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Thread: The Stainless Steel Names Overhaul Project (SSNOP)

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  1. #1
    PedroL's Avatar Citizen
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    Default Re: The Stainless Steel Names Overhaul Project (SSNOP)

    Quote Originally Posted by Black Knight View Post
    Concerning Portuguse names, here are the changes present in the file I submited, based on my own files.

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    First names added: Aires, Antão, Belchior, Brites, Cosme, Elvira, Fadrique, Gerónimo, Guterre, Inácio, Lopo, Maior (woman), Mécia, Mendo, Ouroana, Paio, Soeiro, Susana, Simão.
    Surnames added: Botelho, Cardoso, Carneiro, Guterres, de Abreu, de Aguiar, Távora, da Silveira, da Rocha, Peculiar, Pinheiro, Meireles, de Guimarães, de Vasconcelos.

    I removed André and Duarte from surnames, since having people named André André would be awkward. I did the same for Antão since I added it to first names.

    I also took the liberty of moving Dinis from surnames to first names where it should be.


    Now some changes I propose - I would welcome the opinions of the previous colaborators and anyone who is interested:

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Written language during the Middle Ages was very confuse, to say the least - more like and headache to anyone trying to make sense of it - so things naturally changed a lot in the written form throughout the continent; but even so, Portuguese has been subject to a remarkable number of changes. To ilustrate, just this past decade there was a major ortographical agreement. People's names have reflected this; for example, until the early 17th century surnames had a bigger resemblance to Catalan - with a -ez termination instead of -es (Nunes was Nunez, etc) or the double "l" being commomplace.

    I think the game should reflect this, if we aim at historical accuracy. Within a limit of course, since we have to take in consideration there wasn't a definite gramatical rule at the time (António is seen in the records as Amtonio, Amtonyo, Anthonio, Antonyo...); changing João to Joham would be to radical perhaps, but we could start by changing ortography which was in use at the time and only changed recently when some ground rules where already at place, like Manuel to Manoel or -is terminations to -es (eg Góis->Goes, Pais->Paes).

    Apart from that, we need to review the accents: "Nicoláu", "Pêro", "Téles" and "Éva" didn't have them, I'm quite sure.

    I see one of the contributors added "Vera", which is a name of Russian origin that was only introduced in the Portuguese language around the 19th century (don't confuse with the Latin "vera", which was part of some religious themed surnames like Vera Cruz). So that should go, I think. Also Magda wasn't in use, maybe as a "familiar" short for Magdalena, yes, but not officialy.

    I also think, though I'm not so sure, that Viriato was a 18th century revival, and Xavier was only introduced around the 1550s, after Francis Xavier.

    Here see this Link:

    http://www.s-gabriel.org/names/juliana/portuguese/
    Vencerei não só estes adversários mas quantos a meu Rei forem contrários

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  2. #2

  3. #3

    Default Re: The Stainless Steel Names Overhaul Project (SSNOP)

    I've been reading a bunch about the Kipchaks/Cumans, and as I was reading, I gathered a list of historical names. Of course, I don't know Kypchak or Turkish, so it might be best if some native person looked at these. But yeah, these could be added to the Cuman list.

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    CHARACTERS
    Abčyk
    Aboska
    Aeïa
    Alpra
    Aša
    Asen
    Akkubul
    Althabarz
    Arbuz
    Autlu
    Basti
    Bačman
    Balmaz
    Balta
    Baltuča
    Baramuk
    Baškord
    Bataragă
    Burči
    Berdebek
    Berendel
    Berindei
    Boklaw
    Boniac
    Borč
    Buzkan
    Čağir
    Carabă
    Carabăc
    Caraman
    Čekmen
    Čemgura
    Čerčy
    Čilbuk
    Čjurnaj
    Čonggur
    Čūnqūr
    Daniil
    Eldečyuk
    Gál
    Glěb
    Gorěn
    Imek
    Illan
    Itoğli
    Ituk
    Iurgi
    Izai
    János
    Kabak
    Kämänče
    Kamosa
    Karakoz
    Kalas
    Karas
    Kitan
    Kobjak
    Kolbaz
    Könčäk
    Könčeg
    Kopti
    Köten
    Kučegh
    Küldür
    Küntuwdi
    Mangush
    Monačük
    Mordar
    Ötrök
    Qačir-üküle
    Qištura
    Qubasar
    Qutlu
    Ratša
    Sakz
    Sangor
    Šaruqan
    Sevenč
    Seyhan
    Sïčğan
    Sokal
    Suğur
    Sütemir
    Syrčan
    Taštura
    Temir
    Tepremez
    Tjunrak
    Toğto
    Tolun
    Toman
    Totur
    Toqtämir
    Törtel
    Törtoyul
    Tošman
    Toqtaq
    Tugorkan
    Tūnqāq
    Urus
    Uzur
    Wezteg
    Yurgi
    Zeyhan


    SURNAME
    Arslan
    Basarab
    Bonjakovič
    Böňek
    Jur'evič
    Karlyevič
    Kokĕj
    Msticlavič
    Münyüzovič
    Osouloukovič
    Romanovič
    Satmazovič
    Svjatoslavič
    Šaruqan
    Sutoevič


    FEMALE
    Ayapa
    Aydua
    Karla
    Erzsébet
    Terken


    Quote Originally Posted by Fair Prince View Post
    Actually, the Cumans, Mongols and Timurids have indeed no surnames - there was only a handful available of them, so I thought it's better if they're completely omitted from the lists.
    As for surnames, they were patronymic for the most part. Which means that, as far as I can tell, you just stick on "vič" to the end of any first name. I'm not sure if getting names like Törtel Törtelovič would bother you, so I left out surnames that already had first name versions.
    Last edited by princeps.omnis; November 13, 2010 at 11:57 AM. Reason: Even more

  4. #4

    Default Re: The Stainless Steel Names Overhaul Project (SSNOP)

    Excellent list mate, a rep is yours immediately!

    Regarding the surnames I'm a bit doubtful in this case, as not only it's impossible to implement the patronymic name system in the game, but I also think that nomad characters are better with first names only, both for historical and gameplay reasons.

  5. #5
    Medkirtys's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: The Stainless Steel Names Overhaul Project (SSNOP)

    Here it is, just changed surnames, from iš to nuo, and added surname "Dzūkas"

  6. #6

    Default Re: The Stainless Steel Names Overhaul Project (SSNOP)

    @Black Knight
    I really appreciate your contribution, especially because you've volunteered to improve this mod.
    Regarding your proposed changes, if you feel they're needed, then feel free to put them in your list (it's yours, after all). I'll try to ask another Portuguese members about your suggestions, but I don't think they will disagree.
    Anyway, a big rep is already yours!

    @Medkirtys
    Thanks mate, a rep goes to you as well!

  7. #7
    Medkirtys's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: The Stainless Steel Names Overhaul Project (SSNOP)

    So, when the mod will hit it's 1.0 version? And beta, is it buggy? Any reason not to use it?

  8. #8

    Default Re: The Stainless Steel Names Overhaul Project (SSNOP)

    Quote Originally Posted by Medkirtys View Post
    So, when the mod will hit it's 1.0 version? And beta, is it buggy? Any reason not to use it?
    Yes, there are some bugs left in the Beta, all of which will be fixed in the Final release.
    There will be some new names added as well, and I'm also planning to use the dynasty names from my SSHCP mod to improve a bit on historical accuracy.
    Therefore, the new release won't be save-game compatible with the previous one.

  9. #9
    gracul's Avatar 404 Not Found
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    Default Re: The Stainless Steel Names Overhaul Project (SSNOP)

    Did I say, that im just dying to see the release of this ?
    This will surely make its way into further SS versions

  10. #10

    Default Re: The Stainless Steel Names Overhaul Project (SSNOP)

    Quote Originally Posted by gracul View Post
    Did I say, that im just dying to see the release of this ?
    This will surely make its way into further SS versions
    Well, you haven't said it yet, but thanks anyway!
    I'm pleased to read your words and will be more than happy if you decide to include this submod in SS.

    Btw, looks like I found another member from Sicily who is willing to help me with their names, therefore I'm glad to announce that the 1.0 Final version will already include Sicilian names for the faction.

  11. #11

    Default Re: The Stainless Steel Names Overhaul Project (SSNOP)

    Hey, Ive been just wondering, would it be somehow possible to include for the monarchs something like the First, the Second, etc.? To have kings names something like King Henry V the Chivalrous or something? Is it even possible to add numerical system?

  12. #12

    Default Re: The Stainless Steel Names Overhaul Project (SSNOP)

    Quote Originally Posted by khatmar View Post
    Hey, Ive been just wondering, would it be somehow possible to include for the monarchs something like the First, the Second, etc.? To have kings names something like King Henry V the Chivalrous or something? Is it even possible to add numerical system?
    Our Caesar is right, it's not really possible to do that.
    There has been attempts to attach numerals to the first names, but this choice can (and will) backfire later when newly spawned characters also get one of those names. Epithets could be used for numerals as well, but it would hardly make sense to be honest.

  13. #13
    Gnostiko's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: The Stainless Steel Names Overhaul Project (SSNOP)

    Quote Originally Posted by khatmar View Post
    Hey, Ive been just wondering, would it be somehow possible to include for the monarchs something like the First, the Second, etc.? To have kings names something like King Henry V the Chivalrous or something? Is it even possible to add numerical system?
    It's pointless to add regnal numbers anyway - historically they were rarely, if ever used by the monarchs themselves. Regnal numbers have only come into vogue relatively recently.

  14. #14
    Caesar Clivus's Avatar SS Forum Moderator
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    Default Re: The Stainless Steel Names Overhaul Project (SSNOP)

    No it's not unfortunately

    BftB2 UPDATED 22nd DECEMBER. Member of the Complete Byzantine Unit Roster team

  15. #15

    Default Re: The Stainless Steel Names Overhaul Project (SSNOP)

    Might be going over the top here, but here are some Cuman names that I passed over last time, and that weren't already in the list:

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    CHARACTER
    Anas
    Aq Köpek
    Beğlük
    Eltut
    Kokĕi
    Santuz
    Somogur
    Sugr
    Quba

    SURNAME
    Bilijukovič
    Mnjuzovič

    BYNAME
    of the Kolobič

  16. #16

    Default Re: The Stainless Steel Names Overhaul Project (SSNOP)

    @princeps.omnis
    Thanks again mate, I appreciate your contribution a lot! (+rep)

  17. #17

    Default Re: The Stainless Steel Names Overhaul Project (SSNOP)

    Good news fellas, now that I got some time for modding again I'll concentrate on finishing this submod.
    I plan to release the 1.0 Final version this week or the next (but surely before Christmas) - I'll let you know the exact date as soon as I can.

    Feedback on the Beta is still welcome!

  18. #18
    Caesar Clivus's Avatar SS Forum Moderator
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    Default Re: The Stainless Steel Names Overhaul Project (SSNOP)

    That's great FP. I'd love to integrate this into BftB2. Although I think I'm going to have to revert the Russian names back to latin characters only. I'm currently teaching myself Russian so the latin-cyrillic hybrid you've got confuses the hell out of me

    BftB2 UPDATED 22nd DECEMBER. Member of the Complete Byzantine Unit Roster team

  19. #19

    Default Re: The Stainless Steel Names Overhaul Project (SSNOP)

    Quote Originally Posted by Caesar Clivus View Post
    That's great FP. I'd love to integrate this into BftB2. Although I think I'm going to have to revert the Russian names back to latin characters only. I'm currently teaching myself Russian so the latin-cyrillic hybrid you've got confuses the hell out of me
    Thanks Caesar and no worries, I already have a solution to the Russian names in my mind: I'll include separate names.txt files in the mod, one with full Latin letters, one with semi-Cyrillic and also a full Cyrillic one.
    Considering that others have also complained about the hybrid solution, I think it would be better if I let the players choose their preferred version.

  20. #20
    Caesar Clivus's Avatar SS Forum Moderator
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    Default Re: The Stainless Steel Names Overhaul Project (SSNOP)

    Oh that's good to hear FP

    BftB2 UPDATED 22nd DECEMBER. Member of the Complete Byzantine Unit Roster team

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