Consulate of Imperious and Poplicola, 536 A.V.C.

[AspisPhalanx90]

This is great news Consul! A strong economy is the backbone for a strong military! I propose once our remaining armies are reequipped and rested, we prepare to campaign in cisalpine Gaul. The alps make a substantial northern wall against the bulk of the Gallic tribes. However, what news from Hispania? We must eliminate Punic forces from the region if we are to cripple their ambition. If it so pleases the senate, i feel we must make a decision among ourselves as to what we do now against the Punic hordes. Do we let them sit idly, while we settle our affairs here? An invasion of Africa itself? I do not know fellow senatores, but i humbly ask you all to add your input to this Senate. Ceterum ceneseo Carthaginem esse Delendam!

[Rex Basiliscus]

It is indeed good news that in these dire times our infrastructure is still improving.

Basiliscus turned then to Senator Julius.

But I would like to remind our fellow senator, that we are still at war with Carthage. And you propose we enter another war? Our troops are few, we are spreading them thin in Spain and may need reinforcements. We cannot start another war, else we risk losing in Spain. We may have able generals there, but generals alone do not win battles.

Basiliscus smiled mockingly.

Of course, senator Julius does not know when it's too much. I hear he's gambling with his money quite often in some tabernae on the Aventine.
I wouldn't try to acknowledge someone who doesn't have control of his "habits".

Then turning back toward the other senators, he continued.

My father and his father have both bled for Rome. My father was killed by Carthaginians. So many dead fighting our bitterest enemy.
I think many share my opinion when I say we must concentrate on Carthage alone. Too many lives have been lost. Their souls cry out for vengeance. We must satisfy their spirits by offering them the greatest sacrifice - Carthage herself!

Gauls can wait. Macedonia can wait. We should divert all our strength to destroying Carthage. I agree with Cato here, even if we don't go along well, as you might know. Destroy Carthage, or she will destroy us!

With that he sat down and awaited what others would say.

[chaplain118]

Scaurus stood and rubbed his brows. He had been afflicted with a coughing fit over the past few weeks and was unable to speak, but he could hear and watch everything that happened. And he was disturbed.

Allow me to first congratulate the Praetor and consul for ending the threat in Italy and for the death of Hannibal.

His voice was still raspy with hints of gurgling each time he took a breath

But at the same time I cannot help but notice our commanders returning to our senate halls bearing the bloody red military dress of battle, a sign of their imperium still even after they have crossed the Pomoerium. What, do our ancient laws not matter?

As for destroying Carthage, what do you propose we do? Strike first into Spain and deprive the Carthaginians of their silver and gold productions? Or do you suggest that we go for the throat instead and land on the sandy shores of Carthage for the city itself? If we are to take the former option, we will need a commander that is more concerned with the enemy than with merely sitting in his protected fortress and NOT assaulting Carthage. If we are to take the latter, we will need to mobilize almost all of our legions on Italy and Sicily and hope that they will not be crushed when they arrived in Carthage.

A fit of coughs interrupted Scaurus as he leaned on his cane

I propose the former. We cut off Carthage's ability to wage war on two fronts and at the same time we will have doubled our land. Of course, this is not something that can be done with our current commander in Spain more than happy to merely wallow about, doing nothing.

A few men who knew Scaurus' policy well realized what he was getting at. After all, he had already made his intentions quite clear when he declared his candidacy for consulship.

I propose a motion,

Senatus Consultum de Bello Hispanico

1. The replacement of Titus Cassius Gerges as the commander of Hispania for the remainder of his term
2. The reallocation of the legion that has been moved from Hispania back to Emporiae
3. The inclusion of Hispania as part of consular imperium.

If we do nothing now, Emporiae will fall to Carthage. Our enemy has proven to be more than capable of acting without direction from their leadership. Why tempt them to come closer to Rome by leaving Emporiae utterly defenseless?

OOC: Which version are we using? 2.1a?

[apple]

I support this motion. We need to remove the source of Carthage's armies if we are to beat them once and for all.
Add to that the riches and the amount of land the roman people would gain from a Roman Iberia this is the only reasonable plan.

Going directly for Carthage would only spill the bloods of our people on the sand shores of Africa.

OCC: Yes 2.1a

[Rex Basiliscus]

I agree with Scaurus. We need to take Iberia from Carthage and criple their economy, with which they're paying their mercenaries.

[dragoon47]

The motion is supported and will therefore be put to vote.

[AspisPhalanx90]

Senator Basilicus, i would like to point out that i was simply voicing possible directions for the Republic to take. Also, my "habits" i assure you are no less than any other man in this Senate. Perhaps i should spend more time at the brothels, like yourself Senator? But no, i will not mention such things, as a war of words and insults carries as much honor as the Punic mercenaries have. I support the motion to continue the campaign in Hispania.

Julius sat down frustratingly,

[chaplain118]

If this motion is indeed supported and moved to vote, then there is also the question of whom will be sent to Emporiae to replace Gerges. Now, Conscript Fathers, I know that my old age is certainly something that members of the younger generation will be holding against me, but I cannot in good conscience deny an opportunity such as this to increase the Republic's boundaries.

And also, the moral laxness of the younger generation and their gross lack of respect for proper decorum of our senate house worries me. Bringing an enemy general directly into these hallowed halls? Entering the sacred boundaries of Rome with full garments of arms? Discussing their gambling and prostitution habits within these hallowed halls? Impudent children!

Scaurus rapped his cane against the floor, emphasizing his last points

I intend to lead by example abroad. To restore proper Roman values, proper Roman virtues, and proper Roman ways so that when the Sisters have finished spinning the thread of my life, I will know that I have left the Senate in capable hands, in virtuous hands, in true Roman hands.

And I thus ask of you, conscript father, for Pro-consular authority in Iberia as a replacement to Gerges as well as stripping him of all powers he possesses. Do I hear any objections?

[dragoon47]

I don't know where you get the idea of coming in with a little blood on one's hands is full battle garb Scaurus but I am forced to agree with you on the others, if only out of principle rather than reality.

I support Scaurus' secondary proposal and therefore raise no objection. However, it shall be to the end of Gerges term and no longer.

[CK23]

Imperious watched the developments carefully and stood when the talking had finished. "While I will vote Aye for the motion, I must ask what you then intend to do about Sagunton? You believe that the settlement will not fall into enemy hands as well?" Imperious was more passionate about the topic as he'd lead the legion which had conquered Sagunton. "While you might think they are barbarians they are now a constitute member of the Roman Republic. We have men, women and children who are now colonist there...we cannot abandon them." Imperious spoke directly to Senator Scaurus in a calm, yet passionate tone.

[chaplain118]

The interests of Roman citizens will be protected, of course. And the colonists, they knew the danger of settling in a war zone, and knowing that danger, they have forfeited their expectation of an easy life. But I see no point to your query, Consul. If we press the Punics hard enough, if we press them until they can resist no more, then what do we have to worry about the safety of Sagunton from Carthaginian attack?

And unless Roman citizenship has been conferred upon the residents of Sagunton, then they remain irrevocably foreigners, peregrini, afforded neither the privilege nor the luxuries of citizenship. And that, is something you will find unarguable.

[Tazgrent]

Cassius stood to be recognized. "I would like to remind the Senate of the atrocities carried out upon Saguntum by Hannibal himself, not two years ago. In fact, those atrocities were the start of this very war. I support the motion fully; both Emporion and Saguntum are too volatile to be left in the hands of a governor. They should be under Consular rule until things gave stabilized."

[chaplain118]

Though I must warn you, the residents of Emporiae are not pleased that we have sent away the bulwark, nay the entirety, of our garrison from that city. This is sure to foment displeasure if not downright rebellion. If this situation is not remedied soon, we may be facing a far more pressing matter than simply repelling the Punics.

[CK23]

"Though they are colonist, they are Roman citizens and we are, by law required to protect them. Something you will find unarguable." Imperious had turned his attention away from the Praetor before he started to speak to Senator Scauris. "The point of my entire query Senator, is that you plan to retreat a legion and leave a settlement defenseless, a settlement which could be of greater use to us in the future. Leaving at least one city along the coast to be vulnerable to attack if you make your retreat." Imperious was infuriated with this old mans pestering; while he did indeed speak the truth he went about it with arrogance and ignorance. "And despite not having citizenship Senator, they are under Roman rule. Now if we lose the settlement they will see it as abandonment and when we attempt later to Romanize Iberia and Hispania they will be the first among them to be rebellious and spread something truthful amongst the population. Is that what you want Senator? You want another rebellion, but this one due to your own personal agenda?" Imperious was respectful yet determined in his cause, a hint of anger brushed his words.

"I do not mean to disrespect or offend anyone, including someone as esteemed as yourself Senator, however I will not be intimidated by reputation. Your actions will leave an open wound within the people themselves, something which you cannot afford." Imperious diverted his attention to the words that the Senator spoke last. "Emporiae has begun to take steps to Romanization, they are among the first to taste the fruits of true Roman democracy. Whilst they are in downright uproar over the past months, things will sooth as order and happiness increase in the settlement. Perhaps your action by making yourself Proconsul of Hispania will do the People and Senate of Rome some good."

[chaplain118]

Abandonment, is it?

Scaurus drew himself up to his full height. An unimposing five feet, but the fire behind his eyes shone brighter.

What, I wonder, would you call the treatment of Emporiae? Not more than eight months ago, a full legion was stationed there, now not a single trooper remains to safeguard our holdings there. You say that pulling troops from Sagunton to Emporiae is abandonment, but haven't we already abandoned Emporiae to the enterprising Arverni that lie so near her border, to the greedy independent tribes that surround it, to the Greeks of Massilia, or gods forbid, a Carthaginian strike force sent through the mountains. Hannibal has already proven it more than capable that mountains cannot delay Punic determination. Yet we keep Emporiae's gates unguarded.

And you would call sending a few men from Sagunton back to Emporiae abandonment.

[Tazgrent]

Cassius stood quickly. "Senators, Senators... this is no place for such words of anger. Perhaps a compromise. We have more than enough troops that we could split them; just enough to maintain public order in the short term. However, once levies have been raised from both settlements, the Legion can be re-united. Another suggestion, slightly related. Let us stop referring to Sagunton by it's hedonistic Greek name, and give it a proper Roman name: Saguntum."

[dragoon47]

I would not suggest renaming their city this soon. Maybe at another time when they aren't still in shock that they are under Roman rule. Last I checked, we were planning on raiding even deeper into Spain, and having citizens angry at us for defiling what they might see as culturally important and then leaving a mock garrison behind are the ingredients of contempt and revolt.

[chaplain118]

Levies are incapable of being raised! Our official overseas policy has been one of disarmament before even consideration as potential ally. Emporiae is, and in the immediacy of the next year, completely defenseless. Walls, gates, and barricades count for nothing without men to guard them. The same can be said for Sagunton. Emporiae has not even voted amongst its own inhabitants on its desire for a government. It would take more than a full year to indoctrinate them into Roman allies, a year that we simply do NOT have!

[dragoon47]

Then garrison the city. We have plans to march into the lower Po Valley and get rid of the Punics there. Afterward, we can send the praetorian wing of the army to Spain to reinforce the army there and renew an offensive.

Do you find these arrangements agreeable Scaurus?

Lucius felt almost subservient to the man in front of him, he indeed command respect whenever he walked in.

[Tazgrent]

"If that is indeed the case, then what is to be done? Must we sacrifice a city for the sake of the other? Shall we split our forces? What is to be done? What is your proposal, Scaurus. Tell us in detail, and it shall be put to vote."