Damn Stupid AI.

[wiande]

Alexander's engine was suppose to make ai a little more clever in diplomacy, apparently it's a lie, my allies attacking me one by one...

Damn i hate this game as much as i love it.

[chris10]

Alexander's engine was suppose to make ai a little more clever in diplomacy, apparently it's a lie, my allies attacking me one by one...

Damn i hate this game as much as i love it.

the campaign AI has more routines, true...but nobody said diplomacy was better...these are 2 different thngs and its long and widely accepted that RTW diplomacy is broken, same goes for M2TW to some extend (same code!) but as both things are hardcodd in the exe there is nothing to do about it

[Chris Death]

Alexander's engine was suppose to make ai a little more clever in diplomacy, apparently it's a lie, my allies attacking me one by one...

Damn i hate this game as much as i love it.

Was it really supposed to make the campaign ai more clever in diplomacy?

Never heard bout that one yet.

It makes the battlefield ai a tiny bit smarter and i think a phalanx bug got fixed but other
than that i've got yet to read about.

~S~ CD

[Drtad]

Well maybe you angered someone at their court.

Ancient alliances never lasted very long, tbh, someone had to lose out.

[Ferdiad]

Yes exactly, CA didn't bother coding a good AI because it was historically correct the way it is now.

[Silius Saurus]

When I play as the Romans the Greeks and Spartans ALWAYS backstab.

Never trust a Greek.

[Trajan]

When I play as the Romans the Greeks and Spartans ALWAYS backstab.

Never trust a Greek.

Yeah, the Greeks betrayed me as well. I don't know if it's a bug but I can't get a peace treaty done with them. They keep saying that they have nothing to offer in return. Oh well, I was going to conquer them anyways.

[chris10]

I don't know if it's a bug but I can't get a peace treaty done with them.

Even if you use force diplomacy to make peace they will probably attack again next turn if you not have an overwhelming force stationed close to the border where they can see it...
No bug...Its all layed in the hardcoded exe....If you appear weak within their line of sight they attack...

[Heinz Guderian]

Even if you use force diplomacy to make peace they will probably attack again next turn if you not have an overwhelming force stationed close to the border where they can see it...
No bug...Its all layed in the hardcoded exe....If you appear weak within their line of sight they attack...

srsly? I've never heard of this before.

[Ferdiad]

How could you not know that, RTW AI backstabs if it thinks it has as slim chance of winning, never mind the fact that you have the biggest army on earth and outnumber them 1000/.000001.

[chris10]

How could you not know that, RTW AI backstabs if it thinks it has as slim chance of winning, never mind the fact that you have the biggest army on earth and outnumber them 1000/.000001.

Its only about what is in the field of vision and range of the AI not about the overall force or strength.
Winning evaluatiios/routines are only calculated locally and not in relation of the overall army size...
If the AI calculates a chance of winning in a Province it will attack no matter what, despite the fact that in 1 or 2 turns you show up with 5 full stacks to raze everybody and everything to the ground...

If you toggle fow AI behaviour changes too as it now can see whats up and goes earlier for weak points/factions hence superfactions form more quickly.

3rd Factor is the randomly loaded AI (agressive/defense/passive) on each reload...

Well, i m still following the eb/2 forum and modders said ALX engine was making AI more clever in battle, and they also said that AI was less likely to stop an alliance to turn on you, but i've verified it by playing EB with ALX, and that's complete BS, AI is lame whatever you try to, Rome engine is ed up (maybe MTW2 too, didn't play much of it so i've actualy no clue).

What's so terrible is that, even if you don't want to blitz and try to be peaceful, AI attack you, thinking it's a good idea at the moment. Then you crushed them and turn your stacks at enemies and take over their cities.

things are as they are...accept it...besides: The Rome engine is certainly not screwed...if you think so then you might be better playing something else. Rome was a milestone in game history and still offers a lot of fun if you know how to handel the engine.

[wiande]

Well, i m still following the eb/2 forum and modders said ALX engine was making AI more clever in battle, and they also said that AI was less likely to stop an alliance to turn on you, but i've verified it by playing EB with ALX, and that's complete BS, AI is lame whatever you try to, Rome engine is ed up (maybe MTW2 too, didn't play much of it so i've actualy no clue).

What's so terrible is that, even if you don't want to blitz and try to be peaceful, AI attack you, thinking it's a good idea at the moment. Then you crushed them and turn your stacks at enemies and take over their cities.

Got this as Pergamon, with greeks attacking me with a stack of 4/6 units ... (good idea)

[wiande]

I played a lot of games like europa universalis 2, victoria, civilization, none is perfect, but it's frustrating even more with a game like RTW that offers a lot.
Like i always said, TW games are crappy unless modded, but even modders can't make it perfect, you can only make it better, which is a very good thing cause playing RTW vanilla has no meaning in itself.

[chris10]

I played a lot of games like europa universalis 2, victoria, civilization, none is perfect, but it's frustrating even more with a game like RTW that offers a lot.
Like i always said, TW games are crappy unless modded, but even modders can't make it perfect, you can only make it better, which is a very good thing cause playing RTW vanilla has no meaning in itself.

I repeat myself: Rome was a revelation when it was released and without some genius programmers making these crappy games there is nothing to mod...obviously you ignoring this fact...

[wiande]

genius ? lol

Why a revelation why not MTW or STW ?
Ever play cossack ? or an old game called genghis khan ? Cause everything TW games made is based on genghis khan ... They just adapted it with "modern" technology.

[chris10]

genius ? lol
Why a revelation why not MTW or STW ?
Ever play cossack ? or an old game called genghis khan ? Cause everything TW games made is based on genghis khan ... They just adapted it with "modern" technology.

Very simple...cause Rome was the first game featuring real 3d enviroments/models on massive battles while STW/MTW used 2d sprites...the Rome engine could feature up to 30.000 men on the field at the same time (If you had the right rig) and was lightyears away from the competition...as well the battle AI was a lot smarter than of previous titles..it got an average ranking of 92% in about 70 reviews ...all in all it was a revelation in the game industry and got more awards than you dont know what. If you would be all so informed you would know that. And yes, the programmers who made Rome where freakin genius and the success of the game prooves them right (still selling 7 years after its release and recently officially ported to Mac) so your point of "crappy" is probably the most ignorant rant I ever heard about this game.
All your other examples are useless...I own and have played to death all Cossacks and it has really nothing to do with Rome...no even the same genre...and Genghis Khan was a hexagonal turn based strategy game to be compared with Civ I and II and all the other hexagon games. I really fail where the point of comparison would be...only you will know...
sighhh....realizing that you lack real arguments I think there is nothing more to add to this topic...

EU2 is an old game as well and makes it still better as AI choices over diplomacy than every TW games, so i guess it isn't that difficult to include a good AI/diplomacy in a game like that.

..that made my morning...comparing Paradox Grand Strategy mechanics with Turn Based Strategy/Real Time Tactic is ridicolous...good laugh...thnx a bunch

[Chris Death]

genius ? lol

Why a revelation why not MTW or STW ?
Ever play cossack ? or an old game called genghis khan ? Cause everything TW games made is based on genghis khan ... They just adapted it with "modern" technology.

gratz enjoy ur self,

did i said cossacks has been made before STW ? So, learn to read before getting all sensitive. If you ever played genghis khan you would know it's the same mechanics that first TW games did have, never played Kaiser, but if you start it up that way, let's talk about Risk (1959) ?
Eh ? Cause it was all your point, being right. Stop being childish please.

hmm ok i see now but i can try to read over and over again and still the last sentence of the
first post in quotation screws it definitely up.

Or maybe it's my lack of english then - if so sorry for that.

btw - you know i would have posted risk too but i found it to be ridiculous because then
the next one comes with chess and the next one with go and so on.

It was just your assumption about what TW is based on and so i had to tell you that. It's a
fact that it's based on shogun or let's say a pc conversion of shogun.

However thx for reminding me an all those old games which went thru my head last night after
posting about those few.

~S~ CD

[mostquito]

If you ever have the time, try the game called Sword of the Samurai.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sword_of_the_Samurai_(computer_game)

It is the only true precedessor of Shogun: Total war.
It has a family tree, turn based strategy and real time tactical battles with samurais, horsemen, archers and muskets (controlled by numeric keyboard), and even more (emerging from a lowranked samurai, to the top of the the shogunate; through alliances and betrayal, courting, kidnapping, villager rescuing, sword duels (programmed by Sid Meier!) and much more.

A really epic game maybe a little bit behind Pirates!, but not much. In the Shogun 2 maybe half of the options that can be found in SotS will be available. Of course with much better sound and graphic (and slightly better AI), but using about 20.000 more storage capacity...

And at the higher levels it is quirte hard too.
If you hurry, maybe you can finish a hard game, till Shogun 2 comes out.

[Chris Death]

If you meant Cossacks from GSC than you failed.

Cossacks European wars was released in November 2000 while Shogun total war has been release in June 2000.

And with genghis khan which has been released in 1989 your leaning far out the window a bit now cause then
i could also come up with Kaiser for the C64 which has been released in 1984 (been playing it been loving it that time).

However the whole total war series is definitely based on Shogun Total War - a conversion of the board game
Shogun which has been released in 1986 - so you failed on that one with genghis khan aswell.

Better do your homework next time before posting stuff like that.

~S~ CD

[wiande]

If you meant Cossacks from GSC than you failed.

Cossacks European wars was released in November 2000 while Shogun total war has been release in June 2000.

And with genghis khan which has been released in 1989 your leaning far out the window a bit now cause then
i could also come up with Kaiser for the C64 which has been released in 1984 (been playing it been loving it that time).

However the whole total war series is definitely based on Shogun Total War - a conversion of the board game
Shogun which has been released in 1986 - so you failed on that one with genghis khan aswell.

Better do your homework next time before posting stuff like that.

~S~ CD

gratz enjoy ur self,

did i said cossacks has been made before STW ? So, learn to read before getting all sensitive. If you ever played genghis khan you would know it's the same mechanics that first TW games did have, never played Kaiser, but if you start it up that way, let's talk about Risk (1959) ?
Eh ? Cause it was all your point, being right. Stop being childish please.

Now try to play europa universalis 2, and realize there's been only little improvements in diplomacy and AI from STW to ETW.

EU2 is an old game as well and makes it still better as AI choices over diplomacy than every TW games, so i guess it isn't that difficult to include a good AI/diplomacy in a game like that.

That was all my point before you guys started to enjoy yourselves all over.

@Nerzu: Why BI ? Is that something special bout it ?