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  1. #1

    Default Regiment of Horse - Port of Origin

    Hello.

    Quite frankly, the history and evolution of this "regiment of horse" baffles me. Never have I come across something like this "regiment of horse" in my learning. Generally, the decisive cavalry maneuvers of ETW's time rely on specialized cavalry regiments who are virtuosos of their craft. If "regiment of horse" is indeed as generic as its name suggests, where does it stand on the battlefield and what is its history?

    I've got nothing on them; perhaps because they are just a concoction of game developers?

    Oh in addition, doesn't their role conflict with the cavalry role of dragoons?

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Regiment of Horse - Port of Origin

    Regiment of Horse is a British term describing British cavalry regiments, like the British Regiment of Foot which describes cavalry. And yes, this term never appears in other nations' armies except Britain, whose cavalry are mostly composed of dragoons (Regiment of Horse=Dragoons). But I think regiment of horse represents Line Cavalry in Spain, Heavy Cavalry of France, and other Line Cavalry regiments in various armies. But yes, the term regiment of horse refers to generic heavy cavalry regiments that were not armored like the cuirassiers.
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  3. #3

    Default Re: Regiment of Horse - Port of Origin

    Regiments of Horse.

    British
    1st (The King's) Regiment of Dragoon Guards
    2nd (The Queen's) Regiment of Dragoon Guards
    3rd Regiment of Dragoon Guards
    1st Regiment of Horse, or The Blue Horse
    2nd Regiment of Horse, or The Green Horse
    3rd Regiment of Horse (Carabiniers)
    4th Regiment of Horse, or The Black Horse

    French Regiments of Horse

    Royal Regiments
    Colonel Général
    Mestre de camp Général
    Commissaire général
    Royal
    du Roy
    Royal-Étranger
    Cuirassiers du Roy
    Royal-Cravate
    Royal-Roussillon
    Royal-Piémont
    Royal-Carabiniers
    Royal-Pologne
    La Reine
    Dauphin
    Dauphin-Étranger
    Bourgogne
    Aquitaine
    Berry
    Orléans
    Condé
    Bourbon
    Clermont
    Conti
    Penthièvre

    Gentlemens Regiments
    Archiac
    Poly Saint-Thiébault
    Lusignan
    Marcieux
    des Salles
    Talleyrand
    Clermont-Tonnerre
    Chabrillan
    d'Egmont
    Beauvilliers
    Grammont
    Bourbon-Busset
    Viefville
    Maugiron
    Lastic de Saint-Jal
    Fumel
    Rochefoucauld-Langeac

    de Vienne
    Bussy-Lameth
    Crussol
    Fleury
    Lénoncourt
    Bellefonds
    Dampierre
    Henrichemont
    Moustiers
    Saluces
    Noailles
    Harcourt
    Descars
    Montcalm
    Bezons

    Foriegn Regiments of Horse
    Royal-Allemand
    Wurtemberg
    Nassau-Sarrebruck
    Fitz-James
    Volontaires Liégeois ou Volontaires de Raugrave
    Corse

    Spanish Regiments of Horse
    Reina
    Milán
    Borbón
    Ordenes
    Farnesio
    Alcantara
    Extremadura
    Barcelona
    Malta
    Brabante
    Flandes
    Algarve
    Andalucia
    Calatrava
    Granada
    Sevilla
    Santiago
    Montesa
    Costa de Granada

    Swedish Regiments of Horse
    Guard Regiments
    Adelsfanan
    Upplands Liv Regiment
    Livdragoner

    Hannoverian Regiments of Horse
    Garde du Corps
    Grenadiers à cheval
    Leib-Regiment Reuter
    Zepelin
    Dachenhausen
    Hammerstein
    Grothaus
    Hodenberg
    Walthausen
    Gilten

    Portuguese Regiments of Horse
    Almeida
    Meclemburgo
    Ceta
    Alcantara
    Moura
    Braganca

    Austria, Prussia and Russia divided all of their cavalry into distinct classifications such as Cuirassier, Dragoon, Hussar etc. and so can be assumed to have had no 'Regiments of Horse' as such. Note: also that whilst some of the British Horse regiments include the word Dragoon in their title, they were not classed as Dragoon Regiments these were a seperate and distinct group of regiments, which included such regiments as the Scots Greys.
    Last edited by Didz; July 21, 2010 at 02:50 PM.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Regiment of Horse - Port of Origin

    Wonderful list!! +rep

  5. #5

    Default Re: Regiment of Horse - Port of Origin

    I found a different list for British cavalry, late XVIIIth century - early XIXth, with distinctive colours and trimmings.

    Light Cavalry

    7th (Queen's Own) Regiment of (Light) Dragoons (Hussars) - white with silver trimming
    8th (The King's Royal Irish) Regiment of (Light) Dragoons (Hussars) - scarlet w. gold trimming
    9th Regiment of (Light) Dragoons - ?
    10th (The Prince of Wales Own Royal) Regiment of (Light) Dragoons (Hussars) - crimson/silver
    11th Regiment of (Light) Dragoons - buff/silver
    12th (The Prince of Wales) Regiment of (Light) Dragoons - yellow/silver
    13th Regiment of (Light) Dragoons - buff/gold
    14th (The Duchess of York's Own) Regiment of (Light) Dragoons - orange/silver
    15th (The King's) Regiment of (Light) Dragoons - scarlet/silver
    16th (The Queen's) Regiment of (Light) Dragoons - scarlet/silver

    Plus 9 Regiments of (Light) Dragoons numbered 17th to 25th of which only the 18th also carries the indication "(Hussars)". This indication results in a decision in 1811 to reequip four Light Dragoon regiments as Hussars.


    Heavy Cavalry

    1st Regiment of Life Guards - blue/gold
    2nd Regiment of Life Guards - blue/gold
    The Royal Regiment of Horse Guards (The Blues) - scarlet/gold
    1st (The King's) Regiment of Dragoon Guards - blue/gold
    2nd (The Queen's) Regiment of Dragoon Guards - black/silver
    3rd (The Prince of Wales's) Regiment of Dragoon Guards - white/gold
    4th (The Royal Irish) Regiment of Dragoon Guards - blue/silver
    5th (The Princess Charlotte of Wales's) Regiment of Dragoon Guards - green/gold
    6th Regiment of Dragoon Guards - white/silver
    7th (The Princess Royal's) Regiment of Dragoon Guards - black/gold
    1st (Royal) Regiment of Dragoons - blue/gold
    2nd (Royal North British) Regiment of Dragoons - blue/gold
    3rd (King's Own) Regiment of Dragoons - blue/gold
    4th (Queen's Own) Regiment of Dragoons - green/silver
    5th (Irish) Regiment of Dragoons (disbanded in 1799) - ?
    6th (Inniskilling) Regiment of Dragoons - yellow/silver

    All references taken from "L'Uniforme et les armes des soldats du Premier Empire" - Liliane et Fred Funcken, Casterman, 1968

  6. #6

    Default Re: Regiment of Horse - Port of Origin

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike in Montreal View Post
    I found a different list for British cavalry, late XVIIIth century - early XIXth, with distinctive colours and trimmings.
    Hamilton-Smith made a chart of the uniforms of the Light Dragoons in 1800, at which time there were 29 regiments in existence (on paper at least). In fact, there had been no official list of Light Dragoon regiments since the Royal Warrant of 1768 and a lot seems to have happened which went unrecorded in the meantime. Not least Sir George Yonge's activities.

    Hamilton-Smiths chart shows the regiments divided into the following groups.
    Red/Scarlet Facings - 8th, 15th, 16th and 25th
    White Fscings = 7th, 17th, 18th and 27th
    Yellow Facings = 10th, 19th, 20th, 23rd, 24th, 28th and 29th
    Pale Yellow Facings = 12th
    Buff Facings = 9th, 11th and 13th
    Orange Facings - 14th
    Blue Facings - 26th

    Breeches were white in all cases unless the facings were buff in which case the breeches were of the same colour. Dolman jackets were blue and frogged, and tarleton helmets were the normal headwear.

    The Peace of Amiens in 1802 gave the Duke of York the excuse to disband a number of paper regiments, including several of the Light Dragoons, resulting is a major number reshuffling.

    The 22nd, 23rd, 24th and 28th were struck off the list, and the 25th, 26th, 27th and 29th moved up the list to take their places becoming the 22nd, 23rd, 24th and 25th.

    In 1808, the facing colours were changed as follows:
    20th - Orange/yellow lace
    21st - Pink/yellow lace
    22nd - Pink/white lace
    23rd - Crimson/white lace
    24th - Light Grey/yellow lace
    25th - Light Grey/white lace

    The 7th, 10th, 15th and 18th had been re-equipped as Hussars. Basically by giving them a busby, and the light dragoons replaced the tarleton style headdress with a light dragoon shako and a jacket with broad lapels. These changes are itemised in an Order dated September 1811. Though there is some evidence of regiments ignoring the changes, particularly those assigned a facing colour of pink, which was not popular. The 21st for example retained their old facing colour until 1814, when they were given permission to use black instead.

    The 22nd were authorised to wear white at the same time, though they seem to have continued to wear pink for some time after this, and were then ordered to wear red in 1815, whereupon they promptly opted to start wearing white. (go figure)
    Last edited by Didz; September 10, 2010 at 04:47 AM.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Regiment of Horse - Port of Origin

    British Dragoon Royal North British (The Scots Greys) 1815 Campaign Dress as they would have appeared at Waterloo. Note the regulation grey cavalry overalls and shako cover.

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 


    The other Dragoon, Dragoon Guards, and Household Regiments would have been similarly attired but with different headresses and in the case of the Royal Horse Guards wearing a royal blue jacket rather than red. Most of these regiments never saw active service until Waterloo.

    The British Light Cavalry Uniform
    The British light cavalry uniform went through a period of major transition over the period from 1796-1815. There were three major changes, but historical evidence shows that these regiments were notorious for adopting their own affectations on the regulations, and of ignoring them completely when the mood took them.

    However, these images give a rough idea of what they ought to look like in the game.

    Light Cavalry Uniform 1796-1806 (essentially how they ought to appear in for most of the period covered by the game.)
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    Note: The Sergeant of the 13th LD is wearing more or less the regulation service dress for the Light Dragoons as stated in the clothing book. Except of course he shouldn't be, as his regiment had buff facings and so he ought to be wearing buff breeches.

    The trumpeter of the 15th LD is wearing the reverse coloured jacket worn by most musicians, but has opted for a mirliton hat instead of a tarleton helmet.

    The trooper of the 14th LD is wearing standard campaign service dress including the regulation overalls as shown on the Dragoon in the upper image. The colour of these overals did vary, from quite a pale grey, through dark grey, to an almost blue/blue grey. The image shows the latter shade. The only real difference between the overalls worn by the cavalry and the infantry was the leather protection on the insides of the leg, and the tendency for the cavalry to prefer the style that buttoned down the otherside seam.

    Other known affectations included:
    Officers of the 9th, 10th, 11th, 13th, 15th and 18th wore non-regulation blue breeches rather than white, and officers of the 9th preferred mirliton hats rather than helmets. The officers of the 10th and 13th are shown wearing stovepipe shako's. The officers of the 18th standard regulation Tarleton helmets.

    Light Cavalry Uniform Changes 1807-1812
    The 7th, 10th, 15th and 18th were renamed 'Hussars' and took on various affectations to go with their new elitist status

    The 7th adopted the mirliton hat.

    The 10th, 15th and 18th began wearing fur busby's, similar to French hussars. An officer of the 7th is also shown wearing a busby in 1808, but its made of brown fur rather than black. Troopers of the 15th are shown wearing stovepipe shakos in 1808 rather than busby's.

    The other regiments appear to have stuck with their 1796 uniforms at least until 1812. Though the 14th are shown wearing mirliton hats in 1808, as are the officers of the 16th. This would have been after the 1808 uniform changes below, showing that they were not immediatley adopted.

    In 1808, the facing colours of regiments 20-25 were changed but some of these regiments ignored the orders.

    A new French style shako was introduced, but not adopted until after the Peninsula Campaign and so only appeared on the battlefield of Waterloo. As did the simplified jacket with the coloured lapels and lack of frogging. So for all of the period covered by the game the uniform would have been in the style shown in the images above.

    Light Cavalry Unfirom changes 1813
    The French style light cavalry shako was more generally introduced in 1813, some five years after the order to start wearing it.

    The 10th Hussars began wearing it but in red rather than black, the 15th wore it in black, the 7th, 15th and 18th stuck with the busby. The 10th switched to the busby in 1814. The 15th changed to the shako in 1815. I get the impression this was just an attempt to be different. The pink facings only ever seem to have been worn by the 22nd, the 21st flatly refusing to adopt the new colour.

    By 1815 most regiments seem to have accepted the 1808 regulations and started wearing the new uniforms, so they made their first general appearance on campaign in 1815 and caused complete chaos. Mainly because the British light cavalry now looked like the French, as did the Dutch light cavalry and so many panic's and friendly fire incidents occurred. The main problem being the shako which looked exactly like the French cavalry shako when seen through smoke, mist or darkness.
    Last edited by Didz; September 10, 2010 at 06:33 AM.

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