Was feanor evil?

[Stabbyman]

Consider it, he was a man of huge pride and arrogance who led his people to folly and turned on those who were his allies initiating the kinslaying. furthermore he abandoned the people of fingolfin to the ice of helcraxe. and the fool let his sons take that evil oath with him.

while indeed we can view these as the actions of a man consumed by the grief of the loss of his father and his most precious craft we can also see a measure of premeditation to his actions.
please debate i'm curious.

[muller227]

Consider it, he was a man of huge pride and arrogance who led his people to folly and turned on those who were his allies initiating the kinslaying. furthermore he abandoned the people of fingolfin to the ice of helcraxe. and the fool let his sons take that evil oath with him.

while indeed we can view these as the actions of a man consumed by the grief of the loss of his father and his most precious craft we can also see a measure of premeditation to his actions.
please debate i'm curious.

Feanor was not ulimately evil, proud and overbearing but I like to think if he knew the out come of his actionsa he would have acted differently. The burning of the ships is his one act that I have the most trouble with. That was evil!!!! without any real justification true or imagined.

[YuilenZ01]

Feanor was not ulimately evil, proud and overbearing but I like to think if he knew the out come of his actionsa he would have acted differently. The burning of the ships is his one act that I have the most trouble with. That was evil!!!! without any real justification true or imagined.

Tolkien took that from Hernan Cortes, who also burned his ships upon landing in Mexico, so as to encourage his men to fight harder and achieve what they set out to accomplish. That entire scene with Feanor was based right out of real history. Except Cortes wasn't a dick, and he succeeded in obtaining all that he desired.

[KnightsTemplar]

Tolkien took that from Hernan Cortes, who also burned his ships upon landing in Mexico, so as to encourage his men to fight harder and achieve what they set out to accomplish. That entire scene with Feanor was based right out of real history. Except Cortes wasn't a dick, and he succeeded in obtaining all that he desired.

IIRC the ships are given to him- he could do whatever he want to do with them.
But the ships of Feanor wasn't his- he just took them away.
This is literally plunder.

Except this.

[RTW Fan]

Tolkien took that from Hernan Cortes, who also burned his ships upon landing in Mexico, so as to encourage his men to fight harder and achieve what they set out to accomplish. That entire scene with Feanor was based right out of real history. Except Cortes wasn't a dick, and he succeeded in obtaining all that he desired.

Yeah, and the moslem that conquered Spain burned ships as well. As well as someone in Celtic myths who I cannot for the life of me remember.

FWIW It is not being a troll to disagree.

I stick by what I have written that Feanor was considerably less evil than the Teleri who were willing to kill other elves to protect their ships. They knew Feanor's character, oath and vendetta, and they begrudged him the opportunity to fulfil the retrieval of something of value, when they were equally willing to kill for something that they argued that they valued equally. (But as was shown by their failure to follow Feanor, they clearly did not value)

Edit: and what is the obsession with closing the thread? If you are not interested in the argument, than do not argue...

[smoesville]

Yeah, and the moslem that conquered Spain burned ships as well. As well as someone in Celtic myths who I cannot for the life of me remember.

FWIW It is not being a troll to disagree.

I stick by what I have written that Feanor was considerably less evil than the Teleri who were willing to kill other elves to protect their ships. They knew Feanor's character, oath and vendetta, and they begrudged him the opportunity to fulfil the retrieval of something of value, when they were equally willing to kill for something that they argued that they valued equally. (But as was shown by their failure to follow Feanor, they clearly did not value)

Edit: and what is the obsession with closing the thread? If you are not interested in the argument, than do not argue...

In my reading of the Sil i got the impression the Teleri didn't try to kill the Noldor but tried to remove them from the ships at which point Feanor killed one of them and it escalated from that.

[Stabbyman]

It was an act of deliberate malice toward his own kin. and if fingolfins hoast had died as a result would have been a more evil act than the slaying of the teleri at alaquonde and the stealing of they're ships.

[Lain-Edel]

Sure, he lost his father and Silmarills, but that don't justify his actions. He openly offended Valars, kill his own relatives, brought curse on his kind. No doubt he was one of the greatest elves, but anyway I think he was evil.

[alreadyded]

I don't think he was evil but many of his characteristics could be defined as "bad." Distrust and pride seem to be to huge factors in his downfall, but these are not evil in themselves. He was just a tool in my opinion, and only acted as he did because Morgoth was playing him like an instrument. Though some of his actions were definitely evil I don't think he desired to do them, or took pleasure in them. I think he just rationalized it as something he had to do to achieve his overall goal. There are many similar situations in Tolkien's work in which "good" people are deceived into evil actions, and they are not justly evil.

[Miroslav Klose]

None Elf is really 'evil'. Feanor did great things, but in his own overconfidence he offended the Valar, lead the kin strife at Alqualonde. But what was most 'evil' was sneaking away with the ships and than burn them. Yes he did great things but also bad things. You could consider him as the most 'evil' (for as far as an Elf can be evil) but also one of th greatest Elves who ever lived. A strange paradox though.

[Avatar]

None Elf is really 'evil'.

You could probably argue that Maeglin was. Giving up a secure and hidden city to save his own skin wasnt so noble.

Feanor did great things, but in his own overconfidence he offended the Valar, lead the kin strife at Alqualonde. But what was most 'evil' was sneaking away with the ships and than burn them. Yes he did great things but also bad things. You could consider him as the most 'evil' (for as far as an Elf can be evil) but also one of th greatest Elves who ever lived. A strange paradox though.

Feanor is described as the most skilled craftsman who ever lived, and of course possibly the most hot-tempered. To an extent though he was attempting to do a positive thing, in that he was in pursuit of an evil being.

...and in the end he got slayed by a pair of lousy Balrogs.

That would be a pair of Maiar, in the service of the most powerful Valar, which would therefore suggest that they were also quite powerful by the standards of their race. Sauron was also a Maiar, remember.

[Stabbyman]

he refused to give the silmarils to the valar. he premeditated the kinslaying rather than simply doing it on the spur of the moment. and he burnt those same ships while abandoning his own kin.
not the actions of a good person.

[JorisofHolland]

None Elf is really 'evil'. Feanor did great things, but in his own overconfidence he offended the Valar, lead the kin strife at Alqualonde. But what was most 'evil' was sneaking away with the ships and than burn them. Yes he did great things but also bad things. You could consider him as the most 'evil' (for as far as an Elf can be evil) but also one of th greatest Elves who ever lived. A strange paradox though.

I think the kinslaying at Alqualonde was more evil than the burning of the ships. Let's take a jurisdictial look at it: vandalism and theft are lesser crimes than murder.

he refused to give the silmarils to the valar. he premeditated the kinslaying rather than simply doing it on the spur of the moment. and he burnt those same ships while abandoning his own kin.
not the actions of a good person.

He did not refuse to hand over the Silmarils, though that was, most likely, due to 'lack of time'.

[Stabbyman]

he refused to give the silmarils to the valar. he premeditated the kinslaying rather than simply doing it on the spur of the moment. and he burnt those same ships while abandoning his own kin.
not the actions of a good person.

this be a quote of the 7th post on this thread.
as you can see i'm not saying hes a good person or justified i'm merely pointing out hes a different kind of evil to the regulars in tolkiens work, where most of them are just s for the sake of it

[ArmyCharger]

...and in the end he got slayed by a pair of lousy Balrogs. add to that the man is a downright horrible person. Sure, you could think he's a great elf, but Fingolfin achieved way more. And I certainly think the greatest Man who ever lived, the last King of Numenor, Ruler of the World, kicked his butt in terms of epicness . Yes, i'm serious.

[Stabbyman]

one could plead feanors insanity?
and btw army. it was'nt a pair of balrogs it was a bunch. plus gothmog.
and he took a serious amount of lashes before he went down.
and its not slayed its slain.

check with the silmarillion i think you'll find that the valar yavanah i believe did ask for the silmarils.

[dannyalex]

Named Feanor, spirit of fire, because of "explosive temperament" and his unique skills in processing metals and gems

Νο i dont think was evil,for me is Hero of Middle Earth

He wanted to take revenge from Morgoth\Melkor for his father death and the theft of the silmarils,maybe he was blind from hate and commited those acts

[Shocked]

Named Feanor, spirit of fire, because of "explosive temperament" and his unique skills in processing metals and gems

Νο i dont think was evil,for me is Hero of Middle Earth

He wanted to take revenge from Morgoth\Melkor for his father death and the theft of the silmarils,maybe he was blind from hate and commited those acts

This

[Harabec]

Feanor was not evil, just flawed.
This is a character which is not straight forward black and white, but more gray, like real people are.

[Namorath]

he was not evil, he was just an arrogant dickhead