If I plan on upgrading the graphics card, do I need to upgrade the CPU as well?

[hitokiri2486]

For the tl;dr version, please read the bold sentences only!

So I've been thinking of replacing my nVidia GTX 260 either this summer or early fall, in order to better play games that take advantage of DirectX 11. I was told GTX 260 is technically DirectX 11 compatible, but honestly I got pretty poor performance in Civ 5 if I wasn't in DirectX 9, so I want a new card. In particular, I want good graphics quality when Battlefield 3 and Mass Effect 3 (I'm assuming the latter will use DirectX 11) come out...yes, I know, I'm talking about shooters and RPGs in a TW forum, but sometimes I need a break from all the strategy, y'know?

Right now, I'm thinking a GTX 560 or 570 would be good for me (I'm an nVidia man; had a bad experience with that other company); I don't want to spend more than $350 for a new card, but really I'm leaning mostly towards the 560 since the 570 doesn't seem to justify a $100 jump in price (but I'm a tech noob....).

However, since I only have a layman's knowledge about computers, I'm confused as to whether or not I should be thinking of upgrading my processor to take advantage of the new card. Some sites I visited seemed to suggest my processor would be holding back a new card like a GTX 560.

Does this make sense to anyone? I want to ask this question early that way I can plan ahead about replacing both the processor and graphics card if need be.

Here are my specs:
Intel i7-920 2.66 Ghz quad core
Nvidia GTX 260
9 GB DDR3
Intel X58 motherboard
Win7 64 bit

It's this computer, that I got off Newegg for about $900 in 2009, which I thought was about the same price I would have paid to build it myself:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16883113101

Other than the OS upgrade, I've added 2 TB of HD space, but otherwise haven't touched it. I know how to take the case off (haha), and I'm reasonably confident I can install a new processor/graphics card myself. If not, I have classmates who have built their own computers before that can help me, I think.

Advice would be greatly appreciated.

[ROFL Copter]

The i7 920 is one of the best CPUs in the world. You do not need to upgrade it at all. I would highly recommend ATI over Nvidia for many reasons, but if you do upgrade to a 570 it will run fine as long as your PSU can support it.

[Top-Tier-Tech]

I would highly recommend ATI over Nvidia for many reasons

None of which you can name.



@ OP, the GTX560 is probably the best choice out of the two, you are right the extra $100 for the GTX570 isn't justifiable it terms of price/performance. You do not need to upgrade any other part of your system to get the full benefits of either the 560 or 570.

[ROFL Copter]

None of which you can name.

I can name them, I just dont wanna....

[Top-Tier-Tech]

I can name them, I just dont wanna....

You can't name em' because your logic is faulty and I would destroy your reasoning and embarrass you

[mrcrusty]

You can't name em' because your logic is faulty and I would destroy your reasoning and embarrass you

Lol, fanboy.

What resolution will you be playing on?

HD 6xxx cards have a tendency to be better the larger the resolution in comparison to their GTX 5xx counterparts. This isn't just a result of the extra memory, it happens with the HD 6870/6850 cards too.

In all honestly though, the HD 6950 seems like the best choice. You can find something like the PowerColor PCS++ 6950 for less than $300, it's got great cooling, equal or better power consumption (with the GTX 560) and with a flick of a switch (on the physical card), it unlocks extra shaders giving you almost HD 6970 performance (on par with the GTX 570).

The GTX 560 is cheaper, yes, but it sits between the HD 6870 and the HD 6950. You'll be basically rocking a HD 6970, which is much better with a larger resolution.

If you're adamant with Nvidia, GTX 560 will easily handle Mass Effect 3. It is not very resource heavy, Battlefield 3 however, looks simply stunning which might mean it will be the next Crysis or Metro 2033 for graphics cards. I can only speculate on how it will run, but I can imagine a GTX 560 will struggle a little if everything is maxed out.

If you aren't hung up on graphical quality (playing on medium isn't a big deal for you), but more about playability, I'd recommend saving your money with a GTX 460.

[hitokiri2486]

I'm glad to hear my processor is fine; I did think it was a bit strange to replace it after only 2 years.

Another question then; I've seen a lot of posts in this forum and others about SLI and Crossfire. I'm not sure which one is the nVidia version, but if I did get a GTX 560 could I run it alongside my GTX 260 as well? Or does it have to be the same card?

I'm also assuming that the Intel X58 motherboard inside my computer is big enough too...which it is, right? Is there a way for me to check?

[Ishan]

CPU is fine no need to replace it you just need a new G.card.

Another question then; I've seen a lot of posts in this forum and others about SLI and Crossfire. I'm not sure which one is the nVidia version, but if I did get a GTX 560 could I run it alongside my GTX 260 as well? Or does it have to be the same card?

No it has to be 2 similar cards in Nvidia that is in SLI mode. In ATI that is Xfire mode one can use 2 diffrent cards but it has to be from the same family like HD5870+HD5850 G.cards.

I'm also assuming that the Intel X58 motherboard inside my computer is big enough too...which it is, right? Is there a way for me to check?

Big enough for what?

[hitokiri2486]

No it has to be 2 similar cards in Nvidia that is in SLI mode. In ATI that is Xfire mode one can use 2 diffrent cards but it has to be from the same family like HD5870+HD5850 G.cards.

What does "similar" mean? Like, in the same generation--so I could put a GTX 570 and 560 in SLI if I wanted to?

Shame I can't use my GTX 260 simultaneously and prolong its usefulness...

Big enough for what?

I'm assuming both cards need to be attached to the motherboard, and I wasn't sure if you needed a special motherboard for that...but if my GTX 260 won't work for SLI, it doesn't really matter.

[hitokiri2486]

That's true, Battlefield 3 may be the next Crysis for PC graphics...well, hopefully by the time it comes out prices on video cards will have dropped some more and make a GTX 570 more affordable. I don't think that game comes out until September, which is quite a while away.

I have a 750 W power supply, so I think that should be more than enough since the nVidia website has a minimum of like 500 W for the GTX 560, and I think 550 W for the GTX 570.

I know that ATI cards are more price efficient generally, but the last Windows computer I had with an ATI card liked to bug out when it came to games. Granted, that was like almost a decade ago now, but the experience was frustrating enough that I prefer nVidia, which I've never had a problem with so far.

[Top-Tier-Tech]

I bought a 4770 a year ago and proved first hand that Nvidia's drivers have more features. Also Nvidia's DX11 cards have more tesselation engines than any of AMD's similar cards. And then there is PhysX which is used on many popular titles.

[mrcrusty]

Tessellation performance goes to Nvidia, but I'm just not seeing the rest of your points.

Best thing about Nvidia's drivers was they had specialised profiles for every single application. It's the one thing I hate about AMD drivers, no specialised profiles. But aside from that, not much difference.

The whole "AMD/ATI drivers suck" really never made sense to me. I've rarely had issues with AMD/ATI drivers, no more so than Nvidia drivers, and my first ATI card was a 9600 Pro. It worked on the AGP expansion slot. So I've been using AMD/ATI for a while now.

As for PhysX, that's just lolworthy. Many popular titles... as is Mafia II and Batman: AA and.... well... that's it I guess.

Fanboy, why must you fanboy?

Get the card that best suits your needs and budget OP, forget brand loyalty and pickup the better product. If that is an Nvidia card, so be it. If it is an AMD card, so be it. Don't listen to people who will say x brand sucks, get y brand because it's y brand and not x brand.

[Top-Tier-Tech]

Also Nvidia's DX11 cards have more tesselation engines than any of AMD's similar cards.

Tessellation performance goes to Nvidia, but I'm just not seeing the rest of your points.

Point #1 made.

I bought a 4770 a year ago and proved first hand that Nvidia's drivers have more features.

Best thing about Nvidia's drivers was they had specialised profiles for every single application. It's the one thing I hate about AMD drivers, no specialised profiles.

Point #2 made

As for PhysX, that's just lolworthy. Many popular titles... as is Mafia II and Batman: AA and.... well... that's it I guess.

then there is PhysX which is used on many popular titles.

You can only think of two games...

Batman AA
Cryostasis
Mafia II
Metro 2033
Mirror's Edge
Unreal Tournament 3

Those are the most notable titles, Mirror's edge, Cryostasis, Mafia II, Metro 2033, and Batman AA, all have extremely noticeable improved graphics with PhysX on.

Fanboy, why must you fanboy?

I am no fanboy anymore, I just recommend the best product based on the users uses. The above 3 things I mentioned are only for Nvidia cards and the GTX460 / GTX560 also run cooler and quieter than AMD's cards so it's easy to recommend them when an appropriate budget is given.

When someone comes in with a $200 budget I recommend the 6870, a $300 budget and I recommend the 6950 unlocked. a $150 budget and I recommend the GTX460, $250 budget and I recommend the GTX560, $350 budget and I recommend the GTX570.

If the OP can't decide between AMD and Nvidia I recommend Nvidia because you get more tesselation engines for free, PhysX for free, and individual game profiles for free. I am always happy to say why I recommend Nvidia over AMD when asked unlike ROFL Copter.

If choosing the card with the most features, best thermals, and lowest noise, in the budget specified somehow makes me a fanboy then I fail to see your logic here. The OP in this thread stated he wanted either a GTX560 or GTX570 so I didn't even mention any AMD options like I normally would have since his budget was in a $100 + or - range.

[mrcrusty]

Bleh, the PhysX point still isn't a good one as Batman: AA and Mafia II are the only games where either PhysX is noticeable, or an Nvidia GPU is required for PhysX. Let's face it, PhysX is a big fat gimmick right now. PhysX wouldn't even come into my considerations when buying a new GPU. It's an added bonus at best, like a pre-overclocked GPU. It's nice, but only as a freebie, otherwise it loses value.

The point about the drivers, is literally one point in favour of Nvidia, it's not a "whole bunch of features", just one. And it's counteracted by the fact that the AMD driver suite allows you to under/overclock, change fan speed and stress test whereas there's nothing like that last I checked on Nvidia's side.

So I call it even.

I am no fanboy anymore, I just recommend the best product based on the users uses. The above 3 things I mentioned are only for Nvidia cards and the GTX460 / GTX560 also run cooler and quieter than AMD's cards so it's easy to recommend them when an appropriate budget is given.

AMD has saturated the market with non reference designs basically the same price as reference designs, so this point is moot.

When someone comes in with a $200 budget I recommend the 6870, a $300 budget and I recommend the 6950 unlocked. a $150 budget and I recommend the GTX460 HD 6850, $250 budget and I recommend the GTX560, $350 budget and I recommend the GTX570.

I can agree with that 100%. Which is the point I made in the very beginning. Get the best card based on purpose and price, not because you're loyal to a particular brand. I did recommend the PowerColor PCS++ 6950. $285 on newegg. Quiet and great performing cooler and unlocks the shaders at the flick of a switch, no need to BIOS edit. It's a switch on the card that switches from a HD 6950 BIOS to a pre made HD 6970 shaders + HD 6950 clocks BIOS with 100% success. It's a HD 6970 with a beastly cooler for less than $300. I stick with that recommendation.

[Top-Tier-Tech]

Bleh, the PhysX point still isn't a good one as Batman: AA and Mafia II are the only games where either PhysX is noticeable It's nice, but only as a freebie, otherwise it loses value.

Exactly, it's nice as a freebie or if you are into one of the PhysX titles then it is worth more. Mirror's Edge and Cryostasis are both changed dramatically by PhysX as well, it seems you are unfamiliar with PhysX gaming.

The point about the drivers, is literally one point in favour of Nvidia, it's not a "whole bunch of features", just one. And it's counteracted by the fact that the AMD driver suite allows you to under/overclock, change fan speed and stress test whereas there's nothing like that last I checked on Nvidia's side.

You said "whole bunch of features" in quotes yet you aren't quoting anyone in particular so what's up with that?

The gaming profiles save time and allow you to go from game to game easily without having to screw around manually switching out generic profiles all the time. And all major Nvidia card makers have free tools that allow you to overclock, underclok, stress test, monitor GPU useage, temps, and FPS in your monitor or keyboard's screen.

[Dewy]

Those are the most notable titles, Mirror's edge, Cryostasis, Mafia II, Metro 2033, and Batman AA, all have extremely noticeable improved graphics with PhysX on.

How does a physics engine--which is on regardless if you have a AMD or nVidia card--improve the graphics of a game? I suppose every game using fmod also has improved graphics?

P.S I'm being serious with my question. I'm curious about what you meant.

[Top-Tier-Tech]

How does a physics engine--which is on regardless if you have a AMD or nVidia card--improve the graphics of a game? I suppose every game using fmod also has improved graphics?

AMD users can have their CPU do some PhysX processing, but only Nvidia GPU's process PhysX which is not to be confused with generic physics. In the games I mentioned you can dedicate a GTS450 just to make the physX calculations and it will actually put it under heavy load. PhysX is simply a much more powerful physics engine than what is used in most games.

[Ishan]

Physx on Mafia 2 caused problems for Nvidia users whether it be low or extreme(for GTX 480 users).

[Top-Tier-Tech]

Physx on Mafia 2 caused problems for Nvidia users whether it be low or extreme(for GTX 480 users).

"The main purpose of this release appears to fix problems that are being reported in the recently released Mafia II demo where certain PhysX settings would cause the PhysX to run on the CPU and not the GPU causing performance problems."

I can't seem to find anything else on the subject...

[Ishan]

By the end of the year you will buy an ATI card and then about Nvidia cards that i know for sure lol.
About the driver thing ATI drivers never gave be problems, i update them every 2-3 months and every game runs ok for me.