In Defense of American Secularism and Reason

[Sphere]

In the recent religious storm that has deluged the national discussion in America, I have become alarmed by the consensus solution of how to tackle these problems; that we need to promote an ever increasing toleration of religion, and religious ideas. The answer to religious stupidity is not ad nauseam religious tolerance, nor the converse of religious persecution, but rather the unceasing ridicule of religion for its inherent divisiveness and unreason.

The main problem with building a mosque in lower Manhattan is not that it is insensitive to the bereaved, but rather its base insistence that the moral code of an illiterate 7th century desert nomad has any place in the modern world to begin with. Likewise, the folly of an obscure southern preachers burning of the Koran is not that he isn't showing the proper respect to another faith, but rather it is in his own destitute and irrational faith that allows him to believe such stupidity is divinely guided.

What we need in this society is a space were the idiocy of religious belief can be aired publicly, in the same way that we ridicule those who deny the moon landing or the holocaust. Religious moderation and silent tolerance will always serve to substantiate the virtue of faith above reason, and thus support the rationale behind religious extremists; that God has an important say in this world.

Religion, even as tolerant and obscure as it can be made, does not and indeed cannot provide the solutions we need as a nation, but rather will inevitably provide us with future problems. And we as Americans should stand up and say so. What we need is a loud, reasoned and uncompromising tolerance. One that at the same time both allows and ridicules religious practice. The ideas of Secularism and Reason are at the corps of American greatness, and we should not be ashamed to defend them.

The most formidable weapon against errors of any kind is reason.
-Thomas Paine, 1794

[Farnan]

Yes, fight intolerance with more intolerance. That has always worked.

[Phier]

Yes, fight intolerance with more intolerance. That has always worked.

Pointing out error is intolerance?

You see thats the funny thing about religion.

If I make a claim that reptiles rule the earth, that puts me into the nut house.
If I make a claim that angels walk among us, or that god loves us and listens to our prayers, I am simply faithful.

A delusion held by one is a psychosis.
A delusion held by a small group is a club.
A delusion held by millions is a religion.

You can tolerate religious faith and still think it is childish superstition.

[Banana Jelly]

Pointing out error is intolerance?

You see thats the funny thing about religion.

If I make a claim that reptiles rule the earth, that puts me into the nut house.
If I make a claim that angels walk among us, or that god loves us and listens to our prayers, I am simply faithful.

A bit of a bad comparison don't you think?

Reptiles can't rule the Earth. We do. But they used to though.

[Claudius Gothicus]

You can tolerate religious faith and still think it is childish superstition.

Don't forget about the right to publicly ridicule it as much as you want. I can't believe I'm agreeing with you.

[Simon Cashmere]

Yes, fight intolerance with more intolerance. That has always worked.

It always worked better than appeasement.

[Babur]

It always worked better than appeasement.

This isn't the 1930s...

[Blaze86420]

Oh, so pissing off every religious american is a solution to extremism? Right.
Secularism is to avoid religion completely, you're suggesting ridicule and deliberate alienation of religious communities.

I have a habit of misreading posts, so please correct if I'm wrong.

[charles the hammer]

This "solution" sounds like the breeding ground for extremism.

[Himster]

Secularism is to avoid religion completely, you're suggesting ridicule and deliberate alienation of religious communities.

Secularism means seperation of church and state. Something that America seems to had forgotten (with good cause) in the fifties. With the troubles now it might be a good idea to reintroduce some of those well worn ideas of yester-year.

[charles the hammer]

Secularism means seperation of church and state. Something that America seems to had forgotten (with good cause) in the fifties. With the troubles now it might be a good idea to reintroduce some of those well worn ideas of yester-year.

True, but that is not what he is asking for.

[Blaze86420]

Secularism means seperation of church and state. Something that America seems to had forgotten (with good cause) in the fifties. With the troubles now it might be a good idea to reintroduce some of those well worn ideas of yester-year.

I know what secularism means. I was merely stating that a secular government shouldn't waste it's time with religious issues.

[Himster]

I know what secularism means. I was merely stating that a secular government shouldn't waste it's time with religious issues.

That's a good point too.

[Moorish guy]

I know what secularism means. I was merely stating that a secular government shouldn't waste it's time with religious issues.

That might be pretty hard to do in america.

[PointOfViewGun]

The most formidable weapon against errors of any kind is reason.
-Thomas Paine, 1794

Please don't confuse idiocracy with reason.

[Babur]

so basically "haters gonna hate" is going to solve America's problems with religion?

[mongrel]

In the recent religious storm that has deluged the national discussion in America, I have become alarmed by the consensus solution of how to tackle these problems; that we need to promote an ever increasing toleration of religion, and religious ideas. The answer to religious stupidity is not ad nauseam religious tolerance, nor the converse of religious persecution, but rather the unceasing ridicule of religion for its inherent divisiveness and unreason.

The main problem with building a mosque in lower Manhattan is not that it is insensitive to the bereaved, but rather its base insistence that the moral code of an illiterate 7th century desert nomad has any place in the modern world to begin with. Likewise, the folly of an obscure southern preachers burning of the Koran is not that he isn't showing the proper respect to another faith, but rather it is in his own destitute and irrational faith that allows him to believe such stupidity is divinely guided.

What we need in this society is a space were the idiocy of religious belief can be aired publicly, in the same way that we ridicule those who deny the moon landing or the holocaust. Religious moderation and silent tolerance will always serve to substantiate the virtue of faith above reason, and thus support the rationale behind religious extremists; that God has an important say in this world.

Religion, even as tolerant and obscure as it can be made, does not and indeed cannot provide the solutions we need as a nation, but rather will inevitably provide us with future problems. And we as Americans should stand up and say so. What we need is a loud, reasoned and uncompromising tolerance. One that at the same time both allows and ridicules religious practice. The ideas of Secularism and Reason are at the corps of American greatness, and we should not be ashamed to defend them.

The most formidable weapon against errors of any kind is reason.
-Thomas Paine, 1794

Are you not aware that the 9/11 non-mosque controversy is led by a Communist and that odd commodity, a fascist-sympathizing Zionist? (Spencer and Geller) Neither seem religious to me.

[Corvis]

Why don't we take it one step further? Let's take action through unceasing ridicule of humans for their inherent divisiveness and unreason.

[Babur]

Why don't we take it one step further? Let's take action through unceasing ridicule of humans for their inherent divisiveness and unreason.

endless trolling? tell me more

[Corvis]

It's a 24/7 lifestyle my friend. One that requires commitment to aloofness and distant criticism. Just imagine you're a scientist with a magnifying glass looking down at ants as they belittle, insult, attack, murder, and wage pointless wars against one another.