Tsardoms Total War - General Discussion & Progress

[ShieldBearer]

okay im gonna stop with these questions because they will end up like Lando's in star wars robot chicken

[ShieldBearer]

"This deal is getting worse all the time!"

[Lee Wagh]

I feel your pain lmao, I'm so curious about this mod. Let's hope it arrives soon™

[Wallachian]

"This deal is getting worse all the time!"

Why?

[PekoBG]

Can you explain what those shadow factions do? I don't think i have played a mod with "shadow factions", so that's why i'm asking...

[Wallachian]

Can you explain what those shadow factions do? I don't think i have played a mod with "shadow factions", so that's why i'm asking...

There are two of them for Serbia and for Hungary. Basically when Serbia or Hungary get too big the shadow faction appears as a rebellion. Parts of the provinces of the regular Serbian/Hungarian faction get reallocated to these factions. Basically, for Serbia they are used to simulate the break up of the Serbian Empire into several states whereas for Hungary they simulate the Hungarian barons that tried at various times to break away autonomously from the crown.

The shadow factions can appear both for the player and for AI and they can appear multiple times. So you could defeat it and than at another point it will re-emerge.

[Lee Wagh]

Does the mod crash alot? I've been playing WFAS 2 (another great eastern european mod) alot to prepare but it crashes so much, it takes away from the fun massively.

[Wallachian]

No, there should barely be any crashes. I never got any crashes after playing with Bosnia for over 100 turns.

There might still be some but they should be quite rare.

And we actually use a couple of OiM2 units (hungarian hussar and a couple of tatar units).

[Lee Wagh]

Yeah OiM2 has been my go-to mod for a while. Eastern Europe is just such an interesting setting with the different array of cultures, exactly why I'm looking forward to this mod.

[Wallachian]

Yeah the only problem with OiM2 is the fact that Ottoman Empire was in its heyday so it's a crazy huge blob. Whereas in Tsardoms there is still quite some balance on the map with not as many blobs. The only blobs are Serbia and Hungary and we have the shadow factions for them to try and prevent over-expansion.

[Lee Wagh]

you guys have done magnificent work on the map, plenty of factions everywhere and now bavaria to fill some stuff up. I was wondering though, do factions like Genoa and Venice who are spread out manage to defend their colonies. It would surprise me knowing, well Total War AI

[Wallachian]

you guys have done magnificent work on the map, plenty of factions everywhere and now bavaria to fill some stuff up. I was wondering though, do factions like Genoa and Venice who are spread out manage to defend their colonies. It would surprise me knowing, well Total War AI

Yes indeed, they do really struggle with the fact that they are so stretched. Genoa to a lesser degree actually. But in fact Venice gets wiped out quite a lot. So we do need to keep working on that, especially by giving the AI some bonuses.

[Anubis88]

Yeah the only problem with OiM2 is the fact that Ottoman Empire was in its heyday so it's a crazy huge blob. Whereas in Tsardoms there is still quite some balance on the map with not as many blobs. The only blobs are Serbia and Hungary and we have the shadow factions for them to try and prevent over-expansion.

Yeah the rise of the Ottomans is really fascinating and it's not really talked about a lot. Everyone usually focuses on the Ottomans as this decaying superpower (even that is questionable, just saying what people, even historians think), while their early conquests are kinda just put into "yeah they conquered Constantinople and BAM SUPERPOWER rules from Morocco to Iran and Vienna". But it was during this timeframe that the Ottomans were at it's most potent, so it's really fun to play with them.

And since the map is scaled, it takes a LOT of time to conquer even Asia Minor, let alone when you start moving into the Balkans for real, where you are faced with Serbia, Bosnia, Bulgaria, Romans, Wallachia, Moldavia... And not to mention the superpower behind them which is Hungary. So it is really fun. And when you think you have everything in control there's a dude from Central Asia that appears and kinda feel like Bayezid felt. Not a good feeling

[NapoleonMaster]

The Ottomans also had civil wars and more rivals (other than Tamerlane) that threatened Anatolia such as the Mamluks of Egypt or the White Sheep Turks (Aq Qoyunlu).

[Anubis88]

The Ottomans also had civil wars and more rivals (other than Tamerlane) that threatened Anatolia such as the Mamluks of Egypt or the White Sheep Turks (Aq Qoyunlu).

Due to the limits of the map and the number of factions those rivals are not in the game. But you have to draw a line in the map at some point.

[Lee Wagh]

love slow expansion. The blobbing part of Total War Games is always the most unfun imo

[NapoleonMaster]

I noticed that many units are using textures from Narf's items and other Mount and Blade OSPs.

I also noticed that you combined Plate armour with Brigandine (Plackarts!)

They really look fantastic.

There's also Plate Armour with Tabards in form of OSP somewhere in the M&B community.

It wouldn't hurt if those surcoatless 15th century knights could be more colourful.

[kanteljic]

Ok, up until now I was just ignoring it and keeping it to myself, but I am really starting to get annoyed - and I know it's also the case for at least one more team member.

@NapoleonMaster
I've been part of this team since April 2016, and I don't remember if I'd seen you post anything here before the past few weeks. I don't know who you are, and for that reason I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.

I get a kind of feeling that Bavaria is a generic German faction with few unique units.

I hope this isn't the case.

Now that I know this, I think I would have preferred having France or Aragon as playable factions rather than the Duchy of Bavaria (Austria).

I know the team worked really hard on this mod since the zone where it's located is very diverse and rich in cultures but I think that this just goes against that idea.

I assume you can become Holy Roman Emperor as Austria, right?

I noticed that many units are using textures from Narf's items and other Mount and Blade OSPs.

I also noticed that you combined Plate armour with Brigandine (Plackarts!)

They really look fantastic.

There's also Plate Armour with Tabards in form of OSP somewhere in the M&B community.

It wouldn't hurt if those surcoatless 15th century knights could be more colourful.

Granted, you do make compliments as well, which are always welcome. I don't know if it's the intention, a miscommunication or whatever else it could be, but it feels to me there is always a hint of criticism; and what I regard as much, much worse: a subtle way of saying "this is wrong and you should change it" or "I expected you to have done this that way, so you better have". Honestly, the way you expressed yourself on some ocasion felt to me more as if it was feedback I was getting from the boss who hired and was paying me to develop a game to his liking.

Since that is not the case, I politely ask you to think more carefully about the way you express your feedback. When making your comments, please keep in mind that me and everyone currently working on the mod have been doing it for years and dedicated literally thousands of hours each. It's disrespectful for a modder when it sounds like someone makes demands as if they were their employees.

No decision will make everybody happy, and whoever would have prefered a different faction (or any other decision) will be free upon release to modify the files to their liking for their own gameplay, or create their own submod to make everything perfectly according to his own preferences. Not to mention that everybody on this website is always encouraged to develop and create new mods.

That is what I personally felt about the way the feedback was given on subjects I worked extensively on (playable factions and decision making for example). If any other Tsardoms development team member (such as our unit modelers) feels differently and appreciate Napoleon's comments regarding their work, please just say so and that he can continue giving feedback the way he has been. I won't say a word complaining about it.

[NapoleonMaster]

Sorry if I didn't sugar coat my words for your taste but i'm more direct since i'm also passionate about this period.

I read about it all the time.

Also, even if I have basic communication skills, English is not my strong suit.

Even so, i'm aware of my demanding attitude but that's because I have high expectations for this mod. Since pretty much something like this (Or Kingdom Come Deliverance) come in a blue moon.

I have been waiting a really long time to fulfill this "late medieval" itch and it being made in a TW, even more.

I don't know how to put it another way, really.

[AnthoniusII]

Sorry that I am interfear to this conversasion but please allow my humble opinion when it comes to mods and their so-called historical accuracy.
1st of all there is no perfect mod like all human creations that are not perfect in any way.
2nd. When a team of friends gather and agree to make a mod its up to them , the style of units, the style of textures, the deep of historical accuracy and so many other aspects. WE (the players may like or may not like a mod). But please allow the team to fully present their work before judge it. Creating historical mods is more than difficult because despite that there are numerus of sources there are always counter opinions on them. We the modern people did not live in those days and many times we are called to make some compromises because of th elack of avaialable sources and because of the game's limits. An example:
In my mod there are three spearmen units. The number could seam large espesialy that they share the same bodies and textures. So...what was the need of such number ?
Take a look in this picture:


In reality those three spears coexisted in the same infantry battalion. But it would be unfair to someone accuse us because we were forced to brake that battalion into three parts inorder the player to enjoy the game despite the game's limitations.
About anyone's knowlege.
Imagine 4 painters painting the same tree. From the North, South, East and West. ALL four of them pain the same tree but their paintings are very different. So what happened? Thoucidides gives us the answer. To have a complete histocal accuracy in your essay you must combine all four paintings to have a cimplete image of the tree. But even historians do not agree of what we call national myths. If proffesionals create myths to make their readers national proud how we commoners have complete access to history's truth. On the other hand its easy to complain about one faction or an other but we often forget that different ethnic origin people look history from their own prospective like most of us do .
SUMMARY: Let the team finish its DREAM (every mod is the dream of their creators), play it. If you don't like it play another mod closer to your taste.
If you see my Avatar and my sig you will nottice that i am a fun of the Middle Ages Roman Empire (you may know it with its fault name as Byzantine Empire). It would be easy to create a unit roster that could defeat all the rest in the mod but what accuracy would this provide and most of all what joy of other players that would suffair defeats from an imaginary roster?
About textures: Believe me that Warband is not the single source of textures. In fact years ago many Warband mods "borrowed" textures from TW mods !
That is my humble opinion.