Citizenship categorization...is it time for a change?

[Nanny de Bodemloze]

In reading this thread, I was once more reminded of the confusion that exists regarding the categories of citizenship here at TWC. People are granted citizenship, then choose to self-identify a 'sub' category (Artifex or Civitate) if they wish...or they can keep Citizen.

Here are the definitions as found in the TWC wiki...

from the wiki...

CITIZEN: If a member of the forum does not wish to choose between being recognized as having strongest ties to either the Common Community or Total War parts of the forum, he may choose to simply wear the neutral "Citizen" badge...

CIVITATE: Originally the rank of Civitate was the honoured rank bestowed on forum members for both excellent Common Community and Total War contributions to the forums, with the distinction between Civitate and Artifex arriving some time in 2006. The rank of Civitate was instituted within the first version of the Syntagma.

ARTIFEX: The rank of Artifex was developed mid 2006 primarily as an attempt to further recognise the work of those members of the forum who contribute primarily to the Total War side of the forums - for example those who work as members of hosted modifications or write tutorials for use on the forums.

Here is the wording in the TWC contitution...

constitution def'n

Citizens
Contributing members of TWC have the opportunity to become a Citizen of the Forum as per Article 2 below. Once a member becomes a Citizen, they can then choose between 3 different badges. Artifex, designed for those who are modders, Civitate, designed for those who have contributed to the debating side of the Site, whether in TW or non-TW, and Citizen, for those who associate with both.

I have seen many threads where there are a wide variety of interpretations of these titles, and opinions vary on how loosely these should be interpreted.

Personally, I find that the current 3 badge option to not be reflective of who the citizens are around here, and how they actually identify themselves. Here are some of the ways in which I've seen citizens label their contributions and presence (this is not a complete list, just an sampling):

- artist
- modder
- debator
- creative writer
- content writer
- modeler
- teacher
- historical researcher/analyst
- political debator
- RPGer
- 2D artist
- machinamist
- etc
- etc....

Of course, it is unnecessary to create a badge for every single type of contribution. And frankly, most citizens contribute in multiple ways. But I find the current 3 badges a little awkward, and they lend themselves to misunderstanding.

I'm asking here...is it worth updating our citizenship badge setup?

Here are the options as I see it.

1) status quo
2) have 1 badge only (citizen)
3) redefine the categories

A one badge only system takes away all confusion for sure. However, I think most people enjoy some distinction, and enjoy identifying themselves with more detail than that. To redefine the categories, we would have to make sure we are catching everyone somewhere, but not making so many as to be unmanageable.

Personally, what I like about the current system is that people apply for citizenship, then identify themselves however they want without having to prove or explain themselves...this keeps the citizenship process easier, and allows citizens the freedom to identify however they wish to be seen. I'm not proposing here that this system change...just the badge options is all.

Also, personally, I find that writers and artists who reside in the TW game sections are the most awkwardly identified, if sticking to the definitions found in the Constitution. Many choose artifex, but they are not all modders. I'd be curious if there are other large skill sets that are recognized as citizenship-worthy that don't really fit into the current categories.

Anybody have any other thoughts on this? Is this worth exploring further? It isn't exactly a barn burning issue I realize, but perhaps if we tighten up the categories a bit some confusion (or in some cases some needless heated arguments) may be averted.

Cheers everyone, thanks for your time

[Viking Prince]

No discussion will move forward if the premise is to remove the

Which means the one badge option is a nonstarter.

The two badges other than citizen include the majority of members rising in rank. The other paths are there, but if you are active in Content, why would you even want the Citizen level badge showing rather than the staff badge? There will always be some niche contributors that do not fit with the current scheme that want to proclaim they are a citizen because of their contributions in _____. That is still an option in the signature, profile pic, among other options.

I would be open to suggestions, but not too many badges. If you were to add one badge, wat would it be?

I now await the expected "We don't need those stinking badges." pics and comments.

[Nanny de Bodemloze]

No discussion will move forward if the premise is to remove the

Which means the one badge option is a nonstarter.

The two badges other than citizen include the majority of members rising in rank. The other paths are there, but if you are active in Content, why would you even want the Citizen level badge showing rather than the staff badge? There will always be some niche contributors that do not fit with the current scheme that want to proclaim they are a citizen because of their contributions in _____. That is still an option in the signature, profile pic, among other options.

I would be open to suggestions, but not too many badges. If you were to add one badge, wat would it be?

I now await the expected "We don't need those stinking badges." pics and comments.

I like traditions, even if they seem wonky to some. If I had the pen on this, I like to keep what we have, and then add "Artisan" as other option (or something like that).

[Viking Prince]

What would 'artisan' include that is not covered by 'artifex'? I am assuming a much broader group for 'artifex' than just the members particpating in a mod release. Even then you have the banners, trailers, video announcments, etc.

As an aside: I always wondered about this as well when I was writing the strategy guides before I joined a staff position in the Scriptorium. Those contributions are clearly not debate. I have always had a staff badge though shortly after starting membership. When I rose in rank to citizen, nothing really changed. And then the Moderator badge even made that moot since I then had no options. Today, if I was to not be in staff, I would just sport the Citizen with pride.

[Antwerpen]

The main advantage of the current system is that one can switch his badges at any desirable time. If a Citizen has the right to switch the badge, then he will do so accordingly to his personal opinion on to which part of the forum he has contributed more.

What I am trying to say is that we have free choice: I never specified which badge do I apply for in my application, and now I wear the neutral Citizen badge. But I can change it to Artifex right now, and even though I have never participated in any modding activity, I will still be technically eligible to wear it. So with the current system, you are free to display whatever badge you want: e.g. you can get patronized for debates and wear a Civitate badge but then you suddenly get interested in modding and your modding contributions overweight your debates, then you switch to Artifex.

[Nanny de Bodemloze]

The main advantage of the current system is that one can switch his badges at any desirable time. If a Citizen has the right to switch the badge, then he will do so accordingly to his personal opinion on to which part of the forum he has contributed more.

What I am trying to say is that we have free choice: I never specified which badge do I apply for in my application, and now I wear the neutral Citizen badge. But I can change it to Artifex right now, and even though I have never participated in any modding activity, I will still be technically eligible to wear it. So with the current system, you are free to display whatever badge you want: e.g. you can get patronized for debates and wear a Civitate badge but then you suddenly get interested in modding and your modding contributions overweight your debates, then you switch to Artifex.

I agree...in the OP, I stated that the free-choice system is good and not part of what I'm proposing...just maybe re-looking at the badge choices is all

[The Hedge Knight]

I think the badges could do with clarification but not complete reform.

Personly i would say artisian is perhaps a good idea i would see it as such (as contributions from listed forum)

Citzen
-All discusion and debate forums
-Personal help and advice
-Universitus ludus olympicus
-Q&S
-Content

Civitate (most 'general')
-Tw forums (non modding, e.g guides)
-Minor mod work
-All above citizen

Artifex
- primarily mod work (major overhauls, extensive other work).
-All other forums to a lesser extent.

Artisian
-Content
-Artist Studio (video making, gallerys, tutorials etc)
-All citizen boards

[M D]

I personally see Civitate as any contributions to the Community other than D&D Stuff, so like Content etc

[Viking Prince]

I personally see Civitate as any contributions to the Community other than D&D Stuff, so like Content etc

But what about the TW related stuff that is not modding such as AARs, strategy guides, etc.? The system is pretty much making special badges for modding and debate in addition to citizen. At least that is the perception. No matter how broad the interpretation of modding and debate is, there will be gaps.

[.Mitch.]

I'v always seen it as..

Tangable site assets = Artifex
Posting = Civitate
Half and Half = Citizen

I'd think a simple rewording of the descriptions would be more appropriate. If it's less confusion you want, surely an extra badge type is not the right way to go.

[LuckyLewis]

To be honest, I put myself as Citizen as I wasn't entirely sure which category I would fit into.

[DAVIDE]

how can i display the neutral badge?

[M D]

Go to User control panel

Group Memberships

Then scroll down and click Citizen (Identify me as this group) then click save

[DAVIDE]

Go to User control panel

Group Memberships

Then scroll down and click Citizen (Identify me as this group) then click save

mm i just have:

Local Moderators
Artifex
Phalera

[M D]

Go to the top of that Group Membership page and apply for the Citizen group then, Meg will accept

[DAVIDE]

ok thanks

[Antwerpen]

Oh, by the way, relevant to Davide's question: I have seen some members being present in only one of the Citizenship usergroups. I don't know why is that, when I passed the vote Meg told me to apply for all 3 groups (Citizen, Artifex, Civitate).

I would advise all Citizens who haven't done it yet to apply for the remaining groups in case you wish to switch badges.

P.S. Hope I don't give Meg a hell of a lot work with giving out such advice.

[Darth Red]

^ I would argue with that a little bit actually. When my citizenship application passed Nikos, being the curator at the time, said I could apply to both Civitate and Citizen but could not apply (or more accurately would be denyed) Artifex considering that I didn't contribute to the TW side of the site. So not everyone should have access to all of the badges if they didn't contribute to the appropriate forums.

[Antwerpen]

^ I would argue with that a little bit actually. When my citizenship application passed Nikos, being the curator at the time, said I could apply to both Civitate and Citizen but could not apply (or more accurately would be denyed) Artifex considering that I didn't contribute to the TW side of the site. So not everyone should have access to all of the badges if they didn't contribute to the appropriate forums.

I strongly disagree. Citizenship is one usergroup, and Artifex, Civitate and Citizen are merely subgroups. I think if one qualifies for Citizenship, he must be able to choose whatever badge he wants.

Otherwise, we would have to elect Consilium de Citizen and Consilium de Artifex as well.

[Viking Prince]

^ I would argue with that a little bit actually. When my citizenship application passed Nikos, being the curator at the time, said I could apply to both Civitate and Citizen but could not apply (or more accurately would be denyed) Artifex considering that I didn't contribute to the TW side of the site. So not everyone should have access to all of the badges if they didn't contribute to the appropriate forums.

I strongly disagree. Citizenship is one usergroup, and Artifex, Civitate and Citizen are merely subgroups. I think if one qualifies for Citizenship, he must be able to choose whatever badge he wants.

Otherwise, we would have to elect Consilium de Citizen and Consilium de Artifex as well.

Go to the Constitution Section III Article I

Contributing members of TWC have the opportunity to become a Citizen of the Forum as per Article 2 below. Once a member becomes a Citizen, they can then choose between 3 different badges. Artifex, designed for those who are modders, Civitate, designed for those who have contributed to the debating side of the Site, whether in TW or non-TW, and Citizen, for those who associate with both.

To qualify for Citizen, a member must have at least fifty posts, been a registered member for two months, and have no warnings. If a member has been warned, the member must have gone six consecutive months without a further warning.

All Citizens have the rights associated with Peregrinus, but in addition may post within the Curia, subject to the procedures in Section II; may post with the Symposium and may patronise other members as per Article II.[/

Clearly we are all citizens and once a citizen, we have the right to choose between the three badges. I have no idea what has changed over time, but this seems to be the current situation.