Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 47

Thread: Ukraine ponders East or West

Hybrid View

Previous Post Previous Post   Next Post Next Post
  1. #1

    Default Ukraine ponders East or West

    An interesting article by Euronews regarding Ukraine, and its positioning between east and west. It was expected after the election of Yanukovich that Ukraine would mend relations with Russia and diverge from a pro-West path that it was on before. It seems that this diversion has happened rather quickly as Ukraine is also annoyed with EU in not giving them a proper timetable. May other post-Soviet countries which are disillusioned with the West and EU make a similar reversal? In this case Russia has a lot to offer Ukraine, and coupled with the frustration with the West the reversal is predicted, but in what other countries could this happen? It's interesting that Belarus on one hand seems to be cooling its relations with Russia and Ukraine having the opposite effect.

    http://www.euronews.net/2010/10/08/u...-east-or-west/

    In 1945, the World War II allied leaders met at Livadia Palace in Yalta, to establish a new world order.
    For the last seven years, the same Crimean city in Ukraine has hosted European politicians, economists and others for the “Yalta European Strategy” set up to promote democratic values and Ukraine’s possible EU membership.
    This year it focused on the question: Should Ukraine should move East or West?
    Addressing Western policymakers, President Victor Yanukovich said he regretted the slow progress there has been in moving closer to the European Union: “Ukraine has no alternative to choosing Europe, but as the EU is not ready to even discuss Ukraine’s membership, we will choose our own ways and methods of integration, according to our own national interests.”
    The EU refuses to give Kiev a clear timetable for when it might join.
    For the moment, Brussels is talking only about an Association Agreement.
    The European Commissioner for Enlargement, Stefan Füle, explained what is going on: “We have, at the beginning of October, a meeting of our negotiators. This is a very complex agreement, this is not just about free trade. This agreement is offering Ukraine access to the internal market of the European Union. We need to be aware about the value added of that deal, the pluses and minuses for each side.”
    While Brussels considers the first steps towards integration, Ukraine and Russia have reconciled since Viktor Yanukovich was elected president.
    In September, Yanukovich and Russia’s President Medvedev took part in a vintage car rally on their border, symbolising the thaw in relations after five years of tensions.
    This year Moscow sent a substantial delegation to the Yalta gathering.
    Russian Finance Minister Alexei Kudrin told euronews of progress in bilateral relations in various areas.
    He said: “I have already said that we have invited Ukraine to take part in the Eurasian Economic Community Crisis Fund. If Ukraine were to join the fund, in general terms, it would be able to receive aid. Moreover, as Russia’s representative to the IMF, I have made efforts to persuade the IMF to provide loans to Ukraine.”
    In the energy sector, Ukraine, however, would like Europeans – rather than Russians – to modernise and help run the transit system that takes Russian gas to Europe.
    The Europeans are reluctant. British expert Alan Riley, from City University London explained why: “One of the difficulties for Ukraine, is why would the Europeans invest in it, if we can get gas from LNG (Liquefied Natural Gas), from shale, we can get gas from Norway, through Northstream and Yamal One, what it the case for gas through Ukraine? It’s less about transit than the Ukrainians developing their own, very significant, gas resources and selling their gas into the European market.”
    On the East v West question – Ukrainian decision makers say there are more urgent priorities than “choosing sides.”
    What does Viktor Pinchuk – the organiser of the Yalta gathering – think?
    “We need to implement reforms that we need in any case. Once we carry out those reforms, we’ll be moving along the right track and we will be needed by everyone, and then we’ll be able to choose who we want to be with.”
    But right now Ukraine is reliant on IMF loans, which will only continue if there is progress in cutting government spending to bring the fiscal deficit under control.
    Copyright © 2010 euronews
    [ Under Patronage of Jom ]
    [ "For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also." Matthew 6:21 ]

  2. #2

    Default Re: Ukraine ponders East or West

    Why choose, surely best thing is to balance and get best of both worlds.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Ukraine ponders East or West

    Quote Originally Posted by nemgod View Post
    Why choose, surely best thing is to balance and get best of both worlds.
    That's called appeasement and usually works best for smaller and weaker countries. For example, Armenia follows such a foreign policy. Ukraine right now is very polarised, there's a lack of "middle ground" and thus it's more of a see-saw between east and west.
    [ Under Patronage of Jom ]
    [ "For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also." Matthew 6:21 ]

  4. #4
    Salem1's Avatar Campidoctor
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Stockholm, Sweden
    Posts
    1,792

    Default Re: Ukraine ponders East or West



    Russia isn't the east, it's part of the west although a fringe one and too large to be just another country. But it sure as hell isn't the east.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Ukraine ponders East or West

    Quote Originally Posted by Salem1 View Post


    Russia isn't the east, it's part of the west although a fringe one and too large to be just another country. But it sure as hell isn't the east.
    Used to be pretty clearly the west, but after the elections its been warming up to Russia and been frustrated with the West. It's hard to say if an official "transition" has occurred but definitely they are not staunchly pro-West any-more...
    [ Under Patronage of Jom ]
    [ "For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also." Matthew 6:21 ]

  6. #6
    Salem1's Avatar Campidoctor
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Stockholm, Sweden
    Posts
    1,792

    Default Re: Ukraine ponders East or West

    You don't get it, I was saying Russia is part of the west although a fringe member of it. But now that I think about it, it occurs to me that what I meant was that Russia is part of Europe. What I meant to say was that Russia may not be part of the west but it definitely isn't ''the east'' and shouldn't be refered to as such but rather as Russia.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Ukraine ponders East or West

    Quote Originally Posted by Salem1 View Post
    You don't get it, I was saying Russia is part of the west although a fringe member of it. But now that I think about it, it occurs to me that what I meant was that Russia is part of Europe. What I meant to say was that Russia may not be part of the west but it definitely isn't ''the east'' and shouldn't be refered to as such but rather as Russia.
    I'm referring to the stereotypical West/Nato vs. Russia/CSTO division, which may go back to the cold war but till today is still not outdated. This is the division that the article also refers to also and the division that is used to label post-Soviet nations. Suprsiningly enough though, Russia isn't that warm with the EU, at least in the political sphere.
    [ Under Patronage of Jom ]
    [ "For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also." Matthew 6:21 ]

  8. #8
    Jaketh's Avatar Praeses
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    8,973

    Default Re: Ukraine ponders East or West

    Ukraine is part of Russia, only makes sense for it to be pro Russian

  9. #9

    Default Re: Ukraine ponders East or West

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaketh View Post
    Ukraine is part of Russia, only makes sense for it to be pro Russian
    Uhm, not if you ask Ukrainians.

  10. #10
    Jaketh's Avatar Praeses
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    8,973

    Default Re: Ukraine ponders East or West

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Jin View Post
    Uhm, not if you ask Ukrainians.
    the Ukraine has been part of Russia since the 1700's why the hell did they seperate in the first place?

  11. #11
    Nouvelle Vague's Avatar Ducenarius
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    903

    Default Re: Ukraine ponders East or West

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaketh View Post
    the Ukraine has been part of Russia since the 1700's why the hell did they seperate in the first place?
    Because they're not Russian... They've traditionally been culturally and ethnically independent for a long time. Why did they separate? Because the Soviet Union was a union of many different ethnic eastern European states, who had for times in the past been independent or not given a chance to be. For the same reason you wouldn't consider the English and Scottish to be the same people, unless you're truly ignorant.

    Formerly Tiberias

  12. #12

    Default Re: Ukraine ponders East or West

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Jin View Post
    Uhm, not if you ask Ukrainians.
    Depends which Ukraininas you'd ask. Western Ukrainians would be pro Western, Eastern would be pro-Russian.
    Quote Originally Posted by Frederich Barbarossa View Post
    I disagree that Ukraine is part of Russia, it has its own language for god sake. Its like saying Kosovo is a part of Serbia and Quebec a part of Canada, and look whats happening.
    Quebec is a part of Canada.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Ukraine ponders East or West

    Any "west or east" crap is retarded. The previous government were corrupt scum that were bought by the US.

    Now Ukraine will remain in its proper place, i.e. a quiet Eastern European country that is dependant on Russia, but has decent ties with W. European nations.

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Jin View Post
    Uhm, not if you ask Ukrainians.
    Please don't post garbage. Vast majority of Ukrainians are not the radical ultra-nationalists that whine the hardest (these ultra-nationalists who glorify Nazism, racism and a "free Ukraine" etc are also usually poor and uneducated bydlos).

  14. #14

    Default Re: Ukraine ponders East or West

    Quote Originally Posted by Kirov123 View Post

    Please don't post garbage. Vast majority of Ukrainians are not the radical ultra-nationalists that whine the hardest (these ultra-nationalists who glorify Nazism, racism and a "free Ukraine" etc are also usually poor and uneducated bydlos).
    Wtf are you talking about? That has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not Ukrainians consider themselves a part of Russia or not.

    Depends which Ukraininas you'd ask. Western Ukrainians would be pro Western, Eastern would be pro-Russian.
    I'm not talking about pro-east or west I'm talking about his remarks saying that Ukraine is part of Russia.
    Last edited by Captain Jin; October 09, 2010 at 06:10 PM.

  15. #15
    MAXlMUS's Avatar Decanus
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    roman empire
    Posts
    507

    Default Re: Ukraine ponders East or West

    this whole east west thing is becoming more and more irrelevant

  16. #16

    Default Re: Ukraine ponders East or West

    Quote Originally Posted by MAXlMUS View Post
    this whole east west thing is becoming more and more irrelevant
    that's true, and I hope in the coming years this outdated cold war mentality will be abolished forever.
    [ Under Patronage of Jom ]
    [ "For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also." Matthew 6:21 ]

  17. #17
    Frederich Barbarossa's Avatar Protector Domesticus
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Edinburgh, Scotland (From Kendall, Florida and proud!)
    Posts
    4,348

    Default Re: Ukraine ponders East or West

    I disagree that Ukraine is part of Russia, it has its own language for god sake. Its like saying Kosovo is a part of Serbia and Quebec a part of Canada, and look whats happening.
    His highness, þeþurn I, Keng of Savomyr!

  18. #18
    Jaketh's Avatar Praeses
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    8,973

    Default Re: Ukraine ponders East or West

    Quote Originally Posted by Frederich Barbarossa View Post
    I disagree that Ukraine is part of Russia, it has its own language for god sake. Its like saying Kosovo is a part of Serbia and Quebec a part of Canada, and look whats happening.
    There are dozens of areas in Russia that dont speak Russian, doesnt mean they are not part of Russia, im seriously interested in what caused the seperation (and FYI quebec sucks)

  19. #19
    MAXlMUS's Avatar Decanus
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    roman empire
    Posts
    507

    Default Re: Ukraine ponders East or West

    Quote Originally Posted by Frederich Barbarossa View Post
    I disagree that Ukraine is part of Russia, it has its own language for god sake. Its like saying Kosovo is a part of Serbia and Quebec a part of Canada, and look whats happening.
    russian and ukrainian are more like different dialects then differnet languages, much like norwegian /danish/swedish
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaketh View Post
    (and FYI quebec sucks)
    no you suck. québec is the best place on earth and the whole world envies us

  20. #20
    Jaketh's Avatar Praeses
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    8,973

    Default Re: Ukraine ponders East or West

    Quote Originally Posted by MAXlMUS View Post
    r

    no you suck. québec is the best place on earth and the whole world envies us
    no the entire world hates you, all my Ontario Canadian friends detest quebec
    Last edited by Jaketh; October 09, 2010 at 06:40 PM.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •