Modeling ?'s, progress, pics

**King_Richard** · August 28, 2010, 11:22 PM

Hello all, I'm new here. I found 3ds max student version for free, so, I've been playing around with it. I've dug through some tutorials and was able to get a model into 3ds and now I'm experimenting with it.

ETW, is alright but I miss the clashing of swords and sheilds so I'm working on bringing some of that RTW flavor into Empire. I made a helmet that I think looks alright but now I'm lost:

How do get my edited model into the game?

How do I texture it, can I texture it in 3ds, or is there some other way of doing it?

What do you's think of my helmet model so far?

What kind of smoothing do you's do on your new models, example: tesselat, smooth, HSD or something else?

I think that's enough questions for now, and thank you in advance. Also, the helmet is a wip but not sure what else I should do to it untill I can actually see what it's going to look like in-game.

**Primergy** · August 29, 2010, 03:34 AM

How do get my edited model into the game?

How do I texture it, can I texture it in 3ds, or is there some other way of doing it?

What do you's think of my helmet model so far?

What kind of smoothing do you's do on your new models, example: tesselat, smooth, HSD or something else?

1.) You need the program UltimateUnwrap3d, its actually the only program where exporters do exist for, but it costs about 50$

2.) if you want to create a texture for it which can be also used ingame, you first have to unwrap the model (making the shape of an model, planar (2D) so you can paint a texture on it. Similar to the flattened pictures fo the earth used in a atlas). with this done you can start painting a texture in Photoshop or Gimp.

3.) For your first try not bad, but the flat "panel" at the front of the helmet could perhaps make problems ingame.

4.) If you want a lag free game, use no smoothing where additional Polygons are added.
In Max you have the ability to add "smoothing groups" which makes Faces, which share the same smoothing group, appear to "rounded", means hard egdes are "erased".

**King_Richard** · August 30, 2010, 05:15 AM

Primergy,

I appreciate your help. That sucks about needing another program to get it ingame, hopefully intime someone will come up with an alternative.

For texturing the model I'm assuming that's what the "baking" deal is about. Haven't dug into to that yet but I will try some time. When you unwrap there's a whole bunch of settings to choose from for your export, how do I know which ones to use?

Alright, after a few more attempts, (everytime I start modeling I find some new tool and start over so this is a long process currently.) I now have another version that I'm currently satisfied with, although it still need some tweaking.

And another question off the top of my head, I used the "shell" modifier inorder to close up visible gaps in the model, is this an appropiate way of doing so or is there another technique for it. Also, with a finished helmet, do I need to "attach" to the head or anything else, and I've seen in all of the original models that the hats have a "skin" modifier on them, does that mean I should apply the skin modifier to newly created parts.

Input appreciated, just don't go too harsh on me since I'm new to modeling.

**Primergy** · August 30, 2010, 07:11 AM

I appreciate your help. That sucks about needing another program to get it ingame, hopefully intime someone will come up with an alternative.

True, but we should be happy that we have alteast the possibilty to export something.

For texturing the model I'm assuming that's what the "baking" deal is about. Haven't dug into to that yet but I will try some time. When you unwrap there's a whole bunch of settings to choose from for your export, how do I know which ones to use?

I think you are talking about the "Render to Textur" Tool or?
Well unwraping itself doesnt have to do much with this in first place. Take a look on the help for the UVW Modifiers, for this..its bit too much to explain here.

I use the Render to Texture Tool mainly to bake a Normal Map onto a lowpoly Mesh (has to be unwrapped) but you can use it also for an Ambient Occlusion Map.
Most of the other features arent that usefuel (at least not for me)... seams those are more intented for older games, which arent calculationg specular highlights on their on, which means that you have to bake light and shadow into the diffuse map.

And another question off the top of my head, I used the "shell" modifier inorder to close up visible gaps in the model, is this an appropiate way of doing so or is there another technique for it. Also, with a finished helmet, do I need to "attach" to the head or anything else, and I've seen in all of the original models that the hats have a "skin" modifier on them, does that mean I should apply the skin modifier to newly created parts.

Shell -Modifier: No, using it was a good idea. But make shure that you delete unnecessary (=cant be seen by the Player) Polygons of the inner part of the helmet...you can safe some Polygons here.

Skin-Modifer: Yes, if you want your new Model to deform with movements of the Body you have to add a skin modifier. In most cases its enough when you copy&paste a skin modifer of another similar model (eg another helmet).

**King_Richard** · August 30, 2010, 09:25 AM

Thanks again, that clears up a few things. The majority of it is still overwhelming, I've gotta lot of research to do yet. I think it might be time to look more into the texture part.

I'll have to find a model with a helmet, all of the ones I've opened up have had regular hats.

I "collapsed" most of the unsee-able portion of the helmet. I'll have to load the game up to examine some models to get an idea of what I can delete on the inside. I think this one looks pretty good, I rendered it with some bronzish color metal on it and it looked pretty sharp. I highlighted in red on the wireframe the area that shouldn't be visible but I didn't delete this area because the originally models didn't have any holes in them; I wasn't sure if I could delete it without having any issues. My poly, and vert count is pretty close the the original model's so I should'nt add any more details to this one, unless I delete the inner portion.

A few more images of the helmet:

**Primergy** · August 31, 2010, 04:12 AM

I'll have to find a model with a helmet, all of the ones I've opened up have had regular hats.

Thats no Problem, you can still use the skin modifier as long as the hat is big enough. Just make shure that everything of your helmet is coloured red, when you are clicking on the "envelopes" button, which means that vertex of the helmet is defomered with the same strength.

I think the inner part of your helmet is fine now, so no need to delete more.

**King_Richard** · August 31, 2010, 07:07 AM

I found this tutorial by Lu Bu http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=224810 which helped out a bit.

This whole time I knew about the symetry deal but didn't realize that I could leave it as the last modifier and it would constantly update itself. So now I mad a new helmet since I can't stand things not being aligned properly. It may not be historically correctly but this one looks pretty sharp too. I'm just having a bit of a problem tyring to smooth the face out whiling keeping its general shape. I'll just have to keep making small adjustments I suppose.

This new one has about 30 more faces than the original model had. I'm really not sure how much of an impact that will make, although, I haven't removed all of the unneccessary spots yet. Things are starting to get easier, I'm starting to get a hang of most general tools and modifiers but theres still alot to learn in this program.

I think I should start looking into some more realworld helmets before I make any more, or I could do some armor to go along with this helmet that I just made, hmmm.

EDIT: which is more important to optimize, faces or vert's

**King_Richard** · September 01, 2010, 09:01 AM

I started working on some armor a lil while ago. I used the native american archer as a template. I made the abs and chest section myself while adjusting the rest as I go, trying to remove whatevers not needed in the model. I put the chrome on it to help me make adjustments since the light reflection shows me my flaws pretty quick.

But heres a render of the armor so far, doesn't look as good when it's not rendered so I figured I'd show it off this way instead.

I forgot to check out transfering the skin modifier but it doesn't sound hard to do. I'm not sure what the envolopes are but I'll look that up in the help.