Drilling in Alaska

[Templedog]

As usual with Republicans intrest of their big oil buddies are coming first over the welfare of the Country and the enviroment.Instead of spending money to advanced proven alternatives (Natural gas,Ethanol,hydrogen) Republicans want to suck Alaska dry of it's oil. It has become a huge joke that in the 21st Century we still are using fuel technology from the 19th Century just to make the oil companies happy. Of course Conservatives don't care about what will happen to the wildlife or the enviroment in Alaska.

did anyone see this documentary? http://www.grizzlymanmovie.com/grizzly.html

[ShangTang]

Do you have any evidence that drilling will cause the environment harm?

[Templedog]

Yeah, It's why we have National Wildlife Refuges and endangered species.\

Habitat destruction effects the wildlife. Roads alone kill alot of wildlife.

[Clibby]

Would you rather we get our oil from abroud and import it from other countries around the world than drill for it on our own land? I say that if we have the resourses why don't we use them. Everyone complains that we are too dependent on Middle Eastern oil, so why do they fight the companies trying to drill for oil within our own country. If done correctly there will only be a minor if not insignificant impact on the enviornment while securing oil that our country so desperately needs. I say lets drill for the oil, but lets do it in a smart way.

[Templedog]

Well, I wouldn't mind paying 5 bucks/gallon. Bush tells us he supports new energy, but yet we crack Alaska open. Toyota is the #1 car manufacturer. lol

wrong direction.

[vizi]

I also wouldn't mind paying 5 bucks a gallon. I would just drive less which isn't a problem at all. Besides I have a vehicle that may only get ~10 MPG but its worth it to me since I enjoy the car. Honestly gas prices don't bother me at all. They bother all my friends though....and they have civics and lancers to my truck and carburated camaro.

[Clibby]

Just beacuse we are developing new energy sources doesn't mean we no longer need the old one.

[vizi]

The biggest consumer of petroluem for cars is auto racing. Should we elminate auto racing? Or is that going to far. I can say I wouldn't miss open wheel racing or stock car for the most part. But Sprint and Outlaw are a lot of fun to watch. And drag racing while fun is also a huge waste. But w/o these sports people would do them on the streets.

What do you think, abolish auto racing to save fuel? Or not?

[Seleukos]

The biggest consumer of petroluem for cars is auto racing.

Most series run on Methenol.

Should we elminate auto racing?

Over my dead body.

Or is that going to far.

Yes.

I can say I wouldn't miss open wheel racing or stock car for the most part.

I would definately not miss stock car racing, but open wheel is the best kind. Formula 1 and CART are the best you can see. Most entertaining by far. Rally comes close.

What do you think, abolish auto racing to save fuel? Or not?

Not.

[Casanova]

Well, I wouldn't mind paying 5 bucks/gallon. Bush tells us he supports new energy, but yet we crack Alaska open. Toyota is the #1 car manufacturer. lol

wrong direction.

I know that you were exaggerating when you said you wouldnt mind paying 5 dollars a gallon for gasoline, but do you understand how much the price of fuel affects the economy? Every single item you buy is directly affected by the cost of petrolium. Our entire civilization is dependent upon oil and fossil fuels. You cannot just think of the price increase at the pumps when you say you dont mind paying 5 dollars a gallon for gasoline.

I dont understand why so many people protest drilling in a place that they will never see in their lifetimes (alaska). Why dont you ask the alaskans what they think about drilling in their state?
Alaska's citizens and Indian population have overwhelmingly supported drilling in the tundra. Study after studay has even shown that pipelines have done nothing but help the wild life species.

[Templedog]

I dont understand why so many people protest drilling in a place that they will never see in their lifetimes (alaska). Why dont you ask the alaskans what they think about drilling in their state?
Alaska's citizens and Indian population have overwhelmingly supported drilling in the tundra. Study after studay has even shown that pipelines have done nothing but help the wild life species.

the whole idea is to keep people out.

[Templedog]

Yes it does. Environmental issues alone tell us we do. There is a reason the "old" one, being oil is still being used. Because it's a money issue, not a developing issue. The technology is there, but there is an oiled backed administration in the white house. We will be spending all our money on oil, while japan will be driving around in efficient clean cars. Didn't everyones father pride themselves on american made cars? Now it is shameless. I love giving my money to foreign businesses. How patriotic is that? I guess I am a liberal terrorist sympathiser, so I will buy foreign.

You can't just ban oil. You need to tax the hell out of oil to create change.

[Zuwxiv]

Let's see, there is a hydrogen fuel cell motorcycle available in 2006 that will have greater range than most motorcycles today, capable of riding on freeways, and only 6k (USD).

Meanwhile, you could buy some solar cells and an electrolysis aparatus that could supply you with free hydrogen to use. As if water is that expensive.

I'm also currently seeking a patent for my hydrogen fuell cell idea. I won't give anything away, but if it works, ... Lets just say oil won't be a problem. Point being, even if it doesn't work (most lilkely) then we will still have more and more effecient fuel cells.

[Sétanta]

i say screw the environment right now. its alaska and frozen 94% of the year anywho

we need the oil after all

[Clibby]

There are people who, even given the newer technology, woulldn't be able to afford it. Plus we have hollywood which popularized the gigantic SUVs which are unnessisary for your average person and wouldn't want a smaller more efficient car. Cleaner technology is available (i.e. hybrids and prototype hydrogen powered cars), but is still too expensive for most people to afford. Plus, like toyota has advertized 85% of Corollas made since 1985 are still on the road. People don't just buy new cars when a new one comes out, its too expenssive. Plus its not just cars that need oil. Where do you think plastic comes from? I know we could not live the way we do without plastic.

EDIT: I just read up on the new bikes and I like the idea, but will everyone else? And will that be powerful enough to replace the trucks that ship our cargo around the country? I know gasoline couldn't. And what about cars? How far off are we from hydrogen cars, not bikes? Also the availability of re-fills could be an initial problem, but I think that can be solved. I'm not against the new technology at all, but I am trying to prove that we still need oil, mabey not for gasoline, but oil is used for a heck of alot more than just gasoline.

[Kino]

Deleted by user.

[Rush Limbaugh]

Yeah, It's why we have National Wildlife Refuges and endangered species.\

How does that prove drilling in alaska will harm the enviorment there?

Bye the way the endangered species act is a dismal failure. How many species have actually been saved two?

Toyota is the #1 car manufacturer. lol

I dont think so. GM is still number one though Toyota has incresed production as to try to pass them. It is getting close.

You can't just ban oil. You need to tax the hell out of oil to create change.

Spoken like a true liberal. So raising the price through taxation and giving it to the government is ok but if the oil companies raise their prices their greedy bastards and hurting america. Does the word hypocricy come to mind here. The market will take care of these things. Keep the damn government out of it. When oil grows so scarce that the price becomes prohibitive or more costly than the alternative it will cease to be used and not before then. Theres plenty of oil left for quite sometime. Its only the cost of getting it that keeps going up .

The biggest consumer of petroluem for cars is auto racing.

You will find no bigger racing enthusiast here than I but I very much doubt your claim. They mostly only run on weekends and they represent only a small fraction of the milage run up by cars on this planet . Some dont even run on petrol at all. They do in general get terrible milage however.

[Erik]

Spoken like a true liberal. So raising the price through taxation and giving it to the government is ok but if the oil companies raise their prices their greedy bastards and hurting america. Does the word hypocricy come to mind here.

Yeah, all the government wil do with the money is build schoold and hospitals, or reduce other forms of tax.
Better give it to big oil companies so they can pay more divident to forreign investors.

The market will take care of these things.

It wil, but this wil also happen if the government puts some tax onto it.

By not taxing oil you keep it's price low and that's why Americans waste so much of it.
Of course this waste means more import, which means a bigger trade deficit, which means problems in the future.
But why would you care? your old. :wink:

[Francisco Montana]

Yeah, all the government wil do with the money is build schoold and hospitals, or reduce other forms of tax.
Better give it to big oil companies so they can pay more divident to forreign investors.



It wil, but this wil also happen if the government puts some tax onto it.

By not taxing oil you keep it's price low and that's why Americans waste so much of it.
Of course this waste means more import, which means a bigger trade deficit, which means problems in the future.
But why would you care? your old. :wink:

And some people wonder why they have 13% unemployment.

I feel you with my heart, Erik, as usual. But my head says 'waste' 'waste' 'waste'. The private sector can do a better job and do it at half the rate. Just get out of her way. That's all it requires.

Liberty and Morality.

Nothing in the history of mankind has produced more jobs.

It's the 'morality part' we've been slipping on. You don't need to goto church to know that, either.

Ok, now I've lost myself. But there is a juicey grain of truth somewhere in this post, I'm sure of it.




(For those who have missed my tone on this thread, I'm one of the evil neo-con instect drones who may have voted with the center on this and agreed to wait 20-30 years. Our tech will be better and cleaner, and the oil itself will be worth more. Those republicans who want to hang the members who voted ANWAR drilling down --for now. Remember, back room negotiations really only said, "we'll put if off for a decade or two". Nothing more, nothing less. Considering there are tribes numbering 7,000 or so people (seems small to us, but they are still indiginous, and we wouldn't want to really ruin their environment in the name of saving a little cash at the pump.) We can wait, for now.

See ya in 2030.

[Rush Limbaugh]

Yup its a case of pay me now or pay me later. Either way its the oil companies who win.