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  1. #1
    Ryou's Avatar Biarchus
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    Default Help for Byzantium Campaign

    okay, so I started this campaigh as the Byzantiums with Savage's AI, very hard difficulty, wanting a chalange and thinking Me, the tactical genius can chane histroy and Make the Empire's legendary decline and fall a joke.
    Well when I started I found constantinople defneded by a rebel full stack, a turkish full stack half a milimeter (campaigh map) from my capital, (meaning they'll attack next turn as they're at war with me) which is only defneded by 8 units. On my best days I oculd hold it, bu look here, the turkish empire is huge and this is only ther forunner. Well, you could say I can conquer rebel cities and castles and build up my force, well, every single city near me is defended by at least 15 unit cards, most full stacks. I am almost bank rupt and none of my city except for my capital have more than 5 unit, and venice is thretening to sweep down from the north. I was like BEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEP its not possible to win without using cheats. So guys, any suggestion before I press the end turn button that will take me to th second turn?



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  2. #2

    Default Re: Help for Byzantium Campaigh

    The Byzantium late campaign is supposed to be hard. There are some guides for it.

    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=203634
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=320711

  3. #3
    Souka's Avatar Semisalis
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    Default Re: Help for Byzantium Campaigh

    Post a screenshot of your campaign or explain more thorougly about what cities you currently hold and your neighbouring factions etc.

    But if you think you won't be able to hold that settlement you should sell it, just remeber to destroy every building in it before you sell it because you will still get full price for the settlement plus have the extra cash from razing the buildings.

  4. #4
    Concrete's Avatar Semisalis
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    Default Re: Help for Byzantium Campaigh

    @Souka, I'm pretty sure he means the late Era Byzantine campaign at it's beginning.
    Speaking of, that's what I've started playing of the moment, so I'll come back and share my experiences a bit later.


  5. #5
    Medkirtys's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Help for Byzantium Campaigh

    There's a thing, that rebels like to leave their cities defended only by one unit, use that. Also, attacking Constantinople is different. They'll most likely sally you, so what you want to do, is take Battlefield, not Siege forces with you, also, one unit of siphonatores will be HUGE HUGE HUGE HUGE thing in settlement defense, it just rips apart enemy forces if used correctly. I have to go now, later when i'll return, ill add some more stuff

  6. #6
    Concrete's Avatar Semisalis
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    Default Re: Help for Byzantium Campaign

    ALRIGHTY.
    I was at it for awhile, but I'll share what I've learnt.

    First up, what do we start with?
    Well, our capitol is Nicaea.
    Along with a castle and a town, we have three settlements in Western Anatolia, all at risk from the Turks.
    Who also are a danger to Trebizond, isolated and to the east.
    Over in Europe, we have a castle and town in Epirus, which are at danger from Venice.
    And that's it.

    Here's what I did.
    You'll notice two naval stacks, I combined these together as fast as possible, and moved them to Epirus.
    Meanwhile, I forgot about Trebizond. I left the garrison in Nicaea as is. And moved as many troops as I could from the remaining anatolian settlements as south as possible, so they were just above Rhodes.
    These movements took one or two turns, and meanwhile, I added all the troops I could recruit to said gatherings.

    The turks don't attack Nicaea for a couple of turns, but they will, and thus you should be keeping a strong garrison there.

    Then, with a small army in Epirus and another across the sea from Rhodes, I took the force from Epirus and conquered Crete.
    Then, I joined together the two groups at Rhodes and conquered it, too.
    At this point a significant army was nearby one of the anatolian towns, as well as one besieging Nicaea.
    And another one was approching Trebizond.

    I noticed that Isparta was almost defenceless, and I thought it an easy target for the army now in Rhodes.
    And thus I set sail for it and landed my soldiers.
    The Turks didn't like this one bit, and pulled back both armies to defend Isparta.
    So, I too pulled back, and the army set sail for Nicaea.

    Meanwhile, Durazzo was under siege by the Venitians, and Trebizond by the Turks.
    Both battles I expected to lose, Trebizond because I forgot about it, and my two additonal units of Scoutari didn't finish training when the Turks started the siege.
    And Durazzo because the Venitian army was quite large, heavily armoured and led by a general, and I only had a few militia units.
    I crushed the turks by camping the castle square.
    In Durazzo, I tried the same thing, but thought my chances of winning were next to nothing.
    My spearmen held out for awhile, while my archers shot over their heads. But the spearmen were dying quickly, and so I sent my general into the fight to occupy them a little longer.
    Eventually, my archers were left alone, with only the general himself holding off the Venitians.
    At this point the archers could shoot the venitans straight in the back, which killed many.
    The general lasted a very long time, when suddenly, either he or the archers killed the venitian general.
    And just like that, a total rout and I was victorious.
    I sat there stunned for awhile.
    One man certainly made all the difference in the world:
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 


    So, the defences had gone well, as had the conquest of Crete and Rhodes.
    But I was hardly secure, and I was losing more money each turn.
    I thought of taking southern Greece, but there were too many rebels to grind though and not enough time.
    I needed Constantinople.

    And thus, when my abroad army reached Nicaea(which at the time was Turk-safe), I combined the most potent soldiers of both groups, filled the gaps with milita, and moved to attack the army outside of Constantinople.

    It was a grand battle, and I nearly lost it a couple of times, due to the unexpectedly strong morale of the second army, when a cavalry unit got around into my archers, and when the inital force countered my charge and broke it up.
    But I had won, although many brave men died that day:
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 


    And thus, I had my capitol back, and my income was in the green significantly enough to have hope for the future.
    (I suppose you can get a massive injection of funds if you exterminate or sack it, but I simply couldn't bring myself to do anything less than occupy it.)
    From here, the possibilities branch, and a lot hangs on what the AI does, but you're out of the dog house, at least:
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 


    Annnd, I think I may have gone overboard with the detail.


  7. #7
    Tears of Destiny's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Help for Byzantium Campaign

    I loved the detail! I think you are really going to enjoy pulling them out and trying to rebuild their glory. I certainly did! The Eastern Roman Empire is certain to hold your interest far longer then the usual factions, as nothing compares to how much fluff they are given, or the immense sense of satisfaction in winning and losing their uphill battles.

    This is no England Campaign.

  8. #8
    Concrete's Avatar Semisalis
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    Default Re: Help for Byzantium Campaign

    Heheh, thanks for the +rep guys.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tears of Destiny View Post
    I loved the detail! I think you are really going to enjoy pulling them out and trying to rebuild their glory. I certainly did! The Eastern Roman Empire is certain to hold your interest far longer then the usual factions, as nothing compares to how much fluff they are given, or the immense sense of satisfaction in winning and losing their uphill battles.

    This is no England Campaign.
    Yeah, I absolutely love Byzantium, and had great fun in an Early Era campaign.
    This was on my to do list for awhile but other things came first.
    Decided to start now because somebody asking for help.


  9. #9
    JorisofHolland's Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Re: Help for Byzantium Campaign

    Ryou: Are you sure you're using 6.3? I just started a campaign and I had no declarations of war at all, even though I'm playing VH/VH.
    The Enemy of Human Souls
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    And was a sovereign Southern State.

  10. #10
    Tears of Destiny's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Help for Byzantium Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by JorisofHolland View Post
    Ryou: Are you sure you're using 6.3? I just started a campaign and I had no declarations of war at all, even though I'm playing VH/VH.
    6.3 took out the auto-declare.

    He might be using 6.2 or RR/RC sub mod.

    We really should make it mandatory to explicitly list at the end of every Original Post the Version being used.

  11. #11
    Medkirtys's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Help for Byzantium Campaign

    I don't have any declarations of war from the beggining now either, but few weeks ago, before updated MSC, i had declaration of war with Turks, and actually, that made more fun.
    So, i managed to make my Byzantine Empire strong. As i said, rebels will walk out of their settlements, use that. I lost Trebizond, but it's ok, 1) it's surounded by enemies 2) you won't make an army easily from there 3) you need ships to bring troops from there , so what i did, was take all troops, and conquer Sinop, Turks attack it not so often. Siphonatores in sieges make all the difference in the world, it's really strong in sieges, position spearmen (Kontaratoi, Scoutatoi or Spathatoi are too expensive, because you'll probably lose some troops from friendly fire) behind gates, but a bit further, and place Siphonatores on the side, so while Kontaratoi hold the enemy, Siphonatores strike them with flame. Kills any enemy INSTANTLY. Also, Aldari (Alani) are good for dealing with Turkish Horse Archers, and Latin Empire (rebels who own Constantinople and so on) use only pavise crossbowmen, so use HA preferably against them, though i risked Nicae, i left only 1 unit there, and went "All in" to Constantinople, i had crap quality troops, but Generals made the difference in that day. So, summary, expect to lose settlements, but number 1 priority is Constantinople, get it, and you'll be good. You'll be far from "safe" and "great" , but you'll be stable

  12. #12
    JorisofHolland's Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Re: Help for Byzantium Campaign

    Got something usefull: invest in 'solid' income (agriculture, mining and tax) in your often-under-siege-settlements instead of 'liquid' trade, which will disappear everytime the settlement is sieged. Can save you some money early one, perhaps make the difference.
    The Enemy of Human Souls
    Sat grieving at the cost of coals;
    For Hell had been annexed of late,
    And was a sovereign Southern State.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Help for Byzantium Campaign

    Guess what campaign I play now? Byzantium.
    For start, I play on savage VH/VH but with Latin Empire submod. I do it many times this, but now I wanted something different. How different? Lets say like this, forget about Constantinopole. Madness you say. Is not madness. Constantinopole in hands of Latin Empire acts like Jerusalim for crusaders, I mean Cannons of Holy Sepulcre. Plus near Nicea is the control stack of Seljuks. Add to that no siphonatores, just some varegians, latinikon and light cavalry.
    My plan, lose Niccea, put turks and litins in a conflict situation, keep some footholds so comeback can be posible and run. Were? To England. Sounds funny, intresting and of course a weird aproach.
    First, I start the plan, all Niccea garison was embark to ships. Ships are a lot for start. Than go south and get the Smirna co-emperor. Remember, Atanaoi is the best cavalry available at this point. Turn 1 turks occupied Niccea. Cannalkale stand for to sieges against latins before fall. Smirna with only 2 contaroi units plus one toxotai fall in first siege. Dalmatia fall in hands of Venice from first strike. I was the greakoXtreme with 2 castles, Arta and Trepizont and the Basileus, his heir, the general of Dalmatia, the Archopulai from there, 1 latinikon, 1 light cavalry, some contaroi and toxotai, plus acrites, in a dromon/fireships fleet near Gibraltar, heading to lands of english huskarls. Time is 1236 when greek army arive at Winchester.
    At Trebizont I face 1 siege from a terible turk army. After that, the Trebizont was a turk trap. Any army send near that castle diseapear. Because I belive in chilvary, I always release the pagans soldiers.
    For Arta was a different story, latins are much stronger storm troopers than turks. They maded there 4 sieges in 12 years. My only advantage was I recruit everything, from acontistae, toxotai, scutatoi, murtatoi, contaroi, acrites, anything, even mercenaries. Arta was my remaining capital. If Arta fall is no come back in Greacia.
    Venice atack that position just once. They lose Dalmatia to Hungary. Hungary, my biggest worry for all campaign, the kingdom who always have an empire from Oleshe to Wienna, save me once atacking a stack of latins when my garison was not even a quarter of my enemy. After that they will siege Arta many times...losing.
    Back to emperor. The trip to north lands of axemans and longbows, took 13 years. First I wonder what if I go to Ireland and take the castle from there. I pushed forward, why not Winchester? Castle near Exeter, London and Nothingam, is posible with luck to take one of this and set a strong foothold.

    The siege work great. The Basileus get control of the english castle with a small garison and send heir to London to blitz the english capital. A reinforcement army was crushed under my latinikon horse, plus the scytion added from the steppe was an inspirated choice. Even Archopulai get 3 silver chevrons. Was a heroic victory, and I start to guess this will be easy. After I release the prisoniers, a new stack of english come to help London. Defeating 2 armys before, empty my lines so I was forced to retreat. Next choice was embarking, recruit mercenaries and scavange a easy target. This add my heir to the far north in Scotland. Iverness was not a easy battle, outnumbered and facing two armys, but in the end, with more welsh, irish and scottish troops than hellen, I took the castle and plan the future.
    Future for 20 years was very simple, 4 castles, in England, Scotland, south of Pontus Euxinus, plus my capital in greek lands, always sieged, always outnumbered, and in my colonies with unrest of population.
    Instead to make me to accept the cruel fate, I start planing again. My plan was briliant. Watch with spy what happens in Marmara, keep merchant and priest there and sneak for a swift strike to the Jewel City.
    So Latin Empire, Turks and Hungary fight like mads. Latins get to Wallachia, Kiev push back Hungary and Genova, and turkish armys kill anything they can to secure Smyrna. From Trpizont to Constantinopole a fleet can come in 2 yaers full of troops. When I siege The City, the horse archers was so many, not even a crusding army of latins and a strong garison of elite troops cant stop me. I took the romanoi former capital and I prepare for long term war.
    The Constantinopolean war was a nightmare. First choice was to add many infantry posible to face both catolics and islam. Fate smile me and turks let Niccea undefended. Sometime luck is important. From balista towers to cannon towers and than the imperial baracks, I needed to face 3 hungarian armies, 5 from latin catholics and 1 from turks. When I start to think any other fronts can be deal much easier than Constantinopolean wars, Ayyubid dinasty hit me calling a jihad. Even mongols took Bagdad, eliminating Persia, even turks and mameluks fight at Iconium, Cesarea and Adana, I knowed a big storm coming. Horse archers was deployed near Niccea to face islamic agresion away. They destroyed 3 jihad armies. Assasins have full day jobs, still the green flag of Jihad continue.
    If I took Aberdeen, even Arta was the El Dorado of crows, even Winchester was a no pass for english armies, what happend near Holy City was very concerning. At the end, the Jihad add near my huge walls, 3 ayybid armies with 4 generals, 1 moorish and 1 turkish. Two more jifad armies was at way. Siege start, and even with magdonel and trebuchet, cannon towers, some castophilakean infantry, murtadoi, and many contaroi and toxotai I know it, is a no win situation. With only 1 mameluk general living, the 3 stacks siege Constantinopole at once. The fight was bloody. At Saint Roman gate I crush the egyptian army. Totally. At Eastern Gate I manage to hold them with my magdonel and few infantry. From west the ayyubids outnumber me with arab infantry and mercenary persian cavalry. I lose The City in a lake of muslim blood, sending to Allah tree times more troops than Crist martyrs. But was not enough. Took me 6 years to retook the city and keep it.

    At the end, the empire situation look like this, Romanoi Basileus send his taxes from Iverness, Aberdeen and Edingborough. Scottland moved to Lowlands of Flander. England is now in panic, because hellend took Nothingam, York and Winchester. London and Exeter have huge garisons plus 2-3 armies like suport. But thir time is short. In Greece from Arta we jump to Mystras, and Athens. In North and far in Macedonia is hard to go, but we have patience. After Constantinopole and Niccea, the Romanoi Empire took under control Sinop, Ankara and Iconium. Turks are cuted in half in Anatolia, pressed by mongols in east and ayyubids in south. We lose some bloody battles, but we won some amazing victories. The Empire rebirth is maded in blood.

    Kill Them All, Let God Sort Them Out!


  14. #14
    Tears of Destiny's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Help for Byzantium Campaign

    Splendi, well done my good sir! I would give rep, but I have spent my daily allowance.

  15. #15
    Ryou's Avatar Biarchus
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    Default Re: Help for Byzantium Campaign

    Thank guys!! Concrete, I have no idea how you did that.......tactica genius or something YOu deserve a 1000 +rps (as with MOST of you guys)
    Um I'm using 6.3, butnot sure why mine have war declared with turks and Venice as the same time, just installed it 5 days ago.


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  16. #16
    Tears of Destiny's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Help for Byzantium Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryou View Post
    Thank guys!! Concrete, I have no idea how you did that.......tactica genius or something YOu deserve a 1000 +rps (as with MOST of you guys)
    Um I'm using 6.3, butnot sure why mine have war declared with turks and Venice as the same time, just installed it 5 days ago.
    Did you install the latest fixes or better yet the Meneth's Sub-Mod Compilation? That might fix it, I think.

  17. #17
    Concrete's Avatar Semisalis
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    Default Re: Help for Byzantium Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryou View Post
    Thank guys!! Concrete, I have no idea how you did that.......tactica genius or something YOu deserve a 1000 +rps (as with MOST of you guys)
    Um I'm using 6.3, butnot sure why mine have war declared with turks and Venice as the same time, just installed it 5 days ago.
    Thanks a bunch.
    I like to think I'm quite good at Total War games, but I'm far from amazing.
    From what I've gathered from the late era Byzantium campaign, is that if an oppurtunity arises, you should take it.
    And that you should attack when it's possible to win, not wait for a better time.
    Apart from that, it's simply a matter of finding a risk and taking it, hoping that a little bit of skill and a lot of luck will take over.

    I was really lucky with the Turks not attacking me as much as they could have, and the incredible way in which I won that battle of Durazzo.
    I messed up at Trebizond though, not only did I forget about it for two turns or so, but during the assault, when I had one, I ordered my general to chase down as many soldiers as he could.
    buuuut, I forgot about my stakes I placed infront of the gate.

    Best of luck with your campaign.


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