Fighting for our freedoms

**Virgil** · November 18, 2005, 08:51 AM

Ok here is the question, has any soldier in the US military service since WW2 actually fought for the freedoms of the American people? Dont get me wrong, I love our soldiers and I support them in everyway but I keep hearing (not to me speifically) 'You dont support the troops! They are over there fighting and dying for your fricken freedoms and you are dragging them through the mud!' Why do they say that? Are they?

Personally, I don't think so - here is my opinion of every major war we have been in since WW2

Korea - fighting to stop the spread of communism

Vietnam - same as above, must stop the commies

1st Iraq War - stop saddam and save the kuwaitis

Dont get me started on the second iraq war

Now...before people start saying these wars are more complicated than that or start flaming me or what ever, I only pick what is to me the main reason for the war - I realise they were more complicated.

However, Of the reasons I chose, I dont think any of those were protecting our - AMERICAN freedoms.

Does anyone have any opinions on this, consenting or dissenting? But please, keep it clean....I really want to debate this. Thanks!

**Guderian** · November 18, 2005, 09:49 AM

The only war I think that was in defense of freedoms since ww2 was the war in Afghanistan, all the rest were political and aggresive.

**Rush Limbaugh** · November 18, 2005, 09:53 AM

Ok here is the question, has any soldier in the US military service since WW2 actually fought for the freedoms of the American people?

You could say the same of WW2. Roosevelt forced the Japanese to attack us. We could easily have avoided going to war.

**CrackerMonkey** · November 18, 2005, 09:56 AM

Hmm... so you americans just enjoy declaring war? [jk]

**Rush Limbaugh** · November 18, 2005, 10:00 AM

Just point us towards the sound of the guns

**eurolord** · November 18, 2005, 10:00 AM

Hi,

If you class going to war to ensure that the economy continues to support the living standards of the people then of course it is justified.

It is a soldiers duty to defend the country he belongs to and that includes the freedoms and living standards of that country. Most wars in history have been fought for control of resources - so why should it be any different now???

Nothing is for nothing in this world. If you want to maintain your living standards and freedoms, be they economic freedom or personal freedom, then you have to be willing to defend them as well. If you have to dominate or attack another country in order to maintain those "freedoms", then so be it.

Too many people on this forum have never had to defend those freedoms. I would dearly love to see the reactions of many on these forums if they had to go without fuel or gas for a few weeks.

Eurolord

p.s Before someone mentions it, yes, I have served in both Gulf Wars :original:

**CrackerMonkey** · November 18, 2005, 10:06 AM

Heh, I live in Norway and though we have a few soldiers in Iraq and Afganistan, but they're mostly symbolic.

What did Iraq had to do with american freedom, eurolord?
Maybe Bush thought that to ensure the american economy, he had to steal Iraqs oil?

**eurolord** · November 18, 2005, 10:09 AM

Hi CrackerMonkey,

I thought the answer to that was obvious - to maintain a reliable oil supply. The economies of the west, including Norway run on oil or oil based products.

It doesnt take a lot of working out, does it.

Eurolord

**Torment** · November 18, 2005, 10:25 AM

Moved to mudpitt.

**CrackerMonkey** · November 18, 2005, 11:00 AM

Hi eurolord,

Well, we norwegians can supply oil for ourselves!

Anyhoo, I disagree that war is justified just because the US/the west simply "needed" the oil.
War isn't something to take lightly.

CrackerMonkey

**ThiudareiksGunthigg** · November 19, 2005, 02:12 AM

Originally Posted by eurolord

I thought the answer to that was obvious - to maintain a reliable oil supply.

Eurolord

A friend of mine was mugged at knifepoint the other week. Apparently the guy who mugged him looked pretty poor. So I suppose it was fine for him to mug my friend to 'maintain a reliable cash supply'.

I'll phone my friend and get him to drop the charges.

Thanks for clearing that up. It seems robbery is okay after all.

**First Crusader** · November 18, 2005, 10:38 AM

The Korean and Gulf wars were fought for the freedom of OTHER PEOPLES.

**Guderian** · November 18, 2005, 10:41 AM

At the expense of Iraqi lives? Then what freedom is the US defending? The freedoms of the corporations and the rich?

To quote BF

Originally Posted by Benjamin Franklin

There never was a good war or a bad peace.

No the Korean and Vietnam wars were fought because of US policy towards communism.

**Guderian** · November 18, 2005, 11:12 AM

Look at it this way if you hadn't interfered alot less would've died. And it was hardly fought for freedom of the Vietnamese...it was more about America stopping communism. Something it went to great lengths to do. The Vietnamese didn't want so called freedom of a puppet US government, they wanted thier own country.

Vietnam is a good place to live according to most Vietnamese I've met. It would be even better if the US hadn't blockaded all communist countries and even better if the US hadn't invaded it at all.

**Rush Limbaugh** · November 18, 2005, 11:20 AM

Look at it this way if you hadn't interfered alot less would've died.

Yup the quality of life dosent matter.

Vietnam is a good place to live according to most Vietnamese I've met. It would be even better if the US hadn't blockaded all communist countries and even better if the US hadn't invaded it at all.

Tell you what. If its so great move there for a year or two and then get back to us. Im sure you will still be singing their praises.

**First Crusader** · November 18, 2005, 12:12 PM

Originally Posted by Guderian

Look at it this way if you hadn't interfered alot less would've died. And it was hardly fought for freedom of the Vietnamese...it was more about America stopping communism. Something it went to great lengths to do. The Vietnamese didn't want so called freedom of a puppet US government, they wanted thier own country.

Very true. We should have let the Communists take over - and then after the people had been completely disallusioned, we could have invaded and been cheered on as "liberators". We would have defeated Communism, and kept our good rep.

Look at it this way if you hadn't interfered alot less would've died.

I think the people of Kuwait would beg to differ.

Vietnam is a good place to live according to most Vietnamese I've met. It would be even better if the US hadn't blockaded all communist countries and even better if the US hadn't invaded it at all

So I take it you've been to Vietnam?

If not, why did those people LEAVE?!

Maybe you could go and tell the surviving relatives of the millions who died in the purges after the war how good things are for them.

**Guderian** · November 18, 2005, 11:23 AM

Well Ive actaully lived in a Village in Sri Lanka for 3 months. It wasn't that bad if you ask me, It was only the heat that was intolerable. I hear Vietnam is quite the same i.e village life.

From what I saw people had a different way of life but most were happy, at least happier than the depressed masses participating in the rat race.

**Guderian** · November 18, 2005, 12:24 PM

Very true. We should have let the Communists take over - and then after the people had been completely disallusioned, we could have invaded and been cheered on as "liberators". We would have defeated Communism, and kept our good rep.

Sorry FC but unless you specifically ask me to im not going to bother explaining either communism or the cold war to an American.

I think the people of Kuwait would beg to differ.

I was refering to Vietnam.

So I take it you've been to Vietnam?

If not, why did those people LEAVE?!

Maybe you could go and tell the surviving relatives of the millions who died in the purges after the war how good things are for them.

Thats war my friend. You have to understand Vietnam and it's history before you ask that question, if you want I'll tell you my opinion. And it goes both ways, but again unless you want me to Im not going to say anything.

**First Crusader** · November 18, 2005, 12:29 PM

Originally Posted by Guderian

Sorry FC but unless you specifically ask me to im not going to bother explaining either communism or the cold war to an American.

Actually, I was explaining my idea to you. :laughing:

I was refering to Vietnam.

Then its silly to condemn us for just one war. You could do that for practically any nation.

Thats war my friend. You have to understand Vietnam and it's history before you ask that question, if you want I'll tell you my opinion. And it goes both ways, but again unless you want me to Im not going to say anything.

So you aren't going to say whether or not you've actually been there? I think I can guess though...