The Weight of Existence

[Siblesz]

Why does existence weigh down upon humanity? Why do some search for knowledge, have an incredible thirst for it, but are continually depressed, while others remain in ignorance and are perfectly happy by doing so? Some say it's determined by intelligence... Smart people are more likely to seek information, and knowledge corrupts. But what defines intelligence these days? Some of the most brilliant men that ever existed couldn't solve math problems or read complex books. And why is it supposed that the search for knowledge is a side-effect of intelligence when we're seeing more and more average people take an interest in acquiring knowledge?

Are human beings physically adept at receiving the amount of information that they receive now-a-days? In this day and age, we receive more information in a single day than the average Medieval man received in an entire lifetime. Can our brains manage the overload? Is this why we're seeing a culture of addiction to everything and anything? Or why a decay in morality and the social norms of society occurs once the income of a group tends to be higher and therefore is exposed to more information? Or why everyone seems to be drugging themselves into foregetful oblivion by taking some drug or other, whether it be pot or alchohol or heroin or any other type of thought-altering drug. It seems like existence itself is weighing down upon humanity these days, and an addiction for knowledge that we ourselves don't seem fit to retain is causing our brains to go hay wire, creating a chemical imbalance in the brain, and making us seek remedies like the above-mentioned that only worsen the situation.

Any thought that requires intellectual effort is like putting myself closer to the grinder. In my 17 years of life, I've managed to accumulate billions of bits of information... more information than most people acquire in their lifetime, to be honest. But what good does it do to know and understand things and acquire more information than one already has when all it does is to continue weighing one down towards self-depreciation and depression. It's called depressive realism. If you haven't been aware of this term, depressive realism postulates that people who suffer depression perceive the reality that surrounds them more accurately than people who are not suffering from depression. Source So there we have it... studies prove that the more accurately one perceives reality, the more depressed one will be. Modernity is creating a culture of depressive humans. It seems that the more neurons are stimulated and used, the more the emotions of the brain become imbalanced as well.

Personally-speaking, depressive realism comes and goes as the wind with me. I envy simplicity. It seems odd how the simpler one thinks, the happier one is. But one can't seem to return to simplicity once one has achieved complexity. Knowledge is addictive. Often times, being able to think for oneself is seen as a commodity and a gift for a person to possess, but I perceive it as a curse. That commodity is impossible to remove once it becomes a wall to one's freedom of mind.

[bdh]

Indeed, but the simplicity you strive for shouldn't be one of thought, but one of action. One must not do more than simply receive knowledge, but react to it, and react in ways that are at the core of our humanity. For some, as you described, the reaction is to escape into drugs and alcohol. They fall into a very basic action, the attainment of pleasure. But this escape is often more destructive than it is constructive, and, in a way, attacks the rational mind by putting it in a state of euphoria. What one needs is a different core escape, but this escape would fall outside of the human mind. One must apply himself for good in solidarity with other. One can leave reality by applying the reality which has defined him in the application of himself. At it's heart, there is no greater nor simpler response than moving outward, outward into community and into the world. Don't let kowledge collapse on top of, run away from it by moving with it. To be passive is to be perceiving. Stop perceiving in right action, good and simple action.

Thats my two cents.

[SoggyFrog]

It's interesting that you talk about what is natural but both nature in humans and in the wild is not static. You contrast the huge thirst for knowledge of modern man against the simplicity of his medieval predecessor. If we go further, we find what first distanced humans from animals was our knowledge; the use of tools, language, fire, domestication, etc. So, each step down the evolutionary ladder from humans would find less complexity and more simplicity. More complex animals have plenty to think about and worry about, deeper emotions and relationships, but to us those thoughts and emotions are quite simple. Further in this direction, past the brainless invertebrates, past the single cells, past the complex organic molecules and the lone atoms we find the single electron.

It certainly is the epitome of simplicity. Its only action is governed by law. Is it happy? Of course not, it's no more than a particle of matter. I concede it is not depressed either. Though this is an extreme comparison, it is fairly reasonable. Going back to the peasant in medieval ages, he has no appreciation for his simplicity, only a mind for his duties. He is at times worried about the existing problems he knows and faces, his lord, the plague, getting enough food to feed himself, sometimes wishing to be a bird whom he believes to be free of cares.

Our natural inclination towards development presses upon us greater complexities and perhaps a wider capacity with which to perceive things. I've not decided what to believe but what the above anecdote might suggest is that with that wider capacity we may be more happy and more depressed in the extremes at times, which could fit in with this depressive realism.

[vizi]

I don't exist. Therefore nothing weighes down upon my unburdened soul.

[Jesus The Inane]

Some of the most brilliant men that ever existed couldn't solve math problems or read complex books.

Interesting. Care to provide me with some examples?

Are human beings physically adept at receiving the amount of information that they receive now-a-days? In this day and age, we receive more information in a single day than the average Medieval man received in an entire lifetime. Can our brains manage the overload?

Interesting thought, like your entire post. I view human beings as computers, or perhaps machines. Or perhaps both. Perhaps so much information is hurting us. Like you said, we are overloading ourselves with dated that we cannot keep. Perhaps its too much for our brains to handle.

I wonder, if there are smarter beings somewhere in the universe, will they be the most depressing animals in the universe? Probably...

Is this why we're seeing a culture of addiction to everything and anything? Or why a decay in morality and the social norms of society occurs once the income of a group tends to be higher and therefore is exposed to more information? Or why everyone seems to be drugging themselves into foregetful oblivion by taking some drug or other, whether it be pot or alchohol or heroin or any other type of thought-altering drug.

But back then, there wasn't so many things to get addicted to... they didn't have the hardcore drugs that we have now... they didn't have cars or porn to get addicted to... and people had more busy work, I suppose, atleast the teenagers. Maybe that is why they needed war... as a time waster.

It seems like existence itself is weighing down upon humanity these days, and an addiction for knowledge that we ourselves don't seem fit to retain is causing our brains to go hay wire, creating a chemical imbalance in the brain, and making us seek remedies like the above-mentioned that only worsen the situation.

I blame our growing depression on the simple fact that we humans are hunters. We want to be out there hunting, but we are being feed. And we don't want to be feed. We want to hunt, but we can't.

Any thought that requires intellectual effort is like putting myself closer to the grinder. In my 17 years of life, I've managed to accumulate billions of bits of information... more information than most people acquire in their lifetime, to be honest. But what good does it do to know and understand things and acquire more information than one already has when all it does is to continue weighing one down towards self-depreciation and depression.

I know what you mean with the first sentence... or I think I know. Maybe the answer lies on our age. We have too much information in our young brains. Maybe as we grow older we'll start making sense out of existance. Maybe we should stop gathering information for a while... so as to give our brains a rest, you know?

Personally-speaking, depressive realism comes and goes as the wind with me. I envy simplicity. It seems odd how the simpler one thinks, the happier one is. But one can't seem to return to simplicity once one has achieved complexity. Knowledge is addictive. Often times, being able to think for oneself is seen as a commodity and a gift for a person to possess, but I perceive it as a curse. That commodity is impossible to remove once it becomes a wall to one's freedom of mind.

I too envy simplicity. And I agree with what you are saying. The thing is that I feel you and me have too much time in our hands... so we think too much... we over-think. And this is bad, like everything that is taken to the extreme. The solution is to get a job that requires you to not have any free time whatsoever. Thats what I hope to get when I graduate.

[Siblesz]

Interesting. Care to provide me with some examples?

This explains it:

Novelists often depict cynical characters who believe they live in a world without meaning and mock those around them who think life has significance. Her problem was the opposite. She sensed meaning everywhere, but could never verify it. She spent her life feeling: "I don’t get it."
.............
She had a brilliant ability to sense relevance (a frontal lobe function) and an extraordinary memory, but couldn’t understand math, grammar or logic because she couldn’t properly connect symbols.

http://www.societyforqualityeducatio...tter/1114.html

The brain is specialized in different tasks... Even the left and right brain have specialized areas within themselves. So therefore, you can be a brilliant man at figuring out torturous equations, yet not understand a single thing about artistic imagery or the abstract meaning of a poem.

The opposite could be said as well... you can be a genius writer and poet, yet not be able to solve a simple equation.

As for a definite example, I can give you some... Mozart could write some brilliant symphonies, but his life was a mess and he didn't really understand the concept of money. The same as Marx... Marx was a brilliant author, yet when things got financial and technical, he was a complete brute.

It's not all genetic, though. The lack of activity in one area of the brain in contrast to another could just be out of lack of interest for that particular area. You can increase the output of a particular section of your brain by just excercising it daily. As they say, practice makes perfect. But of course, most of it comes from natural talent and genetics.

I need to go to sleep, so I'll try and respond to some of these posts tomorrow. Have a good night guys.

[Decemvir]

I blame our growing depression on the simple fact that we humans are hunters. We want to be out there hunting, but we are being feed. And we don't want to be feed. We want to hunt, but we can't.

I agree and would add that I believe the assembly line has also contributed to this. Man no longer has the satisfaction of completing a task. A man who works in an automobile plant installing rear-view mirrors all day never feels as if he is contributing to society or (perhaps more importantly) does not feel as if he is really doing anything. Long gone are the days where a man would sow crops and see them grow. The seasons gave a man a visible indicator of time passing while he tended his crops (the same could be said of any artisan previous to the Industrial Revolution).

Are human beings physically adept at receiving the amount of information that they receive now-a-days? In this day and age, we receive more information in a single day than the average Medieval man received in an entire lifetime. Can our brains manage the overload?

Yes, I think we can (as a species) process the information which is recieved. While we do recieve much more stimulous than those who lived in Medieval period we do not recieve that much more than the preceding generation. The human brain is a complex organ that (I believe) absorb much more information that we give it credit for. Moreover, by continually increasing our stimulous we condition our brains to adapt to handling such (in comparison to previous generations) amounts. However, I do not believe that such an increase in stimulous does not have any side-effects. Attention spans of people tend to be shorter than those of the preceding generation. That is only normal if one considers that the brain has adapted itself to sorting through much more information and so it is conditioned to constantly recieve more/additional stimulous. On a side note, I wonder if people these days require more sleep than those before them so as to allow their brains to condense/sort through/process all of the stimulous that it constantly recieves (in this I somewhat agree with Jesus the Inane and his comment on brains being similar to computers, our brains need to be defraged every so often).

Anyway, to get back to Siblesz original statement (question?) about knowlege heightening depression: I wonder, why is it that you feel that knowlege leads to curruption/depression? Must knowlege (or the accumulation of knowlege) have a purpose? I would speculate that 'purpose' might be what is at the root of knowlege and depression. Could knowlege lead to depression because once one is aware of the complexities of life one feels the need to legitimize it and search for a purpose or goal?

[chimera1715]

I think Siblesz is being a bit too pessimistic here. I would consider myself an intellectual, lucky enough to be born in the United States and have the oportunity to attend a major university. I find the quest for knowledge to be enlightening and for me there are few activities more enjoyable than expanding my knowledge on subjects that I find interesting.

Sure, with increased knowledge comes some depression at the actual state of reality. But I do not find that I am constantly weighed down by the presurres of modern society. Man is the great adapter, able to master almost any situation, including our modern day life. It is human nature to look back at "simpler" times with some fondness, but the fact remains that it is because we did not experiance this past that we sometimes long for it. It is easy to critize our modern society as immoral and depressing, but those who claim this have an utter lack of historical perspective. There is no other time in the history of the human race I would rather be living through than now. I am not saying that there are not serious problems in todays world, but I think that most humans are both physically and materially better off now than they ever were.

Knowledge should be viewed as a path to greater human achievment, not denigrated as only a path to depression. If you feel burdened by modern day life, it just means that you have yet to find the proper balance between concern and apathy. You cannot mope around forever being depressed about the situation of the human race just because you are an informed individual. Utimatly, you have to accept that most things are beyond your immediate control and that you have to live and act within the existance you find yourself in. This is my perception in 22 years of life.

[Sam]

Someone who has a good memory shouldn't be classified as 'intelligent'. There is a wide misconception that, say, being good at trivial pursuit means someone is intelligent. Anyway, I don't believe that we are taking in too much information these days, and I don't believe any amount of education can be harmful to one's well-being as long as it is not forced upon the individual. I'm attending university full time doing an engineering degree, and I spend much of my free time learning German, but I don't feel 'weighed down' by anything, because I do it all by choice.

[Nicanor of Sparta]

The presence of information is not necessarily evidence of the attainment of information. People will only attain the information that is important to them, or that they perceive is important to them. I go to a mainly engineering college, but I was almost an english major at another school. It's sad the number of students here that don't even know who James Joyce is. They've never read Heller, Salinger, couldn't tell you the importance of a Monet and only know Van Gogh as "that crazy guy that cut off his ear."

That being said, it's easy to see how the simple minded are happier. If all a person is interested in is sex, drugs, and rock & roll, the culture is more than happy to supply. If a person has interests other than that of the now social norm, they'll be left wanting. To imply that the Medieval mind was more simple than that of modern humans is ridiculous. We're essentially no more advanced than the Greeks were 2500 years ago. Plato, Aristotle, Da Vinci, Bach, Newton, Einstein. Had they all had access to the type of technology we have today, there's no telling what they would have come up with. That's the problem, the technology gives human beings options, and most of the species makes bad decisions based on their pleasures.

You may argue all you want that human beings are frightened by the reality that surrounds them. That the attainment of information results in depression because it necessitates an acceptance of that reality. Look at those people I mentioned earlier. True genius is not one in a million, it seems more like once every hundred years. Why? Why so few? If humans are indeed afraid of our reality (which I admit, some of us are), then why have so few crossed that great line? The answer is clear when you look at the options and choices people have and make. Fear is not the fundamental nature of man, it's laziness. We're as lazy as techonolgy allows us to be.

[Ecclesiastes]

I understand because I am questioning the same thing (sometimes). That will always result in some sort of a depression without any answers which will pass in time. I cannot say I experience the same depressions as you or somebody else because I am rather new at this (1 and a half year or so). I'm actually experiencing this at the moment which results in me not posting anything because I feel like an emtpy vessel. These depressions are becoming more and more deeper and the only thing one can do about is to do something that makes you forget about those questions like work or a sport. I'm experiencing this because I am currently working on my biography which is rather long and depressing.

I too envy those ingnorant and happy but have a hard time thinking how I would or could be like that. Therefore I prefer this pain above ignorance (atleast for now). That is how I think of it... I wish all of you that experience the same strength and know that you are priveleged although that is hard to understand sometimes...

[Nicanor of Sparta]

working on your autobiography?? you're 17 for christ's sake! nobody cares! and siblesz, you "envy simple and ignorant people"?? you're 17 too!
stop acting like no one understands how "complicated your mind is". it's not. you two aren't depressed because you know oh so much .. you think that you can talk to a person for 5 minutes and know that they're simple and ignorant, but you can't. this is the exact same reason why people equate happiness with ignorance. it's all bull. people see a happy person and they automatically think they're stupid. ever wonder if it's you that's stupid?

[Siblesz]

....working on your autobiography?? you're 17 for christ's sake! nobody cares! and siblesz, you "envy simple and ignorant people"?? you're 17 too!
stop acting like no one understands how "complicated your mind is". it's not. you two aren't depressed because you know oh so much. . you think that you can talk to a person for 5 minutes and know that they're simple and ignorant, but you can't. this is the exact same reason why people equate happiness with ignorance. it's all bull. people see a happy person and they automatically think they're stupid. ever wonder if it's you that's stupid?

Nicanor... this rage of yours' is simply inadequate to answer the logic of the member's motives. Not because you insult anyone here of being immature and stupid, but because you suppose to have the right to do so while you're only 21 years old as well. Age doesn't account for intelliegence or understanding. It's not like I'm alone and naive in supposedely being immature and foolish about envying people who are ignorant, because if you know anything about Western literature, you'll know that it's one of the main themes of every poem, short story, and novel that you can come accross and read. Every great philosopher has expressed in one form or other the human condition of suffering from the state of self-isolation and reclusion that is created by excessive knowledge. This is not something that's new... The corruption of knowledge in an individual's mind is a topic that has been debated since the high priests at Ur intentionally limited information away from the populace in order to keep them controlled, yet happy.

Now don't suppose that with your omniscient perception of reality you can come here and insult half of us away. Truth be told, I expected some sort of reaction like this. I expected someone to come here and pull the age card. "Oh, it's just a phase". Or "Oh, you're just too young to understand." Or "Oh, you're only arrogant know-it-all kids." I'm not saying that these arguments don't have their logic behind them, but the logic in them is so subject to prejudice as to make it illogical in the end of things. What do you know about me, eh Nicanor? Maybe a few things, but what do you really know about me? The same that I know about you: nothing. So prejudging me or anyone else in this forum along the lines of age and immaturity is simply naive on your part. Now, does that give me a right to prejudge the rest of the world along the lines of ignorance? Not at all, and that's why I was being real careful not to do so by saying that people of normal intelligence are also suffering from this same corruption of knowledge now-a-days. I count myself as a person of average to above-average intelligence. My mind is nothing extraordinary. But I have lived a lot for my years, and you can't take that away from me, no matter what my profile states my age is. After all, if I hadn't included a date of birth in my profile, you'd think I was in my mid 30s. Isn't that so?

Furthermore, we aren't depressed because we place ourselves on a stall and proclaim ourselves superior, we're depressed because we do the opposite and proclaim ourselves inferior for having acquired too much information too quickly and ended up more confused and isolated than ever before. I have my friends... I have dozens of them. I'm a recluse, in my own way, but this is out of choice, not because people don't like me. I'll give you an example of how this particular attribute of solemnity affects me. Several times I've been in the middle of a party or reunion. Everyone around me is having fun, including myself. Then suddenly, the fun ceases to be for me, and I have an intense feeling of being completely isolated, even though I have dozens of people around me. That, my friend, is pure solemnity. Solemnity caused, not by arrogance or from being angry at society, but by a real feeling of isolation from the rest of society... an isolation created by an excess of knowledge and a state of frustration for having it.

And how do I know the difference between people who are ignorant of their reality from those that aren't? Well you are a perfect example. It's a person who speaks as if they know everything about everyone, just like I am doing, but without any real substance or logic to back themselves up.... just mere blabber and angry rhetoric. That, my friend, is when I know. And that accounts not just for you, who are only 21, but even to old 76 year olds who've learned nothing from their lives but that which is within their own barriers of reach.


I'll respond to the rest later today.

[Ecclesiastes]

.... working on your autobiography?? you're 17 for christ's sake! nobody cares! and siblesz, you "envy simple and ignorant people"?? you're 17 too!
stop acting like no one understands how "complicated your mind is". it's not. you two aren't depressed because you know oh so much. . you think that you can talk to a person for 5 minutes and know that they're simple and ignorant, but you can't. this is the exact same reason why people equate happiness with ignorance. it's all bull. people see a happy person and they automatically think they're stupid. ever wonder if it's you that's stupid?

My response will be similar with that of siblesz but I will say it anyway.

First off I am working on my biography for the lives of the civitates thread and not because I think my life is something special. If anything it is the opposite of special.. rather dull. But I had nothing to do so I thought why not...

I posted here because I am experiencing the same thing as siblesz and many others and perhaps wanted to have an "intelligent" discussion about it that will perhaps ease my "suffering".

As siblesz I also knew this would happen so I will try to explain myself. In my post I was very carefull of not creating an image of me feeling superior over others because I simply do not.

I cannot say I experience the same depressions as you or somebody else because I am rather new at this (1 and a half year or so).

Here I clearly say I know I am perhaps to young to understand certain stuff but what I do know is ahead of my age. And I do not think I have a complicated mind, rather one that is doing what it is supossed to do... think. Why I think I am ahead of my age? I have asked friends (yes I do have them as do I have a social life) questions that were in my mind and all they could do is laugh and say I think to much Think to much? Can a person really think to much... yes of course but I think it is they who think to little not me who thinks to much. I simply can't help it, they however can decide to be ignorant or not.. but they choose ignorance without even knowing it. I sometimes have a tendecy to feel superior over those who are supossedly "ignorant" but then I slap myself and everything is fine. I do not consider myself wise, rather "enlightend" because I can see and understand I actually know nothing. And wisdom has nothing to do with age... wisdom is simply knowing you know nothing. This I do but still I don't consider myself wise.

[Nicanor of Sparta]

think "too" much....

...wow

anyway i never said i have an "omniscient perception of reality", but thanks for complimenting me. and yes, there is a problem with thinking too much (not to much). the problem is when you spend all day sitting around thinking, you're not doing anything. while you may not know anything about me, nor i you, i can assure you that i've done more in my life than most people twice my age. how many languages do you speak? how many countries have you lived in?

what made james joyce the great author that he was wasn't the things that he thought, it was the things that he did. would he have ever been such an amazing writer if he had stayed in ireland? while knowledge is indeed not dependant on age, it is not dependant on thought either. your line of thought is very alchemist indeed. take a more daoist approach to life and i assure you that you'll be much happier.

all i'm saying is you two sound like you have attained such knowledge when you've never left your "ireland". you say that you envy ignorant people.. i never said i was smarter than you, but you need to realise how ridiculous you sound. it's elitest, and i for one am not going to stand for it. i've met 14 year olds in italy more mature than you two. the fact that i'm even bothering with this is ludicrous. you talk about how you envy ignorance, yet i bet neither one of you would give up everything you had and go homeless for two years in parts of the world you've never been...something you're totally ignorant of...

in short, stop whining...you have no idea how good you have it.

and you're right to point out that this most certainly is rage. rage at two ungreatful teenage boys that have no idea how much better they have it than billions of people on the planet.

...and i love to see that no one bothered reading my initial post

[chimera1715]

think "too" much....

...wow

anyway i never said i have an "omniscient perception of reality", but thanks for complimenting me. and yes, there is a problem with thinking too much (not to much). the problem is when you spend all day sitting around thinking, you're not doing anything. while you may not know anything about me, nor i you, i can assure you that i've done more in my life than most people twice my age. how many languages do you speak? how many countries have you lived in?

what made james joyce the great author that he was wasn't the things that he thought, it was the things that he did. would he have ever been such an amazing writer if he had stayed in ireland? while knowledge is indeed not dependant on age, it is not dependant on thought either. your line of thought is very alchemist indeed. take a more daoist approach to life and i assure you that you'll be much happier.

all i'm saying is you two sound like you have attained such knowledge when you've never left your "ireland". you say that you envy ignorant people.. i never said i was smarter than you, but you need to realise how ridiculous you sound. it's elitest, and i for one am not going to stand for it. i've met 14 year olds in italy more mature than you two. the fact that i'm even bothering with this is ludicrous. you talk about how you envy ignorance, yet i bet neither one of you would give up everything you had and go homeless for two years in parts of the world you've never been...something you're totally ignorant of...

in short, stop whining...you have no idea how good you have it.

and you're right to point out that this most certainly is rage. rage at two ungreatful teenage boys that have no idea how much better they have it than billions of people on the planet.

...and i love to see that no one bothered reading my initial post

Here, Here Nicanor! Nice to see that someone has a little perspective here.

[Ecclesiastes]

think "too" much....

...wow

That's what my firends used to say to me. You probably thought I think I think too much.
Nice too see you bothered reading my post.

anyway i never said i have an "omniscient perception of reality", but thanks for complimenting me. and yes, there is a problem with thinking too much (not to much).

Aw how mature of you, correcting my spelling errors. Who is feeling ellitist now?

the problem is when you spend all day sitting around thinking, you're not doing anything. while you may not know anything about me, nor i you, i can assure you that i've done more in my life than most people twice my age. how many languages do you speak? how many countries have you lived in?

As you said I'm only 17 and "need" to finish highschool first before I start traveling. And I don't sit around thinking all day. So are you saying the amount of languages a person speaks and the amount of countries they visited are connected to the intelligence of that person...? That is nonsence.

what made james joyce the great author that he was wasn't the things that he thought, it was the things that he did. would he have ever been such an amazing writer if he had stayed in ireland? while knowledge is indeed not dependant on age, it is not dependant on thought either.

James Augustine Aloysius Joyce was 22 when he went on his self-imposed exile... not a very strong point as we are both 17. I never said I was intelligent. All I am trying to say I see things differently then most people of my age I know.

all i'm saying is you two sound like you have attained such knowledge when you've never left your "ireland". you say that you envy ignorant people.. i never said i was smarter than you, but you need to realise how ridiculous you sound. it's elitest, and i for one am not going to stand for it. i've met 14 year olds in italy more mature than you two. the fact that i'm even bothering with this is ludicrous. you talk about how you envy ignorance, yet i bet neither one of you would give up everything you had and go homeless for two years in parts of the world you've never been...something you're totally ignorant of...

Perhaps we sound like that but I know of myself and have said that I do not have so much knowledge. You have met 14 year old boys and you think they are more mature then us and this is all compared at what we post on a forum while we do not know eachother so that statement is completely wrong as you do not know any of us and you are judging on our posts to see how we are like.

in short, stop whining...you have no idea how good you have it.

and you're right to point out that this most certainly is rage. rage at two ungreatful teenage boys that have no idea how much better they have it than billions of people on the planet.

...and i love to see that no one bothered reading my initial post

I never whined, I just said that I sometimes feel depressed to. This also is because I am currently "possesed" by Nihilism which isn't beautiful believe me. Believe me I know how good I have it. I try to think about my good position every day and be gratefull. Again you act like you know me. I know I have it good.

[Valus]

Err....Might I remind the members who are taking part in this discussion to keep it civil and avoid using personal attacks, that goes for all of you!

[Siblesz]

rez, perfectly put. I've sometimes been afraid that I was alone in thinking like I do, but I guess it's not a unique case, and my manner of reacting to it is as normal as any reaction can be. :original:

As for Nicanor of Sparta:

anyway i never said i have an "omniscient perception of reality", but thanks for complimenting me.

Glad to enlighten you on that term.

and yes, there is a problem with thinking too much (not to much). the problem is when you spend all day sitting around thinking, you're not doing anything. while you may not know anything about me, nor i you,

Then don't prejudge me. I have not prejudged your accomplishments, only your extent of thought on the reality that surrounds you.

i can assure you that i've done more in my life than most people twice my age.

I can assure you that I can make the same claim.

how many languages do you speak?

Fluent Spanish and English (spoken and written), some French, and soon to learn Mandarin.

how many countries have you lived in?

I've lived in 3 places... Caracas, Venezuela, Greenwich, Connecticut, and Boca Raton, Florida. I've visited countless places. I've gone to most U.S. States, I've visited Spain, Portugal, England, Holland, Germany, Austria, Switzerland, Belgium, the Czech Republic, Italy, France, China, Mexico, Peru, Colombia, Puerto Rico, Canada, the Dominican Republic, St. Martin, Martinique, Dominica, Aruba, Barbados, and the Bahamas. This August, I'm not going to college and instead taking a year off in the city of Yichang in China to teach English. I am very mature and experienced for my age, and I can make this claim with assertion.

what made james joyce the great author that he was wasn't the things that he thought, it was the things that he did.

What made Plato a great philosopher wasn't the things he did, but the things he thought. What's your point? Both ways have their benefits.

while knowledge is indeed not dependant on age, it is not dependant on thought either.

Knowledge and wisdom, in large part, are dependent on thought. You may have lived 150 years, but if your mind won't run, neither will your thought process.

your line of thought is very alchemist indeed. take a more daoist approach to life and i assure you that you'll be much happier.

Now you're telling me to take a 'Daoist approach'? Hehehe... we got a preacher in the house.

all i'm saying is you two sound like you have attained such knowledge when you've never left your "ireland".

I've left my "ireland" five years ago. I resigned my "ireland". I am nationless as a result. Have you ever been exiled from your home country? I don't think so. Don't suppose things of my life when you don't know anything about me. I had to resign my homeland, my family, my friends, and even my identity because of political and personal issues. The cause of the issues that I've had to endure in my short lifespan, you are not aware of. If you want me to continue explaining their origin and causes, then I'll gladly do so... but for now, you'll have to take my word for them.

you say that you envy ignorant people.. i never said i was smarter than you, but you need to realise how ridiculous you sound. it's elitest, and i for one am not going to stand for it. i've met 14 year olds in italy more mature than you two. the fact that i'm even bothering with this is ludicrous. you talk about how you envy ignorance, yet i bet neither one of you would give up everything you had and go homeless for two years in parts of the world you've never been...something you're totally ignorant of...

in short, stop whining...you have no idea how good you have it.

I'd gladly go homeless for two years. I actually want to do so sometime in the future. You know... as I've said before, happiness lies in simplicity. I have given serious consideration into joiining a hermitage or travelling the world for years, simply because it'll provide me with a peace of mind that none of my luxuries and commodities can even compete with. I would willingly and happily live a simple, yet happy life.

I have seen the world. I lived in a third world country for 12 years. I worked with charities in the slums of Caracas with my mother since I was five. I KNOW what poverty in this world is like. I've travelled a long way, I've gone through a lot of ****, and I've matured from surpassing countless obstacles. So has my mentality developed and matured. Again, don't suppose me naive when you don't know what I have gone through.

This is the problem with your argument. You're the elitist one. You're the one placing yourself on a stall and proclaiming yourself superior. I didn't need to show you my credentials or past history to prove to you that what I have said about existence has some actual substance and veracity to it. You, on the other hand, show off as a great experienced man, brushing aside even the thought of us being as experienced or more experienced than you are. You, my friend, are the elitist one.

and you're right to point out that this most certainly is rage. rage at two ungreatful teenage boys that have no idea how much better they have it than billions of people on the planet.

Ungrateful? Your perception of reality is distorted. I can bet you anything on this world that a starving Ethiopian man is more happy with his life than a middle age millionaire from New York City. And this proves that reality lies not in the physical world, but in the mental one. It all lies in the mind... IN THE MIND!

[Ecclesiastes]

I think that about covers that .

Now on with the thread. I would like to know from some of you guys (especially Siblesz) if your hunger for knowledge ever stopped. Do you ever feel so **** that you simply aren't up for anything...?