Holding the Line

[TRSjarmen]

Ok here is two questions...

1. How do you hold your line? what units, tactics, etc? This is of course if you like to form your army in some kind of line.

2. How do you hold your lines against Romans? They have such good morale and troops, they just push right through my lines. I can make my lines hold, but only with very heavy infantry and even then only by a thread. The lines always ends up colapsing unless i bring in cavalry or other troops on the Roman rear.

Note: I am playing RTR 6.3, but i also want this to be a question for any version of the game and all the different tactics that can be used.

[Slimshoom]

have more men than them, always have a reserve, pu ur men in more than one line, have cavalry to flank and also use lighter troops to flank, make sure u have missile troops firing at them before then lines engage to weaken them, thats all i can think of right now

[Marcus Scaurus]

Fighting superior infantry, I rely on (mercenary) phalanx to hold the line, with strong infantry as a second line. They are the anvil, my cavalry and light infantry are the hammer.

[Valerius Maximus]

the best units to hold a line are probably hoplites, against every opponent incl romans. A decent hoplite unit should give you enough time to move your cav or swordsmen in a position where they can attack the enemy from behind or flank them...if you're playing with gauls or germans it's a lot harder to hold a line against legionnaires, never really played as gauls so i might be wrong here

[Slimshoom]

yea i forgot to mention the amazing unit that is phalanxes

[Valerius Maximus]

3 posts in a matter of minutes...nice

[Darth Wong]

You need some kind of heavy infantry or phalanx unit to be your anchor. And if you are outnumbered, do not spread your line out thinly in order to match the width of the enemy battle line. Instead, keep it narrow so you have some depth, and refuse the flanks. Then you have to hope you can bring something around to hit the enemy's rear before your line folds.

[guyyug]

the only way to hold a line against romans is to flank them really as everyone says. only a phalanx can have any hope of dukin it on against romans.

[removeduser_426582376423734]

It all really depends on cavalry units and flanking procedures. I took Julius' Caesar's tactics and placed infantry behind my cavalry units. If the enemy has more cavalry that you, do this! Make sure they hold, i.e. place your General close by. The enemy, if properly numbered in ratio infantry:cavalry, will lose their flanking advantage and you will gain it.

[TRSjarmen]

Ahhh, thanks, i do most of these things, i always make sure to bring lots of extra cavalry when going up against the Romans. In my Greek camp. the phalanxes held alright, but still got pushed into, now im in the middle of a Numidian campaign, i have already started off battle with Rome in Gaul and have won some big victories, but they always inflict so many casualties on my lines while my cavalry is coming around, guess time to hire up some more merc phalanxes

Ok so i'm not doing anything too wrong, normally with whatever faction i am i use my best infantry to hold the line with more massed on the flanks, while my cav. comes around and also sometimes, as said above, i hold a second line in reserve.

~thanks, now lets keeps this party rollin'

[Darth Wong]

Here's another tip: if you want to take some risks, swing your cavalry out early (ie- well before the enemy makes contact with your battle line), and send your general with them. The enemy will usually split his army in two because of the size and threat posed by your cavalry movement, so that only half his army will actually crash into your battle line while the other half chases after your cavalry. Use your cavalry to draw the second half of his army away, then sweep around them by using your superior speed, and hit the first half of the enemy army from behind while it is engaged with your battle line. With luck they'll be routed before the second half of his army can catch up. Then split your cavalry and infantry again, and hit the remaining half of his army from two sides.

[John I Tzimisces]

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=39743

I would refer to this thread for good formations for most factions. Some visuals (although by means of text and whatnot in most cases), but otherwise quite helpful, and always conveniently located at the top of this forum.

[Tacticalwithdrawal]

ok, from the other side I've just done a battle walkthrough using Romans agains greeks, shows how to hold the line using SPQR's roman shieldwalls. Non-SPQR doesn't have the advantage of a shieldwall but the basic tactics still hold true.

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=41708

Next one I'm gonna do is Greeks vs. Romans so I'll let you know when it's done (particularly since it will be SPQR romans who are real b*stards with that shieldwall).

Then it's gonna be Romae (SPQR) vs Carthage & it's ellies (double gold chevron experience in SPQR, the pain, the pain).

If anyone wants to 'order' a walkthrough tell me what you'd like and I'll see what I can do.

[John I Tzimisces]

Of course, keeping CLOSE attention to the cavalry, and trying not to engage enemy cavalry while you're at it. Doing so can pin them down and sets them up to be butchered by pursuing infantry or cavalry.

[Darth Wong]

Of course, keeping CLOSE attention to the cavalry, and trying not to engage enemy cavalry while you're at it. Doing so can pin them down and sets them up to be butchered by pursuing infantry or cavalry.

Yeah, I forgot to mention that this is a dicey maneuver, and you only do it because you're badly outmanned and would lose without some kind of "trick". Your cavalry is quite vulnerable out there unless the enemy has a cavalry-poor army.

[John I Tzimisces]

It is also exacerbated by the fact that infantry in pursuit tend to act like cavalry once they catch up with their target. Particularly nasty if the pursuing infantry are spearmen.

If you feel like playing it risky, you can always try to assault their general...since often his unit hangs back. I would only recommend this if the general's unit is small and he is an easy target. Charge from his left (your right). It puts the enemy general thick in your formation. If that general has sickness traits or the equivalent HP lowering traits it is entirely possible he will be killed instantly.

[GambleFish]

I find the best way to hold a line with inexperienced / not-so-decent light infantry (e.g. barbarian mercenaries) is to have them packed in dense formations supported by heavy cavalry / generals. Even though flanking hits do a lot of damage, often your crap infantry will route before you have time to flank! I find the combo of a light infantry unit (barbarian infantry being the prime example with 240 men) sucking up a charge and then having heavy cav (ideally a bodygaurd) supporting supporting them unstoppable. This usually only works in small (i.e. half-stack) armies, as you usually run outta cavalry. The point is that you almost double the effectiveness of you heavy cavalry, as the infantry do jack but they do suck up both the charge / pila volley and then will be targeted by enemy attacks instead of your horse. The horse's attack power is magnified by at least 2 or three times - I use this tactic with a few generals cav and barb mercenaries or illyrian skirmishers against praetorian or even urban cohorts! I always end up punching through their lines and eventually destroying them.

Of course you need a bunch of generals (3 or 4) in an army, or some half-decent cavalry. If I seperate the cavalry and infantry, the infantry are overun before the cavalry even approaches a flanking hit.

[Marie Louise von Preussen]

Hoplites and phalanx units are the best ones against Rome. Once I could hold an entire line of greek hoplites against an early roman legion, and I only had a single unit of greek cavalry to outflank them. Absolutely nothing, except for another phalanx unit, can kill a phalanx in the front. The exception are those militia hoplites: you just have to put a concentrated pilum fire on them and they will rout. Also, velites can be effective against a phalanx, so use your greek cavalry to rout or kill them before the main Roman line joins battle (If you're playing as the Greek cities).

[viper1980]

Battling roman legion with every hellenistic faction is quite easy.
1. Certainly you must have archers - cretans are best! - to deal with velites and may be roman cavalry. Place your archers directly after the phalanx in spread and thin line. Turn skirmish mode and fire at will off. You must PERSONALLY select targets for your archers to win battle.
2. Of course phalanx must be in center. All units in special phalanx formation (without spacing between units!). Don't forget to enable guard mode. It'll help you to hold the phalanx formation.
3. Cover flanks with good sword infantry. My favourites are thracian infantry (they are awesome and fire javelines too!), bastarnae or even merc gallic swordsman (not so good).
4.And of course your blitzkrieg weapon - any sort of elite cavalry: hetairoi, thracian heavy etc. Remember: roman cav is weak especially with AI, so you MUST defeat it easily. Then raid around enemy line. I usually use all heavy cavalry at one flank to smash one side of enemy line. Than sword inf from this flank move to enemy rear and strike enemy line together with cavalry. Anyway the proper use of cavalry (rule it PERSONALLY) is abs necessary if you want to win.
By the way, I'am playing RTR 6.3 as author of the first topic.

[Deus ex Machina]

Phalaxes. Tightly knit phalaxes. With a very good general nearby.

The worst is a Barbarian - they tend to collapse under the mighty heel of Rome quicker than anything else.