Faction Split Proposal: Sultanate of Rûm and Great Seljuq Empire

[Ravenant]

I'm been thinking in this lately while making my submod. I write this here beacause I think it needs a serious discussion.
Looking at some maps, I notice there is very important difference between this two factions:

- The Sultanate of Rûm (Arab word for Rome) are the actual faction of the Seljuks. This sultanate was born in 1077: "Alp Arslan[...] authorized his Turcoman generals to carve their own principalities out of formerly Byzantine Anatolia, as atabegs loyal to him."

- The Great Seljuq Empire contained in that moment the actual Iran, Afganistan, Armenia, Georgia and It is not present in the mod.

Early Era Campaign can start at 1100 with the next changes:

- Ireland Slot -> Great Seljuq Empire
- Knights Templar -> Abbassid Caliphate
- Kingdom of Jerusalem present.
- Reduce to two provinces the Kwzarezmian empire

Two more muslim factions would prove a real menace to christians. Now they are not so.

[Lazy-Hamish]

The problem is a lot of people like playing as knight templar, so removing them would cause outcry. Also Ireland will become georgia that's definate in 6.3. But i agree there does need to be more muslim factions, but i don't think anyother countries should be removed for them, possibly norway?

You could do it in a submod though

[Ravenant]

The problem is a lot of people like playing as knight templar, so removing them would cause outcry. Also Ireland will become georgia that's definate in 6.3. But i agree there does need to be more muslim factions, but i don't think anyother countries should be removed for them, possibly norway?

You could do it in a submod though

Yes norway would be a good one. Anyway Jerusalem have almost all templar units, so you could use the Knights Templar slot as a muslim faction. Also It woulb be more historic.

[Fair Prince]

Ravenant, I support your idea.

I also pointed out in the SSHCP thread not long ago that if we want to model the Seljuks accurately in the game then they should be relocated in Iraq and Iran instead of Anatolia. Bringing in the Rúm would give the players another muslim faction (many want that), one that in fact played an important role in the region back then. What's more, they had a powerful leader at the time in the form of Kilij Arslan, it would be nice to see him in the game.

[Caesar Clivus]

As this would involve a submod, I'm moving this to the Submods forum

[Gorrrrrn]

Knights Templar and Ireland are removed from SS6.3 as factions.

Agree we need a seljuk / abbasid faction and should reduce khwarezm to 3 or 4 regions (any less and they're not viable.)

[Grouchio]

You could use models from broken crescent of the Great Seljuk Empire, then remodel them into having SS-like textures, etc.

[Ravenant]

You could use models from broken crescent of the Great Seljuk Empire, then remodel them into having SS-like textures, etc.

Or I can just use their model

[Fair Prince]

Or I can just use their model

That'll do it, they're Turks after all.
However, I'm not sure if the Norwegians should be sacrificed for them - they're required to maintain balance up north imo.
Removing another faction may be more appropiate, I guess.

[Grouchio]

Can this be for SS 6.1?

[Ravenant]

Can this be for SS 6.1?

I'm doing it for 6.2.4. I don't believe it will work for 6.1. Too much changes in the versions. But hey! You can try.

[borya1978]

I am all for creating these new factions, but I just love the knights templar, can we just get rid of Scotland or Portugal. or better yet maybe merge Jerusalem with Knights Templar and call it crusader states. I still say I love the Knight Templar one of my favorite factions in the game

[HolyDevil]

scotland maybe, but no way portugal, it has its history and it is backed up by it...

besides iberia wouldn't be so fun then, its war zone there ><

[Lazy-Hamish]

scotland is important as well, big historical importance in the british isles, i think norway or lithuania should go

[Czin]

scotland is important as well, big historical importance in the british isles, i think norway or lithuania should go

Then the poor Teutonic knights wouldn't have any pagans to fight, and the Cumans would be all by their lonesome, getting gangraped by the Turks, Kievans, Venetians, Novgorodians, and Mongols. (How the fookin' 'ell did the Venetians exactly get to the Crimean peninsula anyway?)

[Caesar Clivus]

(How the fookin' 'ell did the Venetians exactly get to the Crimean peninsula anyway?)

In the Late Era campaign, the Venetians start with the Crimea. For historical accuracy though, it should be Genoa who has it, not Venice.

And I realized that I've been parroting CC. Which shows his wisdom I suppose.

Great minds think alike. And fools never differ

[Ravenant]

In my early era sub-mod I did the next faction changes:

- Ireland --> The Great Selguq Empire
- Seljuks --> Sultanate of Rûm
- Knights Templar --> Principality of Antioch (same roster plus Knight of Antioch)
- Kwarezm --> Abbasid Calipahte


Now the life in middle eastern is more interesting... and brief
It's very difficult play as the Principality of Antioch or The Kingdom of Jerusalem (starting year: 1100AD. Both existed)
I think that Lithuania could become the Zyrid Emirate too (muslims of tunisia) ... but I like the rol of Lithuania in the east baltic area (as wall between Poland and Novgorod).

[napoleonic]

I say remove teutonic order, here's why :

1. the order founded to fight pagans
2. the trouble is, the only pagans on europe in the game is lithuania
3. lithuania is pretty weak and have great chances to be gangbanged and destroyed
4. lithuania gone = no pagans
5. what's the point of teutonic then?

yes we need another moeslem faction that actually can be aggressive and actually can conquer christendoms...

in my games, these moeslem as we have now couldn't even contain KoJ, let alone crusades, worse still, khwarez and turks fights each others...

btw, I think the cumans are somewhat weak, poor and pointless too, replace it with something more poweful please?

[Caesar Clivus]

1. the order founded to fight pagans

Actually they were founded in the middle east to fight in the Holy Land.

2. the trouble is, the only pagans on europe in the game is lithuania
3. lithuania is pretty weak and have great chances to be gangbanged and destroyed

I've often found them to prosper and kick the crud out of Poland and Novgorod. In one game I had them all the way to the Black Sea.

4. lithuania gone = no pagans
5. what's the point of teutonic then?

They also battled Poland and Novgorod.

[HolyDevil]

dont forget cumans are also pagan, just saying ><