A sense of achievement.

[Kjertesvein]

I can't find it in the (Dale) campaign (vh/vh). Personally - Tho the battles are the most repetitive and boring thing I have ever done, the thing that's at fault, is the campaign map. The battlefield is just a reaffirmation of the AI's inherent ability to loose in all it does before it.

Each choice taken on the campaign map is the same as the turn before. Each turn - no random events, no tsunami on the horizon, no fear or hard choices which can turn your empire on it's belly is taken nor feared. There are exceptions like the invasion you have to prepare for, or the kingdom of Arnor you have to strive for, but those are far and few between.

The second issue I have, is the clone armies. They must be as balanced as god himself would create them. Right now, I get 1 cavalry and 19 javelin throwing monkeys smashing up against my castle walls like water on rocks.

/rant

Now you, addicted player, tell me how to chance the dragon! Should I halt my generals in their expansive campaigns for some turns(or similar things)? I know I can find this ring in Ootmm, but are there other unwritten eastern eggs I should keep my eye up for? Any mini mods which will give a sense of struggle on the campaign map?

Aside from the usual nagging: The custom battles, historical battles and the Fellowship of the Ring(no matter how little butter there is on that last bread) is one of the best I have ever played.


~Wille

[peoplescavalry]

I am finding the opposite as dale on vh/vh, hardly any money, hardly any decent units to spend it on and only a ceasefire with rhun to keep back six full stacks of well balanced armies who are straining at the leash on my borders. If i manage to get out of this fix i will be well chuffed!

[Russian Gondor]

I agree about the battles. Almost no scripting other than loads of stacks for the enemy. So on VH/VH I end up fighting 2-3 stacks per turn and all the battles are the same which makes me sleep.

[Broke1980]

I can't find it in the (Dale) campaign (vh/vh). Personally - Tho the battles are the most repetitive and boring thing I have ever done, the thing that's at fault, is the campaign map. The battlefield is just a reaffirmation of the AI's inherent ability to loose in all it does before it.

Each choice taken on the campaign map is the same as the turn before. Each turn - no random events, no tsunami on the horizon, no fear or hard choices which can turn your empire on it's belly is taken nor feared. There are exceptions like the invasion you have to prepare for, or the kingdom of Arnor you have to strive for, but those are far and few between.

The kingdom of Arnor you have to strive for?
Are you sure you're talking about Dale?
Arnor is an achievement for the free people of Eriador

[Jean=A=Luc]

Arnor is an achievement for the free people of Eriador

He knows that, he was citing it as an example unrelated to Dale.

[Messremb]

Stop crying.
The suckyness of the CAI has been thoroughly shouted. The challenge with VH/VH is surviving with the one army you managed to scrounge up when the enemy lines about five. That's it!- get used to it, get over it, learn to love it or play something else.
And since the uber-captain keeps an eye out for ungrateful bastards like us, we tell him this: what the point of all that work on the custom settlements if the CAI remains the same fun-draining horror?

[peoplescavalry]

Still clinging on fighting hordes of gold plated rhun, they all look very upmarket in this seasons armour, could you please explain to the unintiated what CAI means? Ta.

[Jean=A=Luc]

The suckyness of the CAI has been thoroughly shouted.

Has it? Or are you simply superimposing your own opinion over that of most of the community and taking it as a general truth because it suits you?

The challenge with VH/VH is surviving with the one army you managed to scrounge up when the enemy lines about five. That's it!- get used to it, get over it, learn to love it or play something else.
And since the uber-captain keeps an eye out for ungrateful bastards like us, we tell him this: what the point of all that work on the custom settlements if the CAI remains the same fun-draining horror?

Overreacting much? You can't please everyone. Some find the game too easy and claim it needs more of a challenge while some constantly complain that's it's too hard and they can't even survive the first few dozen turns. Others, again, struggle to survive and expand but make it in the end and find the challenge enjoyable.

The CAI is pretty much the same as in any other mod. We can't really make the AI "smart" so we make it throw more units at the player. Almost all mods do this, SS, CoW, RS2, etc.

You make it sound like improving the AI is as easy as flipping a switch but KK and the "uber captain" don't wanna do it 'cause they're jerks or something. Get a grip and a perspective of what it takes to work on a mod like this, especially when you take into account it's almost one man doing it (KK).

If it's mostly the stack spam that bothers you, you can always lower the campaign difficulty or disable the various scripts that assist the AI (instructions are in the FAQ), this has all been mentioned a million times.

[Messremb]

Has it? Or are you simply superimposing your own opinion over that of most of the community and taking it as a general truth because it suits you?

Overreacting much? You can't please everyone. Some find the game too easy and claim it needs more of a challenge while some constantly complain that's it's too hard and they can't even survive the first few dozen turns. Others, again, struggle to survive and expand but make it in the end and find the challenge enjoyable.

The CAI is pretty much the same as in any other mod. We can't really make the AI "smart" so we make it throw more units at the player. Almost all mods do this, SS, CoW, RS2, etc.

You make it sound like improving the AI is as easy as flipping a switch but KK and the "uber captain" don't wanna do it 'cause they're jerks or something. Get a grip and a perspective of what it takes to work on a mod like this, especially when you take into account it's almost one man doing it (KK).

If it's mostly the stack spam that bothers you, you can always lower the campaign difficulty or disable the various scripts that assist the AI (instructions are in the FAQ), this has all been mentioned a million times.

Aren't I just saying that? You're basically repeating my own words with another definition.
All I was ing about was results of that 'throwing units' AI code that creates the mono-unit stacks and the huge-amass-of-stacks-in-pointless-places-and-just-sitting glitch. To name only two issues.
Over-reacting a bit captain? Was I belittling anything else about the mod? All this titanic work and the stunning results, more or less ruined by one bad thing it's a crying shame. I was doing my part as a grateful fan and pointing a finger at the only remaining bubu. I have better things to do with my time than posting here if it's not something useful I type.
Give a man a stick and he always finds the need to whack it at somebody.


You big boogie-man!

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

[Kjertesvein]

The suckyness of the CAI has been thoroughly shouted.

I have heard that CAI and AI scripts are mutually exclusive, right?If I've been told wrong (that CAI and AI scripts are the same), then see the spoiler as a way for me to beat my dead horse as if that should do any good.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

I stated that there's not enough focus on the campaign map. By that I mean scripts and events to keep the player busy(ring elements, random regional events or even tom bombadil events, etc.). They may cost money, others may be less crucial to pursue. So, not necessarily an AI faction taking you over by share strategic wit.

The campaign is the whole preparation for each battle and pretty much determine the outcome of any battle. If your mind have to focus on several things at the time, then you won't be able to perform as good in each individual battle. Additionally, if you face fewer and more varied AI armies*, then personal command training, logistical preparations and army build-up will be even harder. It turns into a game of doubt or hints of paranoia for what might happened. The feeling of achievement after getting on top of something you fear you can't handle, is then tenfolds that of redundancy.

Another thing: It's hard to describe, but when a game got enough campaign map intrigues on turn, the player will eventually begin to forget the random scripts he encountered earlier. Thus it will act as a new game when he later encounters that event again. Renewable energy (isn't that thing they want now?)

It's not to be hidden under a chair that off course, we are talking longer loading time. If I may be correct here, that can be solved with a/several first turn pop up(s), asking the player to decline/accept the different campaign features which allow the player to choose.

*AI armies can be tied to the level of AI cities, rather rather then their buildings. My own experience tell me this creates much much better structured AI armies. We are talking even levelled armies with enough cavalry/infantry and the right kind of ranged units.

All the problems mentioned in this thread are fixed if you play an all human hotseat campaign. So get to it!

As I feared. I then have to learn new things...

~Wille

[brapollo]

I never understand this complaint that "the same thing happens, the same battles happen" complaint. Once you play past 100 turns, all kinds of different things happen depending on who you are and what you do. For example, as Dale on vh/vh, I've survived fairly well but the only "good" peoples left are the elves and dwarves. And I've been fighting stacks of mixed dragon regiments, not Balcloth javelins. But playing SE on vh/vh, the good guys are holding up very well and are on the offensive all over the map. I've fought very diffent armies of orcs, Rhun, Mordor, and Isengard.

[Maiden_Ante]

Stop crying.
The suckyness of the CAI has been thoroughly shouted. The challenge with VH/VH is surviving with the one army you managed to scrounge up when the enemy lines about five. That's it!- get used to it, get over it, learn to love it or play something else.
And since the uber-captain keeps an eye out for ungrateful bastards like us, we tell him this: what the point of all that work on the custom settlements if the CAI remains the same fun-draining horror?

You make a good point, I've often found my campaign becoming epic since I actually have to think about what I do with my generals, unlike vanilla. Not only that, I have to be very careful in building my armies, placing them, making sure diplomacy is going fine.

Fighting off vast armies, helping your ally, once in a while making a counter attack. It's difficult and it's lovely.

[eregost]

CAI is Campaign Artificial Intelligence. All the problems mentioned in this thread are fixed if you play an all human hotseat campaign. So get to it!

[YTG]

one question, what the heck is a hotseat campaign and how can i do it

[eregost]

one question, what the heck is a hotseat campaign and how can i do it

Check the multiplayer subforum. Every faction is controlled by a human and you pass the save file around by posting it on the forum to take your turns. Since the 'problems' mentioned in this thread are all AI flaws, you do not encounter any of them in a hotseat campaign. Hotseat campaigns are the most fun you can have with TW games IMO providing you play with good people. It takes immersion, challenge and depth to a whole new level!

[Shocked]

I can't find it in the (Dale) campaign (vh/vh). Personally - Tho the battles are the most repetitive and boring thing I have ever done, the thing that's at fault, is the campaign map. The battlefield is just a reaffirmation of the AI's inherent ability to loose in all it does before it.

Each choice taken on the campaign map is the same as the turn before. Each turn - no random events, no tsunami on the horizon, no fear or hard choices which can turn your empire on it's belly is taken nor feared. There are exceptions like the invasion you have to prepare for, or the kingdom of Arnor you have to strive for, but those are far and few between.

The second issue I have, is the clone armies. They must be as balanced as god himself would create them. Right now, I get 1 cavalry and 19 javelin throwing monkeys smashing up against my castle walls like water on rocks.

/rant

Now you, addicted player, tell me how to chance the dragon! Should I halt my generals in their expansive campaigns for some turns(or similar things)? I know I can find this ring in Ootmm, but are there other unwritten eastern eggs I should keep my eye up for? Any mini mods which will give a sense of struggle on the campaign map?

Aside from the usual nagging: The custom battles, historical battles and the Fellowship of the Ring(no matter how little butter there is on that last bread) is one of the best I have ever played.


~Wille

The Sub mod RR/RC fixes almost everything I don't like about the game and improves the game play immensely in my opinion, but its not out for 2.1 yet.

Just thought I might throw that out there xD