Shogun 2 (TATW 2)

[Doedel]

Great fan of TATW and I must say one of the most exciting prospects of Shogun 2 is the possibility of a LOTR mod on it. It seems only a natural step since both Rome and Medieval 2 have major LOTR mods. Empire and Napoleon, we can skip those, since they're all "futuristic".

I saw previous thread about this (that was made before the game's release) but it seemed more rambling than actual discussion.

Primarily there's a few reasons I'd like to see TATW on Shogun and areas I think Shogun can improve on TATW:

1 - Co-Op Campaign. IMHO co-op is the best invention since TV and I'd love to be able to play TATW co-op with another friend (Gondor and Rohan? Mordor and Isengard? Come onnnnnnnnnnnn). This alone would justify LOTR on Shogun.
2 - Big AI improvement and unit behaviour/responsiveness across the board.
3 - Naval battles. This would of course probably be limited to Gondor and Harad/Umbar but still, it would be a very interesting avenue to explore.
4 - Overall more in-depth campaign capabilities, hero system, tech tree and the like, would make for a more interesting experience.

So, other thoughts from those who have played Shogun?

[Hero of the West]

shogun 2 is not modable enough for TATW as far as i know.. besides i think me2 gives more then enough options for third age

[Grimbold']

And I honestly don't think that the TA team wanna abandon all this work, and start from scratch again.

[Garch]

huh? not modable enough? idk about that but i think that would be a great idea since MTW is 6years old and kind of chease for the 21st centery....and i think the new AI and other things in shogun will make TATW that much beter then in MTW...and what options?compeird to shogun? you ok? TATW would be 10 times beter on shogun dude hans down.

[Muffer Nl]

It is not sure whether the map can be modded.

[The Bold Burgundian]

Many things would need to be done that simply cannot at the moment for a successful TA:TW2, such as:

New map - Can't be done.

New animations - Can't be done.

New models - Can't be done.

New Textures - Can't be done.

While a third age mod in the new engine would be delightful, it's simply impossible at the moment.

[Gallus]

One word: sieges

[el Cid]

I understand what you mean, though you have to understand that it is (at this moment) impossible to do any modding on Shogun 2. And even if it'd be possible, just when we're getting Custom Settlements abandoning this project would be the most insane thing to do.

[AragornElessar]

if they abandon it i will blast the horn the true last time and ride out. but i agree it would be awesome to have it on shogun 2

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

This was already discussed at the Preview part 1 thingy

[el Cid]

if they abandon it i will blast the horn the true last time and ride out

You mean you'll scream like a frightened girl and then hang yourself from your window.

[AragornElessar]

I never would kill myself killing yourself is for nerds

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Never

[Erunion Telcontar]

I would very much like to see Total War: Third Age 2. However, don't expect it for another... Oh... Four years or so.
That's how long between the release of Med II and TA was, and it'll likely take that long before Shogun II is modifiable enough for a Third Age like project to be done.

[leo.civil.uefs]

Great fan of TATW and I must say one of the most exciting prospects of Shogun 2 is the possibility of a LOTR mod on it. It seems only a natural step since both Rome and Medieval 2 have major LOTR mods. Empire and Napoleon, we can skip those, since they're all "futuristic".

I saw previous thread about this (that was made before the game's release) but it seemed more rambling than actual discussion.

Primarily there's a few reasons I'd like to see TATW on Shogun and areas I think Shogun can improve on TATW:

1 - Co-Op Campaign. IMHO co-op is the best invention since TV and I'd love to be able to play TATW co-op with another friend (Gondor and Rohan? Mordor and Isengard? Come onnnnnnnnnnnn). This alone would justify LOTR on Shogun.
2 - Big AI improvement and unit behaviour/responsiveness across the board.
3 - Naval battles. This would of course probably be limited to Gondor and Harad/Umbar but still, it would be a very interesting avenue to explore.
4 - Overall more in-depth campaign capabilities, hero system, tech tree and the like, would make for a more interesting experience.

So, other thoughts from those who have played Shogun?

1 - Co-Op is all that good? I dont see why.
2 - Yes the AI is better, nut dont excite yourself with this, they said the same in Empire.
3 - Naval battles in Middle Earth?
4 - Morte stuff is nice but it does no justify abandoning M2TW

M2TW has a good modding capacity, the graphics are quite nice even compareed with shogun 2. Shogun 2 does not allow all that modding. Shogun 2 does not allow flying units. Shogun 2 is set in feudal Japan so it would be nescessary to change EVERYTHING to bring it to Third Age, while M2TW already have things like trebuchets and european medieval cities done. Do you know my son, how much work was necessary to get the TATW mod the way we have it today? Did you saw the boring generic settlements in shogun 2 that will be repeated in the whole japan map while we in TATW will have a different settlement for every corner in middle earth?

To be honest, I playied Shogun 2 Demo and all I saw was a ridiculous rainbow in the campaign map. Seriously, itseems like they did it to be a nice graphic looking game but "strategy" itself stills the same from the older titles.

In my opinion, RTW engine was the ebst ever created in total war games and M2TW use the same ngine but far more polished.

I really dont see necessity for changing the enginefor this mod. And belive, it would take 2 years to do it.

Right now I can bet that CA developers are dying of envy when they see KK's custom settlements.

[trollface]

>I never would kill myself killing yourself is for nerds

hmmm

[*Ranger*]

Shogun 2 will most probably never be as moddable as M2tw, plus i hate the Empire/Napoleon/Shogun2 engine... M2tw is much better

Anywho this discussion is pointless, as without KK there is no TATW.

[thespaniard]

sigh just wish i could use a flying nazgul so much then all the little gondor spears can run away like the cowards they are or using eagles to hunt down the damn snaga archers + skirmshers but i dont like the way of retraining troops in shogun id rather have to return my army to a castle or somthing to retrain than do it anywhere.

[alreadyded]

sigh just wish i could use a flying nazgul so much then all the little gondor spears can run away like the cowards they are or using eagles to hunt down the damn snaga archers + skirmshers but i dont like the way of retraining troops in shogun id rather have to return my army to a castle or somthing to retrain than do it anywhere.

We have fell beasts and eagles in m2tw engine, I doubt you could put anything like that in Shogun 2 for a while. Also many of the animations in Shogun 2 are horrible, worse than m2tw. And the whole game has a fake look and feel to it because it looks so colorful and vibrant all the time.


The sieges in Shogun are not better, they simply put the tops of the walls level with the ground. So sieges would be a huge problem without proper walls and pathfinding.

[leo.civil.uefs]

Also many of the animations in Shogun 2 are horrible, worse than m2tw. And the whole game has a fake look and feel to it because it looks so colorful and vibrant all the time.

yes, its true.

The sieges in Shogun are not better, they simply put the tops of the walls level with the ground. So sieges would be a huge problem without proper walls and pathfinding.

This is the whole thing. S2TW sieges are crap, they could do something really inovating but did not.


For now, M2TW custom settlements are the most incredible staff ever seen in a TW game.
Thanks Wilddog and Makanyane, two genious who created the IWTE.

And and if that was not enough, that tool is now in the hand of another genius called KingKong who are making the custom settlements in a way that even the professionals from CA could not (or dont want to).

So we should be grateful that the better mod ever made are in hands of competent guys while Creative Assembly professionals keep doing the same errors.

M2TW engine is perfect for TATW

Hey alreadyded Im still waiting for some pics or video for fellbeasts and eagles.

[wolfbane751]

Also many of the animations in Shogun 2 are horrible, worse than m2tw.


The sieges in Shogun are not better, they simply put the tops of the walls level with the ground. So sieges would be a huge problem without proper walls and pathfinding.

wtf are you retarded or something shogun 2 total wars animations are so much better than m2tw in medieval 2 they dont even act like they are hittin the actual person when they fight

[Vifarc]

Med2 engine is far better than Shogun2 one:
Med2 does not need Steam. Shogun2 need it: End of game.