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Thread: RSII "Five Good Emperors" Questions, Suggestions & Discussion

  1. #141
    Constantius's Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Re: Announcement/Preview/Discussion: Play Rome 1Turn Unofficial Expansion "Five Good Emperors" RSII 2.1a

    Excellent


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  2. #142
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    Default Re: Announcement/Preview/Discussion: Play Rome 1Turn Unofficial Expansion "Five Good Emperors" RSII 2.1a

    I Must say I'm impressed with this, and will try that ASAP

    BTW, if you use 1 turn, make sure there is 12 TPY, so we can still raise several legions fast enough in one character's lifetime... (actually, that's why I hate 1 turn campaigns in RS, gonna swimming in money and the AI is predictably weak, 12TPY and reduced movement points will be better - and less money obviously)

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  3. #143

    Default Re: Announcement/Preview/Discussion: Play Rome 1Turn Unofficial Expansion "Five Good Emperors" RSII 2.1a

    Will you remove the happiness penalty in client state and annex buildings? I make no sense if both buildings give penalty.
    I still think 14 turns until recruiting troops are too long. BTW, most people will choose client state instead of annex, since the more benefits from client state comparing to annexation.

    @Lykos: what is TPY?



  4. #144
    Spike's Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Re: Announcement/Preview/Discussion: Play Rome 1Turn Unofficial Expansion "Five Good Emperors" RSII 2.1a

    Quote Originally Posted by naq View Post
    Will you remove the happiness penalty in client state and annex buildings? I make no sense if both buildings give penalty.
    I still think 14 turns until recruiting troops are too long. BTW, most people will choose client state instead of annex, since the more benefits from client state comparing to annexation.

    @Lykos: what is TPY?
    Turns per year, 12 turns per year will make it was one month per turn, instead of one season per turn

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  5. #145
    chris10's Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Re: Announcement/Preview/Discussion: Play Rome 1Turn Unofficial Expansion "Five Good Emperors" RSII 2.1a

    Quote Originally Posted by Strategos Lykos View Post
    1. I Must say I'm impressed with this, and will try that ASAP

    2. BTW, if you use 1 turn, make sure there is 12 TPY,

    3. so we can still raise several legions fast enough in one character's lifetime...

    4. (actually, that's why I hate 1 turn campaigns in RS, gonna swimming in money and the AI is predictably weak, 12TPY and reduced movement points will be better - and less money obviously)

    5. and the AI is predictably weak
    1. Thnx...very kind

    2. Uuuuhhhh........12TPY is a strange setting to say at least as this kicks everything off balance.

    • Overall game time: Would be 4788 turns (original+expanison 798 turns) . Just 5 minutes every turn would make this 399 hours without counting a single battle .... you cant be serious
    • Building Times: The building tree would be finished in 50 ingame years and vanilla boredom would be back and its no option to make buildings take 24 turns instead of 4 and raise the price six times...no way
    • Playability is severly affected as the game has 6 times more turns so there will be 6 times more money and six times more people on the long run which makes six times more battles
    • After 50-80 Ingame years most probably there wont be any factions left except 2-3 superfactions which makes the game more boring

    There might be more points but these are more than enough to determine that 12TPY is no option as things are totally out of relation to each other. While I appreciate the thinking and the concept behind 4TPY or 12TPY one has to acknowledge that the engine has been designed for 1Turn Recruitment and 2TPY and that this setting has ever been the best overall experience.
    On the other hand: Iam playing the beta campaign right now and I will release the public beta soon..so no more changes for now,sorry

    3. This comes only into play the first time when raising a Legion but on the other side they will live forever if the player does not lose them entirely...the game has 398 years by now...so why would there be any problems with Characters lifetimes as there will be various Generations anyway...and once the player has raised its forces they are handled over from one General to another especially from the midgame on when named & numbered Legions come into play...Old generals will die and a new one will just take the Legion over and adquiere the Legions Ancillary . Just make sure you are not loosing entire Legions.

    4. Things are more expensive now and if you do not develope your citys properly you wont have enough money. btw...once the Marian Reform triggers money will be even shorter as the Numbered legions are very expensive in Training and Upkeep. I still observe how this goes once I get to the Reform. If I see that I still make to much money I will reintroduce a max money cap but its very very dificult to find the right balance between swimming in money, money shortage and being unable to find the necessary money to survive. There is just a thin red line between these 3 things.

    5. As this is hardcodded in the exe there is nothing we can do
    but I can tell that by enabling the AI to train silver chevron units and using the Garrison script the player has LOTS of more casualties to sustain (which will cost lots of money in retraining shrunken cohorts) and in my test campaign I drained quite a few of my citys to retrain troops and I lost entire unexperienced Legions on assaulting Citys with high exp Garrisons
    It was the first time I ever was under pressure while playing vanilla 1Turn Recruitment.

    Obvioulsy very very experienced players will manage the new problems just as easy as vanilla but it is not that a cakewalk anymore, especially when sticking to the few reasonable houserules I establish in the opening message when starting the campaign. If people follow these rules is up to them of course but it will make the game a lot more fun and increases considerably the need of proper logistic and infrastructure developement.

    Quote Originally Posted by naq View Post
    Will you remove the happiness penalty in client state and annex buildings? I make no sense if both buildings give penalty.
    I still think 14 turns until recruiting troops are too long.
    well..no..it is just fine as it is...its reasonable that, while in the first generation after being conquered, happiness drops every time the Romans build a structure which refers to their military might and is some sort of reminder for the recent conquest...that makes people unhappy...keep building happines buildings to counter this ,they are there for something.
    After all this scenario is supposed to be a lot more difficult and not easier than the current 1Turn Roman Campaign ...I observe in my beta campaing that 14 turns before recruiting allied troops is fine and creates more logistic problems...just as intended...this will come into good use especially when attempting to conquer things far east...huge logistical problems will make Blitzing Impossible, its an important part of the concept.

    Quote Originally Posted by constantius View Post
    Excellent
    Glad you agree with the new approach


    FOR UPDATE 14.01.2011 LOOK POST 3
    Last edited by chris10; January 14, 2011 at 04:54 PM.

  6. #146
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    Default Re: Announcement/Preview/Discussion: Play Rome 1Turn Unofficial Expansion "Five Good Emperors" RSII 2.1a

    ugh, sorry, that was because someone certain said he was playing 12 TPY beta in previous posts. , so I think this will be immediate Marian to Imperial Era...

    about the legion recruitments, if there is 1 turn, and normal 2 turns per year, there will be 15 turns to raise standard 14 normal numbered legions (and 1 first cohort), and 2 for separate cavalry auxilia (that attach to that legion), make effectively you need 8 year minimal to train a stack of legion... and compared with military preparations... well, that means the game would be harder to emulate Caesar... (he levied a lot of those men), while in normal Roman campaign, Roleplaying as military leader is easy because you can raise legions after legions in time of need...

    I'm glad if there will be less money in this submod , I hate 1 turn campaigns because when you allready got a little big in territories, you'll be challanged to FOUND CREATIVE WAYS TO THROWN OUT YOUR DAMN MILLIONS OF MONEY , even after set tax low, and bought expensive thingies (in the other hands, since in 1 turn you can raise the most expensive units without taking heavy economic downturns, in mid to late game, there will be no challange against AI that recruit normal to weak units... especially those stupid gaul who bravely besiege my frontier city with less than half legion garrison... with fullstack of levy clubmen - and predictably got slaughtered to the last men and my legions got more experience beating clubmen). In normal 0 turn campaigns, you can simply fill every city with fullstack recruitments quickly and left the money in "more manageable" fashion.

    one has to acknowledge that the engine has been designed for 1Turn Recruitment and 2TPY and that this setting has ever been the best overall experience
    I disagree, RS II just proven that 0 turn recruitments can be challenging and fun... and actually 0 turn recruitments deter blitzing in long terms, since you won't know how your seemingly low garrison enemy cities suddenly thrown at your invading force, plus if you leave yourlegions carelessly, they can be grind down by stack after stacks of levies... thrown by the AI.

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  7. #147
    DarthLazy's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Re: Announcement/Preview/Discussion: Play Rome 1Turn Unofficial Expansion "Five Good Emperors" RSII 2.1a

    YOu say Leader of Romakotonoi yet you post in this thread? Fail
    Quote Originally Posted by Heathen Hammer View Post
    Real imperialism is shown by Western apologists who are defending Ukraine's brutal occupation of Novorossija.
    Quote Originally Posted by Heathen Hammer View Post
    Sovereignty of Ukraine was recognized by Yeltsin and died with him.

  8. #148
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    Default Re: Announcement/Preview/Discussion: Play Rome 1Turn Unofficial Expansion "Five Good Emperors" RSII 2.1a

    Quote Originally Posted by Strategos Lykos View Post
    1.if there is 1 turn, and normal 2 turns per year, there will be 15 turns to raise standard 14 normal numbered legions (and 1 first cohort), and 2 for separate cavalry auxilia (that attach to that legion), make effectively you need 8 year minimal to train a stack of legion...

    2.I'm glad if there will be less money in this submod , I hate 1 turn campaigns because when you allready got a little big in territories, you'll be challanged to FOUND CREATIVE WAYS TO THROWN OUT YOUR DAMN MILLIONS OF MONEY , even after set tax low, and bought expensive thingies (in the other hands, since in 1 turn you can raise the most expensive units without taking heavy economic downturns, in mid to late game, there will be no challange against AI that recruit normal to weak units...

    3.especially those stupid gaul who bravely besiege my frontier city with less than half legion garrison... with fullstack of levy clubmen - and predictably got slaughtered to the last men and my legions got more experience beating clubmen). In normal 0 turn campaigns, you can simply fill every city with fullstack recruitments quickly and left the money in "more manageable" fashion.

    4. RS II just proven that 0 turn recruitments can be challenging and fun... and actually 0 turn recruitments deter blitzing in long terms,
    1. All units take 1 turn except Diplomats, Generals, High Level Warships and Heavy Siege Equipment...a Legion consist of 1 1st and 9 cohorts (10 cohorts of legionarys) ...in the meantime the Aux and Cav can be recruited elsewhere...be inventive ...and who cares ? it has to be done only once if you dont loose them everytime you use them
    I know 0Turn players use the argument its unreasonable to recruit only 1 cohort per 6 month and all that blabla...but its unreasonable as well that units live forever and never die of age but this is totally ignored...the RTW engine is just an abstract reflection of the military system and not an exact simulation ...the 1Turn recruitment is just fine in relation to the game length and the population growth......as I said before the engine is meant to be played this way...

    2. Iam still observing the money issue. Iam up for the reform in a few turns and then I will see how it goes..until now (636AUC) ther where situations where I struggled with retraining and had no money to built nothing...and today I reworked prices again for certain building trees..look at post 3

    3. I know...there wont be any more levy clubmen armys...instead there will be 1 and 2 silver chevron killer armys around who preferably have green Legionarys for breakfast

    4. 0Turn wrecks entirely the strategy and logistics part of the game as a lost Army is replaced instanly..so there is no tactical or strategical importance of loosing an army...only thing counts is have more population than the enemy and then it goes for the simple formula stack spam = win...
    let alone the million battles to fight...puuuuuhhhhh...thats annoying...at least for me...
    I know 1Turn has downsides but so has 0Turn ...I decided to try to do somethig about 1Turn as this original RTW setting feels more like a strategy game...

    Quote Originally Posted by |Sith|2|Lazyo View Post
    YOu say Leader of Romakotonoi yet you post in this thread? Fail
    Is that really of any importance ??? ...tsss.tsss...those youngsters today...
    Last edited by chris10; January 14, 2011 at 11:50 AM.

  9. #149
    Spike's Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Re: Announcement/Preview/Discussion: Play Rome 1Turn Unofficial Expansion "Five Good Emperors" RSII 2.1a

    yeah, the key is economic system, with current RS economic system (that offers you tons of money via taxes), you'll gonna swimming in money if you play 1 turn campaigns. If the economy is much tighter, 1 turn will be good.

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  10. #150

    Default Re: Announcement/Preview/Discussion: Play Rome 1Turn Unofficial Expansion "Five Good Emperors" RSII 2.1a

    Hmmm. Now what should I play in the meantime? Until you release this damn submod?
    Where do you find the time to write these long replies anyway? You should be testing instead! ;-)

    +rep

  11. #151
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    Default Re: Announcement/Preview/Discussion: Play Rome 1Turn Unofficial Expansion "Five Good Emperors" RSII 2.1a

    Quote Originally Posted by DeWitt8 View Post
    Hmmm. Now what should I play in the meantime? Until you release this damn submod?
    Where do you find the time to write these long replies anyway? You should be testing instead! ;-)
    +rep
    ....Iam at work..I can not play games here but I can sneak around in the forum sometimes ...fair enough so I dont have to do it in my free time and btw get paid

    Wont be long and I release the Public Beta...why not play Solitair in the meantime ?
    Last edited by chris10; January 14, 2011 at 12:09 PM.

  12. #152
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    Default Re: Announcement/Preview/Discussion: Play Rome 1Turn Unofficial Expansion "Five Good Emperors" RSII 2.1a

    Quote Originally Posted by chris10 View Post
    ....Iam at work..I can not play games here but I can sneak around in the forum sometimes ...fair enough so I dont have to do it in my free time and btw get paid

    Wont be long and I release the Public Beta...why not play Solitair in the meantime ?
    I wonder if your boss is also here, reading the RS forum (and RS maniac as well), so he gave you compensation to do your submod first...

    Annokerate Koriospera Yuinete Kuliansa


  13. #153
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    Default Re: Announcement/Preview/Discussion: Play Rome 1Turn Unofficial Expansion "Five Good Emperors" RSII 2.1a

    Can factions re-spawn using BI/ALEX ? what about name changing? I was just thinking, in my current campaign I have pretty much got the empire to Augustus size and standards. But the Germans are getting their butts kicked, by Scythia. Long story short if I get to this stage again, using your sub-mod, I want the traditional enemies at the Limes ie Germans, Sarmations and Parthians. So I would hope that the Germans could respawn or horde


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  14. #154
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    Default Re: Announcement/Preview/Discussion: Play Rome 1Turn Unofficial Expansion "Five Good Emperors" RSII 2.1a

    Quote Originally Posted by constantius View Post
    Can factions re-spawn using BI/ALEX ? what about name changing? I was just thinking, in my current campaign I have pretty much got the empire to Augustus size and standards. But the Germans are getting their butts kicked, by Scythia. Long story short if I get to this stage again, using your sub-mod, I want the traditional enemies at the Limes ie Germans, Sarmations and Parthians. So I would hope that the Germans could respawn or horde
    puuuhhh...lots of things would be nice and if the engine would not be that limited...well...
    as I said in the opening Post...I really did not want to change to much of RSII...

    Factions can not respawn under NO circumstances....dead is dead...
    BI.exe introduced the feature "dead until emerged" which means there where a Faction in a limbo until it got activated but once killed a Faction it is dead...its not like in MTW where heirs could respawn with an Army after some time...

    I implemented some measures to trick the game regarding faction destruction but this has yet to proove to work on a big scale for more players. I think all modders tried to find a fix for the superfaction forming and only SPQR succeeded but this is due to the trick with the Senate as Superfaction of the Romans...other Factions have been given th Senate as Superfaction too and acted more passively against each other as they where connected somehow ...this was assuring that they where still in place once the Player reached them but RSII has no Senate.

    On the other hand...this has to work for all users not only those with BI..so even if I could I would not implement things which only could be used by a certain exe,that would not make a lot of sense and would be highly unfair,too

    UPDATE NEW FEATURE 14.01.2011 see Post 3
    Last edited by chris10; January 14, 2011 at 04:56 PM.

  15. #155
    Constantius's Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Re: Announcement/Preview/Discussion: Play Rome 1Turn Unofficial Expansion "Five Good Emperors" RSII 2.1a

    yes I suppose your right, well I have been 'cheating' not for me but on behalf of the enemies I want to end up with, so I have been pumping money inti Parthia and Germania, I could seriously regret it, but it'll be fun loosing


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  16. #156

    Default Re: Announcement/Preview/Discussion: Play Rome 1Turn Unofficial Expansion "Five Good Emperors" RSII 2.1a

    Can you guys tell me the roman recruitment tree back in 2.0?



  17. #157

    Default Re: Announcement/Preview/Discussion: Play Rome 1Turn Unofficial Expansion "Five Good Emperors" RSII 2.1a

    I Know it says at the start that this is not a sub mod for a certain era would it be fairly easy to add a later era starting postion like they do in SS6.4 say the campain starts with the first good emperor and with the legions histroicly placed?
    The die is cast- Caesar


  18. #158
    Constantius's Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Re: Announcement/Preview/Discussion: Play Rome 1Turn Unofficial Expansion "Five Good Emperors" RSII 2.1a

    Quote Originally Posted by mattfriend0 View Post
    I Know it says at the start that this is not a sub mod for a certain era would it be fairly easy to add a later era starting postion like they do in SS6.4 say the campain starts with the first good emperor and with the legions histroicly placed?
    That has crossed my mind also, in my campaign my Roman empire is at Avgvstvs extent, but of course to go from say Vespasian to Marcus Aurelius, would involve different factions, mainly a variety of Germanic factions, Parthia, Dacia, Sarmatians(Alans and Lazyges) with perhaps shadow faction Roman usurpers, and Parthian contenders for thrown, this just top of my head, so its rather more than just starting dates. But at least most legions are OK


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  19. #159
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    Default Re: Announcement/Preview/Discussion: Play Rome 1Turn Unofficial Expansion "Five Good Emperors" RSII 2.1a

    Quote Originally Posted by mattfriend0 View Post
    I Know it says at the start that this is not a sub mod for a certain era would it be fairly easy to add a later era starting postion like they do in SS6.4 say the campain starts with the first good emperor and with the legions histroicly placed?
    Quote Originally Posted by constantius View Post
    That has crossed my mind also, in my campaign my Roman empire is at Avgvstvs extent, but of course to go from say Vespasian to Marcus Aurelius, would involve different factions, mainly a variety of Germanic factions, Parthia, Dacia, Sarmatians(Alans and Lazyges) with perhaps shadow faction Roman usurpers, and Parthian contenders for thrown, this just top of my head, so its rather more than just starting dates. But at least most legions are OK
    That would require a total remodding of RSII and would be a mod of its own as this would requiere different factions,units,banners,starting positions and so on...
    Additionally...giving Rome 140 starting provinces out of 200 is not going to be the most challenging game ever
    If the RTW engine would support 1000 provinces it would be a different story...but unfortnately this is not the case and until CA will not give up on the source code will never happen...
    having in mind that M2TW, ETW, NTW and even S2TW are still using the corecode of RTW one can imagine that CA will not release the source code before we are all in Pensionist age....
    Its like with Windows...all 32bit Windos are still using the core architecture

    Quote Originally Posted by naq View Post
    Can you guys tell me the roman recruitment tree back in 2.0?
    ..Think it was the Roman Oppidums who provided the troops...My setting sort of reverted the new one to the old one even if its slightly different but without Roman Oppidums there will be no troops
    Last edited by chris10; January 15, 2011 at 09:28 AM.

  20. #160

    Default Re: Announcement/Preview/Discussion: Play Rome 1Turn Unofficial Expansion "Five Good Emperors" RSII 2.1a

    holding 140 against being attack strongly on all sides is a challange and you would have to change too many factions just get rid of some like replace cathage with barbers and just make rebellions harder rename a few fractions as greek slave rebellion as greeks macedoian as macedoian slave rebellion add persia you could add a few cival war factions i am sure it would be too hard to copy the roman faction a few times re name and add a few banners add few new colours scribt a few events in i am sure you would have no trouble making it very hard to hold on to those 140 provinces. if your like me and read alot of roman historical ficton like simon scarrows new book "The legion" i am sure you have want to jump right in and help cato and marco defend the roman empire
    The die is cast- Caesar


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