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Thread: How piety works and how to activate the alternative piety mode

  1. #1

    Default How piety works and how to activate the alternative piety mode

    Piety is a new attribute that was added into M2TW replacing the old Management of RTW/BI, in theory because it was more appropiate for a middle ages setting. In the same way other attributes were also changed, like influence which became chivalry/dread.

    This tutorial will focus on explaining how Piety exactly works in the game, and i will also explain how to activate the alternative piety mode that CA created for the brittania campaign in kingdoms.

    First, it is important to make a difference between two different types of characters that can have piety: the priest, and the general.

    Priests only have one attribute, which is piety. They use it to convert the population in the region to their religion, the more piety the priest have, the faster he is able to convert the region to your religion. When priests are recruited in high level religious buildings, they have more chances of starting with good traits and more pips in piety. I donīt know the exact conversion rates per each pip of piety, but i do think that the bigger the population the harder it is for the priest to convert the people.

    This tutorial focuses on generalīs piety, but i think it was adequate to explain also how it works for priests.

    Generals have many attributes, and one of them is piety. They gain piety by constructing religious buildings, for example. This is defined in the traits and ancillary sections which gives piety depending of the character actions in the game. Piety also affects the chances that your general may survive an encounter with a papal inquisitor, the higher the piety the better chances he has to survive.

    But piety also have more effects in the game, even if they are not so easy to see. Piety still works as the old management skill of RTW did, you could say that piety is just a renamed management, with a new icon and a few extra effects added for M2TW. This means, that the highest piety general will always be chosen as governor (you may remember that happening in RTW/BI), piety also improves the settlement income. More on that later.

    Unfortunately piety also has a problem, when you put a high piety general in charge of a province, whose religion is not 100% your own, he will cause religious unrest. Why? I guess that question should be asked to CA, my theory is that they did it to represent that a religious man on a city with other religion, will cause problems. So as odd as it sounds, if there is any other religion other than your own in your settlement, a high piety general will increase the religious unrest.

    This is a summary of how generalīs piety affect a settlement:

    -Increases income, by the administration pip, the increased income is taken from the corruption pip, if there is any.

    -Increases religious unrest, if the province has other religion other than your own.


    This is the standard piety mode, this is how it works in M2TW and in kingdoms, with the exception of britannia campaign. If you remember, in the britannia campaign there was no religion, but instead culture was used. Culture was the same thing as religion, the only difference was the change of name and icon. Management also seemed like the same, piety which had been renamed and changed the icon as well. But CA also added some things to it.

    They enabled a new mode for piety to works, designed for the britannia campaign. In this campaign, there are no priests and no piety, but instead there is management. For this reason, it didnīt make sense to have a high "management" (piety) general cause "unrest" (religious unrest) in a region with other "culture" (religion). CA created an alternative mode for piety to work, which is defined in the descr_campaign_db.xml file, inside the data folder.

    The code that enables this mode is the following
    Code:
     <settlement>
          <sack_money_modifier float="0.4"/>
          <exterminate_money_modifier float="0.5"/>
          <chiv_spf_modifier float="1.0"/>
          <chiv_sof_modifier float="1.0"/>
          <dread_sof_modifier float="-1.0"/>
          <piety_cor_sif_modifier float="1.0"/>
          <piety_admin_sif_modifier float="1.0"/>
          <port_to_port_mp_min float="100.0"/>
          <heresy_unrest_modifier float="30.0"/>
          <religion_unrest_modifier float="30.0"/>
          <siege_gear_required_for_city_level string="huge_city"/>
          <siege_gear_required_for_castle_level string="moot_and_bailey"/>
          <no_towers_only_for_city_level string="huge_city"/>
          <no_towers_only_for_castle_level string="moot_and_bailey"/>
          <min_turn_keep_rebel_garrison int="999"/>
          <destroy_empty_forts bool="false"/>
          <can_build_forts bool="false"/>
          <alternative_religious_unrest bool="true"/>        <!-- alternative settlement religious unrest calculations -->
          <alt_rel_allied_modifier float="0.5"/>            <!-- allied religion cumulative total modifier -->
          <alt_rel_gov_modifier_base float="2.0"/>            <!-- governors piety religion base modifier -->
          <alt_rel_gov_coefficient float="-0.2"/>            <!-- governors piety religion coefficient -->
       </settlement>
    This is the code from the britannia campaign, i highlighted the part that is important. If you want to activate it, add those lines to your file, and make sure that the line <alternative_religious_unrest bool="true"/>
    is set to "true". If you want to disable it, set it to "false" instead.
    The values under this line i have not tested, they are as in vanilla, but my guess is that they indicate how much piety is needed for the effect to appear. Basically they are variables, but i have not tested them other than using vanilla values.

    Now i will explain what is the difference between this mode, and the original, that i explained before. If you activate this mode, piety will work slightly differently if you place a character inside a settlement. Letīs see it with a summary as well, and for your convenience i will put both modes so you can easily compare them

    ORIGINAL PIETY, summary of how generalīs piety affect a settlement:

    -Increases income, by the administration pip, the increased income is taken from the corruption pip, if there is any.

    - Increases religious unrest, if the province has other religion other than your own.


    ALTERNATIVE PIETY MODE, summary of how generalīs piety affect a settlement:

    -Increases income, by the administration pip, the increased income is taken from the corruption pip, if there is any.

    - Decreases religious unrest, if the province has other religion other than your own.


    As you can see the difference is that with the alternative piety enabled, your generals wonīt increase religious unrest in a settlement with other religion present. Instead, they will reduce it. This can be useful if you plan to replace piety to management, as CA did in the britannia campaign, or simply if you donīt like that piety gives religious unrest and prefer how the alternative system works instead.

    I should note that in my testing this does not seem to affect priests, if you active the alternative piety, they still work the same, this only affects generals.

    I hope this tutorial was useful to you and if you have any questions feel free to ask.

    Credits
    Thanks to the members of the modding community (Taiji, Gigantus etc.) for their great help in resolving problems.
    Last edited by Hellenikon; October 07, 2010 at 11:11 AM.

  2. #2
    Gigantus's Avatar I am not special - I am a limited edition.
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    Default Re: How piety works and how to activate the alternative piety mode

    Nice finding, should come handy.










  3. #3
    /|\/|\/|\/|\/|\/|\/
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    Default Re: How piety works and how to activate the alternative piety mode

    Lot's of useful information and stuff I didn't know. Well explained

  4. #4

    Default Re: How piety works and how to activate the alternative piety mode

    Awesome! I have missed management so badly and thought it was beyond my capacities to bring it back! Turns out that it was only beyond my capacities to figure it out....
    Total War addict since the beginning.

  5. #5
    Campidoctor
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    Default Re: How piety works and how to activate the alternative piety mode

    Good find!


  6. #6
    Opifex
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    Default Re: How piety works and how to activate the alternative piety mode

    Amazing finding, big +rep.


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    and may posterity forget that ye were
    our countrymen."
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  7. #7
    _Tartaros_'s Avatar "Harzschütze"
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    Default Re: How piety works and how to activate the alternative piety mode

    kind of a necro, but itīs very usefull information and provide more understanding of the mechanics

  8. #8
    Jurand of Cracow's Avatar History and gameplay!
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    Default Re: How piety works and how to activate the alternative piety mode

    Quote Originally Posted by _Tartaros_ View Post
    kind of a necro, but itīs very usefull information and provide more understanding of the mechanics
    This is a very useful thread. Do you, @Tartaros, have more recent insights how the piety works in the Med2 engine?

  9. #9

    Default Re: How piety works and how to activate the alternative piety mode

    All of the current information we have about trait/ancillary attributes should be listed here.

  10. #10
    Jadli's Avatar The Fallen God
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    Default Re: How piety works and how to activate the alternative piety mode

    Good stuff, we need more threads exploring kingdoms features.

    I assume this is related to piety so Ill post my recent tiny finding for EDB here.

    The building capability (religion_level) doesnt need a building with temple_ prefix, nor the "religion catholic" part that goes along the temple line, setting what religion should it convert to. Without these, it simply converts to the religion of any current owner.

    So if someone needs to save building spots or simply being lazy to make a variant of church for each religion...

    Also, I saw somewhere other temple attribute, "amplify conversion" or whatever its called, cant find it now... how is the line and what exactly it does?

  11. #11

    Default Re: How piety works and how to activate the alternative piety mode

    You mean:
    amplify_religion_level

  12. #12

    Default Re: How piety works and how to activate the alternative piety mode

    Quote Originally Posted by Jadli View Post
    Also, I saw somewhere other temple attribute, "amplify conversion" or whatever its called, cant find it now... how is the line and what exactly it does?
    It modifies the modifiers, so to say. If you have a building that adds 20% to religious conversion and another building with "amplify conversion +50%" as a property, the total conversion rate will be 30% in the settlement.

  13. #13

    Default Re: How piety works and how to activate the alternative piety mode

    How did I go well over a decade of playing this game before learning that governor Piety affects settlement income? Here I've been entirely focused on ancillaries and retinue. Always something new to learn, I suppose...

  14. #14
    Gigantus's Avatar I am not special - I am a limited edition.
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    Default Re: How piety works and how to activate the alternative piety mode

    Well, it increases income by reducing religious unrest. The mere presence of a governor reduces general unrest already.










  15. #15
    Jurand of Cracow's Avatar History and gameplay!
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    Default Re: How piety works and how to activate the alternative piety mode

    Quote Originally Posted by Gigantus View Post
    Well, it increases income by reducing religious unrest. The mere presence of a governor reduces general unrest already.
    It does it because religious unrest provides for corruption, right? Or is there another channel?

  16. #16
    Gigantus's Avatar I am not special - I am a limited edition.
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    Default Re: How piety works and how to activate the alternative piety mode

    That is my impression. It does certainly effect the level of taxation, eg how high it can be set. There are only a few direct multiplier in descr_settlement_mechanics (SIF) that effect income, one of them being corruption, so the indirect implication of piety is there.
    Code:
          <factor name="SIF_FARMS">
             <pip_modifier value="0.75"/>
          </factor>
          <factor name="SIF_TAXES">
             <pip_modifier value="0.9"/>
             <castle_modifier value="0.9"/>
          </factor>
          <factor name="SIF_MINING">
             <pip_modifier value="1.0"/>
          </factor>
          <factor name="SIF_TRADE">
             <pip_modifier value="1.0"/>
             <castle_modifier value="0.5"/>
          </factor>
          <factor name="SIF_BUILDINGS">
             <pip_modifier value="1.0"/>
          </factor>
          <factor name="SIF_ADMIN">
             <pip_modifier value="1.0"/>
          </factor>
          <factor name="SIF_WAGES">
             <pip_modifier value="1.0"/>
          </factor>
          <factor name="SIF_UPKEEP">
             <pip_modifier value="1.0"/>
          </factor>
          <factor name="SIF_CORRUPTION">
             <pip_modifier value="1.0"/>
          </factor>
          <factor name="SIF_ENTERTAINMENT">
             <pip_modifier value="1.0"/>
          </factor>
          <factor name="SIF_DEVASTATION">
             <pip_modifier value="1.0"/>
          </factor>










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