The Hellenic States

[Sabazios]

that may be true historically, but after all... we are keeping the incendiary pigs and stuff...




also... this guy looks more like an up-armored thureophoros... (linothorax with scale) which would put him at least close to any hastatus in stats. i would agree if were to lower the attack slightly and increased the charge bonus.

-- these soldiers should be at least close to hastati.
i would say give them better armor, less defense skill, and close to an equivalent shield fpr defense.

they would already be limited by their cost and their needing to be recruited at city barracks. i think this is hampering enough.

yeah, that should do the trick.

@Cinuz
I like the overhand animation though

[debux]

About the Romans, I agree with what alexander the average says. I'm thinking maybe the thoraktai should be at least under the legionaries, but not let themselves get eaten up. I don't know if this would make them superior to the principes though (historically the post-marian legionary was based on the principes)

Cinuz, I think the tweaking you did is great +rep in part because it was I had in mind . Besides now armored hoplites won't be as powerful now.

And can we please make poeni infantry more accessible by moving them to the city barracks?

I'll take that suggestion to my grave if it's necessary...

[Achea]

Upload the file, but just make it compatible with the minipatches, so people have a choice. Nice looking units as well.

EDIT: While I really want to maintain the vanilla feel, I would not be opposed to editing hoplites so they fight like this-

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Adding in the short_spear attribute couldn't hurt either.

[Aleksander the Average]

what does everyone think about giving militia hoplites shirts. i know we want to keep the vanilla feel... but i don't think they would have fought in JUST their man-skirts...

anyone else with me?

[Valkar]

Preview of some units from a future minipatch (some reskins - thracian bastarnae, merc bastarnae, merc illyrians, and a whole new unit thureophoroi).
Some texture parts and a model of thracian bastarnae came from an old, but great russian mod 'Barbarians Revenge' by Alxcruel and Dick. An unit library of this mod is generously offered for free use without a special permission. UI's by me.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Check my profile, it has a picture of a historic good bastarnae.. These are vanilla and the vanilla bastarnae suck.

[Spartan198]

AFAIK Hastati had better armor (bronze breastplate and some even greaves). Thureophoroi had no armor at all. Basically just peltasts whith larger shields and spears. Them having less armor and a spear should mean that hastati could defeat them whitout much trouble in melee. I think they should have the stats of the illyrian mercenaries, but due to them having spears being able to fight better against cavalry.

But thats just my 50 cents

They did have breastplates, as EB portrayed their Polybian Hastati with them. But said breastplates don't look like they provide as much protection as a linothorax would.


That's why I suggested putting Thureophoroi and Hastati on par with each other. But I think that since Hastati used bigger shields, they should get a higher shield rating than Thureophoroi. Thureophoroi, on the other hand, getting the advantage against cavalry with their spears (as you suggested) would presumably balance them out.

[Sabazios]

yes, with the model Linjane made that is the best solution, but in my previous post i was referening to non armored thureophoroi, like these for example:

[Cinuz]

I've changed the sacred band and the spartans' recruitment turns from 2 to 3...

Here is the file!

EDIT - I like Sabazios suggestion for the thureophoroi!

[Aleksander the Average]

brilliant images Sabazios. +rep. where did you get them?

you too Cinuz. i like your fixes.

[Achea]

On a fairly off topic note, I just posted a Hellenic States "Who Am I?" map in that thread in general discussion, so come and guess.

[Derpy Hooves]

Delete post

[Sabazios]

brilliant images Sabazios. +rep. where did you get them?

you too Cinuz. i like your fixes.

a search for the right thureophoroi pictures got me on some dudes site, he's one of those oldschool total war players (as in miniature figures ).

I like this pic to:

[Achea]

Nice pictures Sabazios, you can have some rep on me.

Despite the fact Liby-Phoenicians have spears, they use light_spear attribute and they haven't any penalties vs. infantry; you may check export_descr_unit to see. And their secondary weapon is a sword already, so in general they should be pretty effective if used against roman pre-marian troops.

Really? Because they get THRASHED by Principes, even without throwing a volley of javelins. I just did a custom battle, and for every Principe killed around 8.5 LPs were killed.

[Aleksander the Average]

even though now i realize all you did was scroll down further than me in google images... you still get the rep.

[Lanjane]

Hi guys. Thank you very much for images; I spend a half of an evening to get something similar to them, but here they are, new version of thureophoroi.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

However, I think that I'll add both versions to the game, as 'light' (unarmored) and 'heavy' thureophoroi. There are still some work to handle with, but new minipatch is on its way.

[Achea]

Great job, they look just right. As always, I can help out with descriptions and such. +rep

[Sabazios]

Hi guys. Thank you very much for images; I spend a half of an evening to get something similar to them, but here they are, new version of thureophoroi.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

However, I think that I'll add both versions to the game, as 'light' (unarmored) and 'heavy' thureophoroi. There are still some work to handle with, but new minipatch is on its way.

Great man! Especially the helmets!

Maybe rename the heavy ones to 'greek marines' or something and add them to the shipwright/dockyard?

[Spartan198]

Maybe rename the heavy ones to 'greek marines' or something and add them to the shipwright/dockyard?

They're a bit too light to be marines, if you ask me. Marines are melee troops, whereas Thureophoroi (both "light" and "heavy") are just a heavier variety of skirmisher.

[Cinuz]

The thureophoroi are great, but if I can give you a suggestion, I'd re-colour the cape so that it would have the red of the faction's colours...

[Sabazios]

They're a bit too light to be marines, if you ask me. Marines are melee troops, whereas Thureophoroi (both "light" and "heavy") are just a heavier variety of skirmisher.

Based on this article (http://www.ne.jp/asahi/luke/ueda-sar...hikrates1.html) I though that the model of the heavy thueorophoroi would be nice to use for marines. I agree that the name greek marines isnt really appropriate then, maybe call them Iphikratean Marines instead.

edit: hmm just saw that they were armed with pelta shield instead of thureos