Ship turn rates for Vanilla are ridiculous.

Nelson must have been in a bad mood that day, he was taking his SOLs and merchants to the Gibraltar trade nodes. Usually he bypassed, this time he attacked.

End up fighting two battles with the French going from 3 x SOL's and 2 frigates, to 2 SOL's and all that remained of the English fleet was a captured merchant.

No challenge here, the thing that makes this possible for the human player is the unrealistic turning ability of game ships.. Looking carefully I noticed a game first rate can torn on a dime.

I've pasted in EIC's turn rate stats now and it gives a much more realistic game. I don't know if EIC is perfect in this regard, but certainly more in keeping with reality.

Gameplay > Realism.

The (somewhat sad, yet understandable) fact is that the vast majority of players are not looking for a naval sim, and would find realistic turn rates extremely frustrating. I think you're exaggerating a tad, though - it's not that easy to turn a First Rate. Unless you plan your battle around the wind, which is sort of the point, and in which case a significant boost to mobility seems appropriate.

What's great about Total War (despite it's many legitimate problems) and its community is that there are options for players looking for a different experience, thanks to dedicated and talented modders. I would not be playing Napoleon Total War without the myriad of small adjustments that I find absolutely vital.

-HD

Originally Posted by HomelessDepot

Gameplay > Realism.

T I think you're exaggerating a tad, though - it's not that easy to turn a First Rate. Unless you plan your battle around the wind, which is sort of the point, and in which case a significant boost to mobility seems appropriate.

-HD

Well I'd play a sea battle and check how tight a 1st rate can turn. Literally on a dime when at slow speed. The thing about these ships is they drew a lot of water, such ships don't turn easily.

Remember that you are 'reproducing' in less than an hour, what might have taken 8-12 hours in historical RT ?

Originally Posted by ♔Lucius Verenus♔

Remember that you are 'reproducing' in less than an hour, what might have taken 8-12 hours in historical RT ?

That justifies a man-o-war with a deep ocean going keel spinning on its own axis? I suspect its all about making it very easy for the human player. I'm looking for a challenge in the campaign.

I agree with the OP. In real life, sail ships normally couldn't turn on the spot (i.e. without any forward speed) ... if they wanted to do that, they needed assistance in the form of small boats propelled by good old muscle power. In the game, turning on the spot is no problem at all.

Originally Posted by antred

I agree with the OP. In real life, sail ships normally couldn't turn on the spot (i.e. without any forward speed) ... if they wanted to do that, they needed assistance in the form of small boats propelled by good old muscle power. In the game, turning on the spot is no problem at all.

Well I certainty don't have a precise idea of what a man-o-war could turn at. They say rule of thumb a typical boat form can turn in 3x its own length. Another factor is deeper the draught then slower to turn. But then a sail boat has to work its rigging when changing direction, this could get hairy in battle when people are shooting at you.

But turning involves push a lot a water out the way in a direction the water doesn't want travel.

Gameplay > Realism.

Yes does game play mean a challenge or real easy?

I'd say its sad to throw away a legitimate challenge when the game creates illegitimate challenges on H and VH.

Originally Posted by wulfgar610

Yes does game play mean a challenge or real easy?

Gameplay means gameplay, doesn't have anything to do with how hard the game is.
Higher turn rates wouldn't make the game more challenging, because it would be in place for both sides.
It's like saying "slower cavalry makes the game more difficult".

Originally Posted by daniu

Gameplay means gameplay, doesn't have anything to do with how hard the game is.
Higher turn rates wouldn't make the game more challenging, because it would be in place for both sides.
It's like saying "slower cavalry makes the game more difficult".

So the ship is a floating turret that reloads in 30 seconds. I think I pointed out that in vanilla I wiped out Nelson with a fleet of 15 ships with the beginning French fleet of 5 ships.

That's difficult? Basically the high turn rates are another CA inbuilt human cheat where the human player can take advantage of the micro manage.

Read my premise before replying.

Originally Posted by wulfgar610

So the ship is a floating turret that reloads in 30 seconds. I think I pointed out that in vanilla I wiped out Nelson with a fleet of 15 ships with the beginning French fleet of 5 ships.

That's difficult? Basically the high turn rates are another CA inbuilt human cheat where the human player can take advantage of the micro manage.

Read my premise before replying.

Your premise being that you wouldn't have won that battle had the turn rates been lower?
Kind of an unreasonable assumption to make.

Lucius is right, if they were more historical, it would take you a long time to act out a naval battle. Just live with the fact they can turn easy.

With 'turning on a dime' smaller ships are a bit pointless, as they can't outmaneuver larger ones... unless of course they are 60MPH (100KMH) motorboats...