Ottoman Units and Spawning Agents, v5 (8 May 2011): agents only mod added

[jo the greek]

We can definitely change the color of the uniform from blue, but not the major changes very easily. Is this the correct time frame? I saw a drawing from Osprey where they were blue, just like CA's version. Likely different regions and units had different uniforms.

I definitely wanted to make a Dehli Lancer unit, you verified my idea. They have two heavy cav lancers, so need a light lancer as well. Also going to give the mamelukes faction lancers as per ottomanfan's suggestion.

Did the shaturnal camels use rifles or muskets? I used carbines for the mounted units, but did they really use long muskets?

Amir Timur is going to start up another realism mod and we can help each other out I think

Shaturnal were mounted cannons i dont know their range but had great impact on warfare but were slow
for Circassians if you noticed one pic posted is similar with osprey but osprey has some pic thats not always corrected and i feel this pic based on a bad representation .

Well mameluks i would like to see them as they are they are pretty cool cause after all you will end with a roster of lance

Now i think that you can easily make a Arab or something like that Cavalry .

Do not know if possible but it would add some ottomans officers in units ti would be nice touch

i have many proposal i am interested in that era a lot .

[ottomanfan]

The deli lancers would be a great idea as the actual pic in the osprey book represents a deli armed with a lance.

For the cricassians maybe you could give them a mixture of colours so you have some blue, some red etc.. Maybe a mixture of helmet types aswell... (the pictures from the Jo the Greek are really good)


The Wallachian Boyars are great, but like you said, they could do with some tweaking - maybe giving them a more irregular look with some brown coats and some blue and different coloured undershirts.

[jo the greek]

The deli lancers would be a great idea as the actual pic in the osprey book represents a deli armed with a lance.

For the cricassians maybe you could give them a mixture of colours so you have some blue, some red etc.. Maybe a mixture of helmet types aswell... (the pictures from the Jo the Greek are really good)


The Wallachian Boyars are great, but like you said, they could do with some tweaking - maybe giving them a more irregular look with some brown coats and some blue and different coloured undershirts.

well some pic of dellis osprey isnt paradise for example isarelys appears in osprey but never met that name before

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

[md1453]

Wish I could generate different colors for the same unit, notice all the colors! I chose a light green/brown color for the lancers so they are different than the regular horsemen, but I could have used purple as well. It appears they had a typical outfit, but the colors varied.

It'll be in the next update!

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

I'll probably be slower on each update as well, but will try to get all the tweaks I can in. Also, cannot do square with cavalry, but did add the long muskets to the camels.

I was going to wait on the Boyars to mod the texture files. Making them brown doesn't look good. . .

[jo the greek]

Wish I could generate different colors for the same unit, notice all the colors! I chose a light green/brown color for the lancers so they are different than the regular horsemen, but I could have used purple as well. It appears they had a typical outfit, but the colors varied.

It'll be in the next update!

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

I'll probably be slower on each update as well, but will try to get all the tweaks I can in. Also, cannot do square with cavalry, but did add the long muskets to the camels.

I was going to wait on the Boyars to mod the texture files. Making them brown doesn't look good. . .

well i have seen it can be done but dont worry after all this your mode and your time i think lancer dellis are cooler than just with sword

[md1453]

Does anyone know if Tatar warriors used bows at the beginning of the 19th century? I noticed the Armenians did, so I wouldn't be surprised if the Tatars did too.

Of course, there were the famous lancers, but did some still use the bow? I would love to add a bow unit to the Ottomans. . .

[jo the greek]

Does anyone know if Tatar warriors used bows at the beginning of the 19th century? I noticed the Armenians did, so I wouldn't be surprised if the Tatars did too.

Of course, there were the famous lancers, but did some still use the bow? I would love to add a bow unit to the Ottomans. . .

yep they used in fact in Napoleonic wars existed Cossack units that carried bows


I would suprised if some anatolian Sipahis still did but for sure many used Javelins that you may confuse for short Lance.

As for the ottoman Archer i had discussed with Amir in the Past there were some elite guard but their role was similar to Marine guards of Napoleon

[md1453]

yep they used in fact in Napoleonic wars existed Cossack units that carried bows


I would suprised if some anatolian Sipahis still did but for sure many used Javelins that you may confuse for short Lance.

As for the ottoman Archer i had discussed with Amir in the Past there were some elite guard but their role was similar to Marine guards of Napoleon

Thanks for the response, if the bow model still exists in NTW I will add an elite guard of bowmen. That would be a very cool unit. I was planning on making them tatars, but any info is good.

Either way I should have another set of units out later today!

[jo the greek]

Thanks for the response, if the bow model still exists in NTW I will add an elite guard of bowmen. That would be a very cool unit. I was planning on making them tatars, but any info is good.

Either way I should have another set of units out later today!

The name of those units were called Solaks in some Paintings of Napoleonic era are represented some Arabian Auxilairies having bows but was the first time met it and not being sure of that

[md1453]

The name of those units were called Solaks in some Paintings of Napoleonic era are represented some Arabian Auxilairies having bows but was the first time met it and not being sure of that

A reference says they were part of the Janissary corps with four Orta, and wore Janissary uniforms but added a plume to their cap. Does this match the picture. Also, they were always on foot.

[md1453]

Finally some elite units! Added the Sekban grenadiers which where the elite of the Janissary corps, which consisted of the Cemaat, Beylik, and Sekban. Also made an Elite Nizam unit from a tip from amir timur, and Deli Lancers from a suggestin by jo the greek. Thanks for all the input. Also, Sekban musketeers, which have the same uniform approximately to the grenadiers.

Next step is the Sultans personal guard, the Soluks, which were Beylik Janissaries. The problem is they are bowmen and bow models don't work yet. Going to spend some time on this and see if I can get it to work.

Keep up the input and have fun!

I've also created a small mod that allows the building of the 5th cultural building. The global happiness is very much needed. It very much in pre-beta, but it works. If there is interest I'll put it up.

[ottomanfan]

Excellent stuff! I Like the new elite nizam i cedit - very nice! It would be great to have tatar cavalry in the game, with or without bows. I am pretty sure many of them still used bows but i would imagine some used pistols and muskets/carbines aswell.

[ottomanfan]

I have a suggestion for a mounted bashi bazouk unit, as a kind of militia cavalry or mounted bandit unit. I think this would be great fun!

[md1453]

I have a suggestion for a mounted bashi bazouk unit, as a kind of militia cavalry or mounted bandit unit. I think this would be great fun!

Yes, rather like the old provincial cavalry units in ETW. I could add these to mamelukes too.

Also, it probably makes sense to add the tatars as a mounted ranged unit. By then they certainly used carbines and muskets. I plan to import the ETW model as well, since the hat is a little different. Will get to that.

Probably be a while until I really start working on mamelukes and egyptian ottomans. But eventually. I thought the egypt campaign as ottomans not fun because of the lack of units and money.

[ottomanfan]

Yes, rather like the old provincial cavalry units in ETW. I could add these to mamelukes too.

Also, it probably makes sense to add the tatars as a mounted ranged unit. By then they certainly used carbines and muskets. I plan to import the ETW model as well, since the hat is a little different. Will get to that.

Probably be a while until I really start working on mamelukes and egyptian ottomans. But eventually. I thought the egypt campaign as ottomans not fun because of the lack of units and money.

Yes the tatars as ranged unit would be right, although i wouldnt transfer the etw tatar unit as it wasnt very historically accurate - theres a picture of a tatar courier in my osprey book that has a similar uniform to a deli, with the same tall felt hat with the bobble, a light brown overcoat and a green undercoat.


The Egypt campaign is ok once you get into it and once you add all those units to the ottomans and mamelukes it should be much better.

[md1453]

Yes the tatars as ranged unit would be right, although i wouldnt transfer the etw tatar unit as it wasnt very historically accurate - theres a picture of a tatar courier in my osprey book that has a similar uniform to a deli, with the same tall felt hat with the bobble, a light brown overcoat and a green undercoat.


The Egypt campaign is ok once you get into it and once you add all those units to the ottomans and mamelukes it should be much better.

Ok, I can make that! Sounds good.

I've played the Egyptian campaign once, it was fun but hard to do anything as Ottomans. It was much more fun as France surprisingly.

[jo the greek]

bassicaly tartars circassians cossacks Wallachian would wear similar things

[BlackMailedAgain]

Now i think that you can easily make a Arab or something like that Cavalry .

Do not know if possible but it would add some ottomans officers in units ti would be nice touch

i have many proposal i am interested in that era a lot .

Sorry for not being responsive as I would prefer, NTW is giving me fits and I am unable to resolve the issue after 3 days. Lots or validating, reinstalls and so on.

Anyway...since I am unable to use NTW for checking graphics and such, I just wanted to let you know, I am working on some various "desert troops" to add to the spread as well as artillery units. I am looking at the Berbers as a model for some irregular cavalry, and some units from outlying areas.

Hopefully the next install of NTW will see me up so I can begin checking and tweaking the work.

On your suggestions/proposals, if you could send links to (scholarly) sites where you found your info, it would be of great assistance.

Thanks to all who give feedback.

[md1453]

Sorry for not being responsive as I would prefer, NTW is giving me fits and I am unable to resolve the issue after 3 days. Lots or validating, reinstalls and so on.

Anyway...since I am unable to use NTW for checking graphics and such, I just wanted to let you know, I am working on some various "desert troops" to add to the spread as well as artillery units. I am looking at the Berbers as a model for some irregular cavalry, and some units from outlying areas.

Hopefully the next install of NTW will see me up so I can begin checking and tweaking the work.

On your suggestions/proposals, if you could send links to (scholarly) sites where you found your info, it would be of great assistance.

Thanks to all who give feedback.

Hope you get the system up and running, its always a bummer when things go down.

When it comes to uniforms, I find that they are often far from uniform within an army. (pun intended) Especially in armies that use local levies to fill the ranks, they often have a mish-mash of outfits that could scarcely be called "uniforms". From what I have read only the Nizams truly had a uniform which was paid for by the Sultan. It appears the Janissary did as well, but it varied from unit to unit.

This leads us to follow manuscripts and paintings which are often not even contemporary! Realistically these should be guides and we can then use artistic license, often as the composers of the original portraits did. The best info is what units actually existed, what their roles were, and what they may have worn in the time frame. Then we can try to make a unit that looks pretty good. This is what I've done so far, I think the results are pretty good.

I write this because while researching the web for the Sultan's guard the Solaks I have found not a single drawing that repeats the same uniform. As soon as I do that is the uniform I will try to reproduce

[jo the greek]

Sorry for not being responsive as I would prefer, NTW is giving me fits and I am unable to resolve the issue after 3 days. Lots or validating, reinstalls and so on.

Anyway...since I am unable to use NTW for checking graphics and such, I just wanted to let you know, I am working on some various "desert troops" to add to the spread as well as artillery units. I am looking at the Berbers as a model for some irregular cavalry, and some units from outlying areas.

Hopefully the next install of NTW will see me up so I can begin checking and tweaking the work.

On your suggestions/proposals, if you could send links to (scholarly) sites where you found your info, it would be of great assistance.

Thanks to all who give feedback.

I can give scholary recourses but then you will get confused lol

In that time the militairy system had collapsed
you can find provincial Sekban and Janissairies Sekbans were something like musketeer other times appear as mounted musketeers are you sure you want to get in that mess