castles, by opening the gates from the inside as well as helping to spread disease.

They also carry out numerous assassinations (Such as killing Valten), and there is of course the Doom Hemisphere incident under Middenheim.

Still i think the Skaven could be included as a mercenary unit (Gutter Runners and Night Runners) and there could be the odd experienced Skaven Assassin running around the campaign map.

[Toho]

why not adding the Skaven to the beastman armies?

[Ulysses S. Grant]

Because their not beastmen and they didn't help the Beastmen in the Storm of Chaos.

[Toho]

true but it does make the game more interesting for me as a player, beating beastmen as Reikland or Middenheim is both very boring and very easy. the poor dudes have like only 2 units and no diversity. so adding Skaven to them should improve things in my opinion.

[Ulysses S. Grant]

I think Skaven would be better for the chaos factions.

Maybe the beastmen will have more units in later versions (There is a lot of stuff in their army book).

[Himster]

Clan moulder attacked Kislev, also they'd play a bigger part in the mountains than night-goblins (attacking dwarfs), I think skaven should get get the night goblin, slot and most of their posessions. Oh and also Grimgor should start off the campaign fighting clan moulder, before having to fight Crom.

Plus Skaven attack Nuln rather often, that'll give Wissenland something to do at the start of the campaign (they're very boring at the start).

Beastmen will get more units. Eh Skaven are technically beastmen, but they're very very very different: merging those two factions may seem like a good idea at first but there come up some glaring complications.

[Ulysses S. Grant]

Eh Skaven are technically beastmen, but they're very very very different: merging those two factions may seem like a good idea at first but there come up some glaring complications.

Their not Beastmen as they are not connected to "men" in the way beastmen are. Beastmen are goat like animals mixed with humans because of the warping power of chaos, whereas Skaven are simply rats that were mutated horribly by warpstone (They are not part human in origin).

Still in the fluff most people who see Skaven think their beastmen as most simply don't believe Skaven exist. (Even after they nearly destroyed the Empire once, and more recently when Thanquol destroyed half of Nuln).

[Toho]

i agree with Himster, maybe we could give the night goblin units to the green skins faction(only recruitable in ex-dwarf settlements) and have the night goblin faction replaced by the Skaven. now with these Skaven faction there could be scripts where they invade various places in the empire and dwarf lands. i think there are enough skaven units already ingame to make these invasions interesting, certainly more interesting than beastmen.

[LittleDwarf]

In the current time skaven hold the following in :

Karak Varn
Vast majority of Karak Eight Peaks, along with goblin leader Skarsnik.
A lots of dwarven mines and smaller settlements.
A portion of Karak Azgal's dungeons.

And actually, they do CONSTANTLY attack dwarfs, especially in mentioned Karak Eight Peaks.

[Ulysses S. Grant]

What i was talking about is their active involvement in the actual Storm of Chaos battles. They don't openly go to war with the Empire at this time, and their attacks on the Dwarves, although regular, are subterranean and impossible to show on the campaign map. Also Karak Eight Peaks is held by 3 factions at the same time which is also very difficult to show.

[Shadowlair]

why not make karak 3 castles in a very close proximity? like a east west and north kinda thing, and give each respectable part to the respectable owner? could be a solution

[Valiant Champion]

it would be no problem I think giving them a spawn army exclusively skaven only from either the dark elf, beastmen, night goblin or a subfaction rebel. The only complication would be if they took a city and held it for very long then units from that faction would be recruited thus introducing some unrealistic results.

I can see if they were actively involved attacking the dwarves it would not be too far fetched to overhaul the night goblins and change the name to skaven. Than use skaven spawn stacks to represent the doomsday device attempt at middenheim.

Also the Skaven are known for attempting above ground city takeovers. They tend to be subteranean in nature as a way to expand without coming into conflict with the Empire and Chaos as much. However as Dwarves also prefer subteranean habitation than there would obviously be conflicts.

However as subteranean goes I think it is in game already in how the night goblin factions capital can only be attacked through a long path in the mountians. The next step to create a subteranean world would be to create battle maps that would simulate a very dark battlefield.

Thus if every mountian chain has a corridor in running along the middle of it like third ages misty mountians or the corridor in the world edge mountians in this game you would be able to produce something similiar to a subteranean effect.

Than more complex things could be done such as creating a way to represent the underway that goes under the large lake next to Zhufbar.

[Toho]

sometimes i think lore should be sacrificed for better game play, i know its cool and all with the whole roll playing thing but whats more important? playing a more diverse game play or a lore restricted game?

[Shadowlair]

Depends on who you speak, if you make a mod based on something, enthousiastics will always ask for more lore, while some people want more gameplay, and the thing is to find the best line between them, since not everything is possible and sorts, if you get something that appeals to both sides with awesomesauce, you got yourself a masterpiece withouth compare