Why in Islam.......?

[Armenum]

A religious question. Why in Islam is it alright for Muslim men to marry non-Muslim women (given they follow Christianity or Judaism, to my knowledge) however it is strictly forbidden for Muslim women to marry non-Muslim men? What's the historical/religious reason behind this?

[Del Valle]

Patriarchal society meant teaching and spreading of Allah's word through offspring?

[Armenum]

What if the wife converted to the husband's religion? Because if a Muslim man marries a non-Muslim women, the women converts to Islam.

[Khassaki]

What if the wife converted to the husband's religion? Because if a Muslim man marries a non-Muslim women, the women converts to Islam.

The woman would usually be murdered as an adulterer even if her husband had divorced her or she was a widow. Her only other state would be as a daughter in which the father would murder her for impinging on the family honour. The above is of course a mixture of cultural baggage mixed in with their religious beliefs which the average muslim is too stupid to separate. In areas were there is less cultural baggage, like Bosnia, intermarriage does not usually result in anybody dying. My best friend at uni was a Bosnian muslim woman married to a serbian man. There families had close ties though business, which is how they met, so there wasn't any particular backlash from the marriage (which was though a registrar).

[athanaric]

Conversion to another religion isn't taken into account, nor is it a desired effect. After all, that would be against the nature of any religion or ideology. Hence it's a good idea to leave the legal organization of society to secular institutions.

[Marcus Publius]

Conversion to another religion isn't taken into account, nor is it a desired effect. After all, that would be against the nature of any religion or ideology. Hence it's a good idea to leave the legal organization of society to secular institutions.

What do you mean conversion not desired effect.It is what every religion and ideology seeks.

[athanaric]

What do you mean conversion not desired effect.It is what every religion and ideology seeks.

I mean conversion from Islam to another religion. Same applies for Christianity. Have you ever heard of official Christian rules that allow Christians to convert to something else? Of course, it's tolerated. But not sanctioned.

[Ältester der Motten]

What do you mean conversion not desired effect.It is what every religion and ideology seeks.

Except Judaism.

And whats the traditional punishment?

In some Sura it states that people who shift back and forth several times:

"I'm not a Muslim anymore!

Oh nevermind, I'm back again!

Oh no, I'm not so sure, I think I'd try something different!

Oh hey there, it's me again!

Ah no, nevermind, I don't like it!"

should be done with (i.e. death penalty, beheading if I remember correctly), but I forgot the exact reasoning. I think it was wartime stuff though, maybe something with traitors or spies. At least that's what you could gather if you took the translation I avhe and took this literal then. What exactly is said in the original -and what is meant-, I do not know.


Other than that I do not remember any punishment for infidelity being mandated in the Qur-an.

[Armenum]

Conversion to another religion isn't taken into account, nor is it a desired effect. After all, that would be against the nature of any religion or ideology. Hence it's a good idea to leave the legal organization of society to secular institutions.

What about the women retaining her religion (Islam) and the man retaining his non Islam faith. And the kids being raised Muslim? Then is it still such a big problem? I'm trying to gauge is the problem in the potential conversion or is it a more moralistic view that Muslim women have to marry Muslim men no matter what.

Care to provide the passages from Quran? Or are you talking about various Middle Eastern cultures or Arabic culture to be specific?

Muslim societies in general I would say.

Here's a quote that I found:

And give not (your daughters) in marriage to
Al-Mushrikun** till they
believe in Allah alone and verily a believing slave is better
than a (free) Mushrik, even though he pleases you....[2:221] **
Al-Mushrikun=>Pagans, idolators, polytheist and disbelievers in
the Oneness of Allah and in His messanger Prophet Muhammad SAW)
- [[6]]

Islam considers the husband head-of-the-family and therefore
requires that a Muslima cannot marry a non-Muslim because she
will be under the authority of a non-muslim husband. He may
prevent her from carrying out her religious obligations by
either pressuring her or physically abusing her. But it is not
the sole reason for imposing the restriction. The situation is
considered very damaging for the woman to practise Islam
afterwards and even worse for the kids in such marriages. There
are NO conditions mentioned under which a Muslim woman IS
allowed to get married or remain married to a non-Muslim husband
after she has accepted Islam. Therefore, even if she has freedom
to practise Islam after marriage, she is NOT allowed to enter
into an inter-faith marriage.

[athanaric]

What about the women retaining her religion (Islam) and the man retaining his non Islam faith. And the kids being raised Muslim? Then is it still such a big problem? I'm trying to gauge is the problem in the potential conversion or is it a more moralistic view that Muslim women have to marry Muslim men no matter what.

Well there's theory and there's reality. In theory, it's not allowed for a Muslim woman to marry a non-Muslim man - unless he converts to Islam IIRC (which does happen now and then). I can hardly imagine that the religious rules would allow a Muslim woman to have non-Muslim children.
In reality, you'll find cases of Muslim women happily integrating with "infidels", usually solving the religion issue by having the kids decide what they want to be. Though these cases are rarer than I'd like them to be.

[Armenum]

Well there's theory and there's reality. In theory, it's not allowed for a Muslim woman to marry a non-Muslim man - unless he converts to Islam IIRC (which does happen now and then). I can hardly imagine that the religious rules would allow a Muslim woman to have non-Muslim children.
In reality, you'll find cases of Muslim women happily integrating with "infidels", usually solving the religion issue by having the kids decide what they want to be. Though these cases are rarer than I'd like them to be.

This applies to all cultures? I mean what would be the problem of a muslim arab women marrying let's say a christian arab man?

I find this restriction more a way to prevent a demographic problem than anything else.

[PointOfViewGun]

Muslim societies in general I would say.

Here's a quote that I found:

If you read the verse fully it doesn't strictly forbid neither women nor men to marry non-Muslims men or women. It simply says it's better not to merry them for both men and women. So with respect to Islam, what you say doesn't hold true, unless you have other verses to bring forth of course.

[Armenum]

If you read the verse fully it doesn't strictly forbid neither women nor men to marry non-Muslims men or women. It simply says it's better not to merry them for both men and women. So with respect to Islam, what you say doesn't hold true, unless you have other verses to bring forth of course.

It may not be directly forbidden in the Qoran, but it's definitely a taboo in Muslim society, and a rather strict one I must say.

[PointOfViewGun]

It may not be directly forbidden in the Qoran, but it's definitely a taboo in Muslim society, and a rather strict one I must say.

It's as much of a taboo as for people from any other religion. Saying it's a much more of a taboo for Muslim societies specifically is rather false. Is it strictly forbidden in Islam? Not really. Is it it strictly forbidden in certain conservative societies? Yes. It doesn't kill to be accurate, does it?

[Dr. Croccer]

It may not be directly forbidden in the Qoran, but it's definitely a taboo in Muslim society, and a rather strict one I must say.

To be fair, marrying outside of most religions is deemed taboo. Devout Jews are highly endogamous, and in Christianity marrying to heretics was enough to shun and disown people untill very recently. Up untill the 70s pillarisation in my country was immense, one example from my own family was a Calvinist declaring that he'd rather have his daughter marry a negro than a Catholic.

[Caliph]

What about the women retaining her religion (Islam) and the man retaining his non Islam faith. And the kids being raised Muslim? Then is it still such a big problem? I'm trying to gauge is the problem in the potential conversion or is it a more moralistic view that Muslim women have to marry Muslim men no matter what.

Hi Lord Mov,
I've actually asked this very question a few times when I was growing up. The answer I always got was that because the husband tradationally has more say on what religion he wants his children to follow then it is permissable for him to marry a christian or a jew. However a muslim woman cannot marry a jew or a christian if we are using the same logic as it would mean the children won't be muslim

Though as you put it, if the non-muslim husband would promise to allow the children to be raised muslim then the imam sanctioning the marriage faces a dillema as the reasoning behind the prohbition is eliminated.

So if it is all about how the kids are raised as I understand it, then a non-muslim (christian or jew only) can marry a muslim woman should he be able to guarantee the children will be raised muslim.

[Phier]

A religious question. Why in Islam is it alright for Muslim men to marry non-Muslim women (given they follow Christianity or Judaism, to my knowledge) however it is strictly forbidden for Muslim women to marry non-Muslim men? What's the historical/religious reason behind this?

Because when you have a society which allows multiple wives, and there is a 50-50 sex ratio, odds are some are going without, and most definitely without 'extras'.

Then when you conquer peoples who are non-Muslim you have all these women at your disposal.

So as a spoil of war you allow the marriage of non-Muslim women to Muslim men.

Needless to say it doesn't go the other way.

[Elfdude]

Because when you have a society which allows multiple wives, and there is a 50-50 sex ratio, odds are some are going without, and most definitely without 'extras'.

Then when you conquer peoples who are non-Muslim you have all these women at your disposal.

So as a spoil of war you allow the marriage of non-Muslim women to Muslim men.

Needless to say it doesn't go the other way.

This.

[PointOfViewGun]

A religious question. Why in Islam is it alright for Muslim men to marry non-Muslim women (given they follow Christianity or Judaism, to my knowledge) however it is strictly forbidden for Muslim women to marry non-Muslim men? What's the historical/religious reason behind this?

Care to provide the passages from Quran? Or are you talking about various Middle Eastern cultures or Arabic culture to be specific?

[thelionheart]

because in general people used to follow their father's relegion and live where their fathers' lived (christian or muslim territories) So I guess it was all about kids. But Islam Also "hates" a muslim's marriage to a non muslim.