Harder playing Ismalic factions than Catholics?

[DDemperor]

I've just realized something.
It's alot harder to play islamic factions than catholics. not because of the crusades and such but because of the economy?
I always get 20+k after turn 20 or less with catholics but with Islamic am usually down by 1K by 10 turns?
Is it because of limited location of ports? or is it something else?

[kasrkin]

Possibly poor economic management?
Lack of trust from catholic nations and therefore lack of trade?
Maybe its the nation your playing with.
The Egyptions certainly should be able to mantain a very strong economic foothold, however their progress is usually hampered by crusades very early in game.
The Moors and Turks I don't have as much experience, but I believe there are a lot of good and valuble trade resourses relatively close to the Moorish homeland, e.g the Ivory near Timbuktu.
If you're struggling with the economy as the Egyptians or Turks it might be an intelligent decision to simply leave the crusade targets if you don't feel that losing out on the trade with the Europeans is worth it.

I also believe theres Ivory and Slaves close to some Egyptian territory. (Correct me if I'm wrong though)

[Alexandru]

I dont think religion actually takes a toll in economics (even if the catolic church historically did). You probably have too many soldiers or undeveloped settlements (to low on population for high taxes, TRADE!!!). Speaking of which, it could be a trading problem. Depending on your starting position, if you are landlocked, you may not have so many neighbours(other factions or own settlements) to trade with, via sea routes, as fellow christians of the west do. And the moors, they got a lot, if not, all starting settlements with sea access, and they're islamic too. From what i remember, sea trade is much more worthy than land trade.
What faction are you actually playing with? Cause if you play with the turks or egypt and have only enemies and rebel settlements around you, then that's what makes it harder for the islamic faction, Trade!

[Double A]

What? M2 is hard?

[tudor93]

What? M2 is hard?

for a begginer ? yep, pretty much
uhm, Egypt has a great economy and the Moors too, just get timbuktu and the Iberian Peninsula and you swim in gold

[Double A]

for a begginer ? yep, pretty much
uhm, Egypt has a great economy and the Moors too, just get timbuktu and the Iberian Peninsula and you swim in gold

Weird, I didn't have any trouble on my first campaign. I doubt the beginners are playing VH/VH.

I guess it's because I played Rome for so long.

[The Source]

depends on mod, diffuculty

[Timur_the_Lame]

I find that financially they are easy too, just that you are at war more so you make more armies and lose money supporting those

[RO Citizen]

The Egyptians are one of the easiest factions, IMO. And they're great to play.

Also, the Moors have a good economy if you know how to manage them.

The Turks, well, you must base on continuous military expansion to survive.

[Basil II the B.S]

Hmm, they have some difficulties related to their geographic locations, and Crusades that kill trade agreements, that's all.
Egypt and Turks should rush early on the dozens of rebel settlements, make Adana a city and it'll generally boost your economy along with Antioch. The biggest issue is probably the Mongol invasion early on, you'll waste time and resources repelling them, and maybe get some important city plundered. Unexperienced players may found their economies destroyed by the conflict.
Moors don't get to fight Mongols, but on harder difficulties, they'll have to face the annoying AI landing randomly near Algeri,Tunez, wherever in Spain, and the islands will make you cry. If you capture Palermo quickly though, it never gets attacked and will make Sicily much weaker.

[Fireright]

Economics-wise its probably easier for the Catholic factions to get the florins rolling in fairly early as they're all 'clumped together' on the campaign map so its easier for trade rights, roads, ports, etc. Overall I reckon an Islamic campaign can be tougher than a Catholic campaign.

[shikaka]

In vanilla, Egypt is super-easy. They own the Nile delta, and can conquer the wealthy Levant, and from there, you are rolling dough.

Moors have acces to the resource rich region of TImbuktu-Arguín, plus if they unify Iberia (should be possible in 15-20 turns) that is easy.


What I can think of is that the Turks might face a problem IF they don't expand from mountainous Anatolia, but as Turks, the first thing should be a Jihad on Constantinopole or Baghdad anyway.

[Playeraka]

What are Ismalic factions???

[Fireright]

An Islamic campaign is also a tad tougher on the religious conversion aspect because they only have one religious agent, the Imam, whereas Catholic factions have several levels of religious agents to aid speeding up conversions and clobbering heretics and all that.

Med1 had 2 Islamic levels..the Imam and the Grand/Master Imam...I wonder why he bit the dust in Med2? Would've balanced things out nicely with all the Catholic agents in Med2.

[Avatar]

To be fair, all the catholic religious agents are just upgraded piety versions of the same thing. Imams will end up just as effective with the correct buildings, not to mention that they dont have to ask permission from anyone to launch a Jihad.

[tudor93]

To be fair, all the catholic religious agents are just upgraded piety versions of the same thing. Imams will end up just as effective with the correct buildings, not to mention that they dont have to ask permission from anyone to launch a Jihad.

uhm ... I think a 10 piety bishop/cardinal is better then a 10 piety priest

[Avatar]

uhm ... I think a 10 piety bishop/cardinal is better then a 10 piety priest

Outside of being elected pope, what can a 10 piety bishop or cardinal do that a 10 piety priest cant? This is not to mention that a 10 Piety priest is almost certainly going to be a cardinal in the first place.

Back onto the islamic factions, the other slight annoyance they would have is that those juicy trade locations like Antioch are less great when they are on your own doorstep. It requires a slightly different approach to trade building.

[Alexandru]

Outside of being elected pope, what can a 10 piety bishop or cardinal do that a 10 piety priest cant?.

A priest/bishop can go heretic, a cardinal wont

[PrestigeX]

I tend to think it's a lot easier, you NEVER have the pope nagging you to stop fighting another faction. You get to decide your own jihads , all you have to do is train imams and build mosques, and you've guaranteed the ability to declare holy war - where as a christian, you might not have the papal favor to request from the pope , there are a lot more factions who may join in...etc.
If you're the moors - egypt/turks are too far away.. if you're turk/egypt , you'll likely finish off the other soon and then moors (too far away).

the benefit of jihad is more so economic -getiing a bunch of big armies free upkeep? than to get amazing units, altho ghazis are rather handy.

Egypt atleast, has a very significant economic advantage... they can tech up fast and rake in lots of money- the downside, is you will get crusaders and mongols to fight, but it is a preferrable challenge to being france or milan, being dictated to by the pope that excommunication looms whilst the very same faction you can't fight is sieging your capital !!!!

[Rougeman]

but that preist will probably become a cardinal when one dies, and IIRC the more piety=more chance of NOT being heretic and getting killed by inquisitors