Voivode of Transylvania

[pedro1979]

I agree with you that the "Hardcore nationalist propaganda" is present in all the former comunist states (espacially in FYRM ) but I totally agree with Bagatyr and his comment about his post.This guy ( wallachian men ) started posting some ultranationalistic stuff ( not to mention that they are not true ... ) .Just see his avatar and his former signature ...
I just cant see why you are insulted - just because he spelled Transylvania wrong -
grow up ( respect wtf ? ) .

In this tread in the tsardom forum the topic is about the medieval Transylvania.RL dosent matter here ( and btw there are millions hungarians in Transylvania in the present days ...).

You got it wrong. This is insulting "And it is world wide known fact face it. I get the feeling that in Romania the Education in history has change to Hardcore nationalist propaganda that serving the tendentious policy of the romanian state." I'm talking about Transilvania and Bagatyr brought into discution Asen brothers....he's transforming this thread in his dispute with Carpatian Wolf
And I repeat there is no need of a faction for Transilvania, it should be IN THE GAME under hungarian control. I can't wait to see this mood released, like all of you...
BTW I have hungarian friends in Transilvania, there are aproximately 1,5 up to 2 mil in Transilvania and with few exception we all get along with eachother

As far as I'm concerned this thread can be closed, for me Bagatyr=Wallachian men, you cannot have a discution with bouth of them, everyone has the the right to believe in what he want's, history is not an exact science. Bagatyr call himself a patriot,J well being a patriot behind a screen and a keyboard,…….

Let’s all hope that this mood will be released and we all shell enjoy it.

[2Shy]

You got it wrong. This is insulting "And it is world wide known fact face it. I get the feeling that in Romania the Education in history has change to Hardcore nationalist propaganda that serving the tendentious policy of the romanian state." I'm talking about Transilvania and Bagatyr brought into discution Asen brothers....he's transforming this thread in his dispute with Carpatian Wolf
And I repeat there is no need of a faction for Transilvania, it should be IN THE GAME under hungarian control. I can't wait to see this mood released, like all of you...
BTW I have hungarian friends in Transilvania, there are aproximately 1,5 up to 2 mil in Transilvania and with few exception we all get along with eachother

As far as I'm concerned this thread can be closed, for me Bagatyr=Wallachian men, you cannot have a discution with bouth of them, everyone has the the right to believe in what he want's, history is not an exact science. Bagatyr call himself a patriot,J well being a patriot behind a screen and a keyboard,…….

Let’s all hope that this mood will be released and we all shell enjoy it.

This is a good post and Im reping you !
The worst think about the nationalism is that the innocent ordinary people suffer from it.I live in the north-east bulgaria where many turks live but even in the time of the ottoman rule and still today we all live peacefully together.I have lots of turk friends and they are really cool guys.The problem comes from some nationalist scums that serves political interests and selling their own people for money and PR ...

PS- I can feel how Tzar is coming to close the tread !

[Vojdoo]

Bagatyr=Wallachian men

Don't forget to add CW to the list !

[Bagatyr]

Bagatyr what happened? Couldn't win an argument on our page discussion so now you are peddling your cheap idiotic propaganda bull here? One more time for you.

Dear Carpathian Wolf as i said i am now besy with my other occupations( after all i have my life).When i am free i will continue.Bye the way i was expecting that my absence will make you start thinking that you have win you are ling yourself.It is my own desision to consantrate on my exams rather to risk my futher loosing time with you ...
And stop posting me every time romano-dacis i read it allredy and is noting more difrend from what i have reded before.3 crusaders and Nikita Honiat(ho pointed out that vlahs are called the bulgarians that live in Moeasia back then called by the byzantine adminastrativse Vlahia) vs Saint Evtimiy,George Akropolites,Boril obituary,Mavro Orbini,Marino Sanuto,the biography of Archbishop Sava Serbian,letter of King Andrew II to Pope Honorius III to the beginning of 1219,Turnovo inscription of Tsar Ivan Assen,life of St. Petka (Paraskeva) , Dubrovnik charter of Ivan Asen II,Coins and seals of Asen I,II,Tih Asen,Boril,seals and the ring of Kaloyan- I think it isn't nesesery to post more.About the letters between pope Innocentus and Kaloyan we have talk meny times and it is riitten in the letters that Asen are bulgarian nobles and Vlagiq is the name of a province that Asen title them selfs as her rulers infront of the pope so he can recognaise it as bulgarian.

ye,yes...you are right....about propanda...but in what you wrote
crap..and propaganda

Bagatyr call himself a patriot,J well being a patriot behind a screen and a keyboard,…….

You don't know me so don't commentait as i don't do it about you.

[Baron Vlad Felix]

u jebote....ahtung.....volgo,,,,

[ST. Toma]

Hail!

Firstly, I don't want to argue, cause there are fanatics, who can't believe in anything, just their political fanatism (it is not the part of history).
Transylvania wasn't independent state till 1541-71, when it became a (Hungarian led) principality cause of the Ottoman invasion and the Hungarian civil war.
So Transylvania was not a vassal of Hungary, it was the part of Hungary, as an autonomous province (like Slavonia). The cause of this autonomy wasn't ethnic (as in Slavonia), but strategic. Transylvania protected the rich fields of Eastern Hungary from Pecheneg, Oghuz, Cuman and Tatar invasions and raids.
Because of this "bastion" role, Hungarian kings settled there different peoples, like Szeklers, Pechenegs, Saxons, and later knight order (Teutons, and Hospitallers) and Vlachs. We don't know surely, if there lived Vlachs before 1210, but, if they lived, they were very few in the Fogaras Mountains. What is sure, that more and more Vlachs appeared in South Transylvania from the 1200', cause of Tatar attacks and later, because of the vacuum of the powers. Vlachs became majority during the repeated Ottoman attacks from 1430/50, because Hungarians lived in the lower parts of the province, where Ottoman raids could cause more damage, while Vlachs lived in the mountainous regions, where were fewer effect of the Turkish attacks.
About the person of the Voivode, he was always Hungarian, often the biggest aristocrat of the region, and the king nominated him. Some of them collected the possessions of Transylvania and tried to become independent, like the Kán family, but there was no ethnic cause in the background.

At the end, I said it many times, there were no account of ethnicity in the Middle Ages! There were collective words, like Vlach (which had at least three meaning: 1. person who speaks a neolatin language, 2. person who is the member of a transhumant tribe, aka shepherd (it could be a Bulgar, Ruthen, Polish, etc, not just ethnic Vlach), and 3. ethnic Vlachs), or similar was Slav, which meant ethnicity but also transhumant, or Scythian, which meant Eastern nomad (Magyar, Cuman, Mongol etc). Or, for example, Hungarus, which meant not just ethnic Magyars but also every people who were under the King of Hungary, like Tóts (Hungarian Slavs - Old Slovaks, Wends, Slavons), Vlachs, Germans or Nomads of Hungary.

To sum up, there is no need speaking about independent Transylvanian state in this mod, and also Greater Rumanian unification (it is modern politics, not history). In the Middle Ages, Wallachians (and all other people) wanted to have Transylvania not because of ethnic causes, but economic, strategic and pretige causes.

I hope, I helped

[Baron Vlad Felix]

Achtung....hunomongol-turkobabylons....
now we learn the Mongolian version of history!?
you made a mistake and come to the wrong place...servus

[Vojdoo]

I hope, I helped

Unfortunately no one can help them(I mean CW Total War Team).

[Baron Vlad Felix]

but they can help you....

[Visarion]

But if for example I play with Moldova there is no a peaceful way to unite MOLDOVA,WALACHIA and TRANSILVANIA,I have looked in kalmar union script and it seems that it is imposible to unite peaceful factions so in any case better it will be Hungarian blood on swords of my Moldavian troops then romanian.

a union of the three factions would be very interesting... but is the mod until 1600?

[slavic_crusader]

U guys talking of like That Russian Mod? Ruischi TW or something? With the Russians... If u do this... Then
U should make.. one for Byzantine(which is going to be)
One for Romania..
Italy
Austria-Hungary?
Ottomans?
Bosnia+Serbia+ some Croatian regions+Bulgaria? A Slavic unification? South Slavs kingdoms unified?
Pretty much all factions can fit this

ANyway these dont really matter... It never happened at the time as to what we are talking about...
If u want to just conquer the regions u think is appropriate and "Imagine" A greater whatever! To whateevr u wish

[Bagatyr]

u jebote....ahtung.....volgo,,,,

само толкова ли можеш бе румъно-шумадийски каруцар смотан.

Achtung....hunomongol-turkobabylons....
now we learn the Mongolian version of history!?
you made a mistake and come to the wrong place...servus

I think there is no need to comment such you will be welcome in FYROM the land of the farytales

[Visarion]

a Mihai Viteazu (Michael the Brave) Total War would be interesting!

[shikaka]

a Mihai Viteazu (Michael the Brave) Total War would be interesting!

How to make all the neighbouring major powers (Ottomans, Habsburgs and Poles) mad at you in 2 years?

Yes, that guy was surely brave, but not really smart in politics.

[Visarion]

actually Habsburgs were allies at first until they betrayed us and Poland, well Poland was a good enemy, a mild one if you want!

Yes, that guy was surely brave, but not really smart in politics.

that was the sin of every great general! from Alexander onward! they only wanted to conquer, eliberate or have their revange... they were too arrogant to think they were just mortals and thus they became immortals!

[shikaka]

actually Habsburgs were allies at first until they betrayed us and Poland, well Poland was a good enemy, a mild one if you want!

Actually I spent some time on this subject, and one thing is for sure. Michael was from the beginning to the end an enemy of the ottomans, and didn't change this position, ever. That's respectable if you take into account that the ottos were a superpower that time, living next door.

[pedro1979]

So now we have romanian, bulgarian, hungarian propaganda here.....anyone....history made on the forums is equal to ZERO, what is the point of nationalistic propaganda in this century? we all are members of EU and with an attitude like this is going to be a dead project....
So back to the mod no faction for Transilvania, and the province will be under hungarian control...

[Visarion]

what propaganda? it's like saying stop posting! just having a chat with a pal that's all!

[pedro1979]

read the posts above, not about Mihai Viteazu

[RO Citizen]

A call for peace to all nationalists

Why so many ultranationalists Romanians on these forums in these days? I mean, ce pula mea! excuse my rage expression fellow Romanians, but let's be more calm and talk friendly and accept the truth, which is somewhere in the middle. If you ask me, yes, the Romanian school IS a -hole that teaches you nothing but nationalistic rubbish, same as the TV and all that.

We're living in 2010 (soon 2011), not 1940, where all our neighbours and us were some propagandistic bastards. There may be some Hungarian and Russian and other ultranationalists, but let's not treat them as they treat us, because we're just making ourselves stupid. And don't call all these nations ultranationalist or stupid just because of a retarded 0.5%

From my point of view, both 2Shy and Bagatyr were very reasonable, and they brought valid arguments for their opinions. I wouldn't had been as calm as they were in their posts.

Matters about Transylvania

Now let's settle matters about Transylvania. I will say my personal opinion, and I will try to be as neutral as I can be.

Transylvania was indeed mostly inhabited by Vlachs (Romanians), but it was a fully Hungarian province. The voivode was actually a governor, a local Feudal lord in the name of the king, just as Toulouse was French, and not the independent Countship of Toulouse. In Transylvania voivode, in Croatia ban (and then king), no matter, it was still under Hungarian authority. The "special" and loose statute of Transylvania is only imaginary, and it was imagined by people who had no knowledge of how the Feudal system works. However, being a bit far from Buda, and also a border province, it had a bit of a special statute, but I may say that Croatia was more loose and free than Transylvania was.

The first real time when Transylvania gained de facto independence was after the Battle of Mohacs, in 1526, and until around 1680 (it still was a vassal, but a very loosely controlled one). But, as these dates are out of the range of this wonderful mod, Transylvania deserves nothing more than some titles, regional units recruitable by any factions that conquers it, and maybe, in the last version, a shadow faction.